Not long enough 

is this still going down? i havent played vintage in a while kinda interested.

Black Lotus - 135

Ancestral Recall - 46

Time Walk - 37

Mox Sapphire - 58

Mox Jet - 36

Mox Ruby - 33

Mox Pearl - 26

Mox Emerald -26

Time Twister - 7

Force of Will - 29

For those who own a set of power nine online or bought into vintage...if you could go back to the release of the moxen would you still buy in?

I dont know about best but a pretty ridiculous one In very old extended, in an important match with many spectators, my opponent and I both resolved sideboarded solitary confinements with no answer to the others persons. As well as both of us had the ability to pay for it forever but never deck ourselves.

MTGO still has its problems because they released an unfinished (pretty badly designed client). With that being said I enjoy the in game changes just dislike the windowing and lag. But to be honestly maybe 1 out of every 50-70 games for me bugs out but im cool with it because its a lot more fun than it is problematic. The cards will get debugged the memory leaks will be fixed and every week the client will get better. So far this week I haven't encountered any problems playing all three formats and limited. The client is has also been faster in the last two weeks. This is not an excuse but the previous client was more unplayable than this one and it tooks months of updates to bring it up to speed (once again they released it too early).

Is it fair to you to have to wait out till it gets better? nope.  For the most part gaming is going strong on MTGO but for those who can't handle the bugs it will get better so if these problems really do bother some of you like that I wouldn't sell your cards just take a break. The client will catch up with self and even if you dont like it in the future it also gives you the best chance of getting your cash back maybe even plus some.

If your willing to quit but hold onto your online cards show and tell and wasteland are the only ones I wouldnt hold.

Yea legends is literally one of the worst limited formats because it wasn't designed as one. Beta isnt that impressive either but the chance at opened BB duals and power makes up for it.

And if you open the box the packs are worth a lot less because the booster packs were designed badly then as well.

Its pretty impressive you've held the box for this long so I would just let it ride for even longer.

I'll be playing and bump.

Lets get this one to fire! we dont need that many people.  The people in charge of scheduling keep putting the premier 2 hours after a vintage daily, and the premier would probably fire if the daily didn't vacuum people 2 hours earlier.

So play in the premier at 830pm est and get people to skip the daily today at 630pm est.

I use the clock against people only if its game 3 and I know they will time out for sure because it was on the cusp of happening. Usually the opponent has put themselves in this scenario and its relevant if someone misclicks to potentially capitalize. Im NOT losing game one and making him play it out or making game 2 take forever in hopes of stalling out game 3. Sidenote the only time I have sympathy for someone who would have beat me and timed out is if we had similar time left on our clocks (would just scoop it up probably). If im up 5-10 minutes even if your winning i don't feel bad you timed out.

we have to organize and keep firing these events. Whether the demand is inflated or not because we are organizing the events this will help the stat trackers at wizards put more events on the books and maybe even fix the prize structure (its less than other premier events). It might even affect what promos are decided for each month and a vintage one might hit us down the road. It only behooves us. If you prove the demand a handful of times the effect will be them adding more events for months or a year and you wont have to rally the boards every time.

You should use the clock as a resource. And in the abstract I dont mind if the clock teaches eternal players a little hustle. I will admit that the clock inhibits some decks from being played online and should be factored into card choices (more so for non eternal formats). If everyone here is still consistantly playing months from now you'll be amazed at how the clock helped streamline how you play. If your mind can come to a tougher decision/play faster naturally the more time you dedicate to figuring something out benefits you. It multiples and your giving yourself extra clarity and levels of thinking because it comes more naturally. If you actually spend 5 minutes to think about something your maximizing the time.

Agreed. Just saying.

More like 17-18 but yea its still more

Add Ashok and AwfulAshok and ill do some digging later.  I guess your right older players have to trust the client to transition into it..but the old heads also have to remember the online version and the day to day operations are different and similar to what you have been experiencing this week. I think there will be growing pains on both sides getting used to the other. I also still maintain live on the fly decisions like this are vital to maintain magic online even if it unpopular.


Looking that those trading boards is a waste of time for the most part its people fishing for both buyers/sellers who are suckers. Minimum 10-15% markup on cards and even higher on cards worth less than 20 dollars. People use it punish traders who haven't learned other avenues of finding and getting rid of cards yet. I believe also most of the trades online happen without the message boards.

Nope I can still find you misdy for 70-75 and wasteland for 85-95. But they will be over 100 soon. People may pay more now but they aren't using the right vendors PM me if your looking Dixon.


Yea it sounds like it when you use words like moving a large amount of my "net worth"

I acknowledged that in my first post that Wizards messed up. I wasn't just talking bout money the other points I were trying to make were

1. Its impractical to make a gaming company always stick to their release schedule. The tournament structure and set releases are a live experiment thats always running and its planned in the long term. Live adjustments need to be made all the time.
2. Its a gaming company first collectibles company second and managing supply/demand and disseminating their cards is more important than protecting you from potential loss. Especially because magic online has so many card availability issues. Even if they contradict themselves. Id rather have the constant tinkering they believe is correct than be locked into things because having to guarantee everything.
3. Its ok for wizards to take the secondary market online into account but that shouldn't be the reason they make/dont make decisions that may need to be done. 
4. And you never answered why you didn't buy them when lotus was 130 and moxes were 55-70?
5. And most importantly the part you never responded too. There are many many more people happy the cards are coming back for a whole summer than they are ones upset about being shafted.  Your personal stake in the cards aside you have platform to be heard because TheManaDrain and the respect of other players. I feel like the mothership and our community associates you as a a vintage voice, and your complaining with an opinion in the minority very loudly and sadly they might hear you and think thats what everyone wants. And if you truly dont care about the money in this issue then it doesnt make sense why you wouldn't come to terms with this and respect that increased circulation is a good thing. It can double or even triple the amount of people who start playing in the next six months. Im not saying your doing it on purpose or you dont have the right to be upset. Although when you post openly on the mothership people dont read it as just your post and I think your using your podium to complain instead of helping your fellow gamers.

Z I'll drop AwfulAshok from the MD Clan and just keep Ashok. Please add the awful to the tmd one!

Invited -Z

@Rich many things could have changed that could killed the power overnight. I agree Wizards messed up on this one but its not their job to insure your purchase. Other decisions can be made by wizards or factors that they don't control that affects the format and dives the price of power online. Whether it was a announcement snafu or that was a cover this is not the first time a business especially a game company (including wizards) decided to extend their run of something sought after. The last couple of days might leave a bad taste in your mouth and other who share the same sentiment but you have to agree lower prices will just benefit the format in the future. Espcially when Hurkyls, Misdy, Show and Tell, Wasteland, and others are going to hit 100 tickets each soon. Even thought I got my set of power completely though drafting I still value it...but I dont care that the prices on it are going down %40 if it could add half a dozen people to the constructed events.

Even with faulty information I consider your purchase a panic buy one of the many that spiked the prices this week. Especially since you have expressed your distaste for the client. Black lotus was 130 dollars for a solid 1-2 weeks where were you then? If you were waiting on the prices to settle or you thought you had more time I dont have much sympathy.  I know wizards considers the secondary market in a lot of their decisions but I do not believe they are bound to always consider the secondary market when it comes to the online client  (because the card availability gets/needs to be repaired at larger rates then IRL).  Did this really burn you that bad as you described on the wizards site? How much could you have lost on a 1k purchase (but still have received some goods) that this did it for you.  Buying magic cards are always a gamble and you never have the best possible information (even if you think you do). I just feel as one of the true representatives of the format (along with Smenen and others) you should pick your battles so your opinion always has max impact and I dont think you should have contacted them on this one.  I also know you know that cheaper prices will benefit everyone and that you have an audience with people at wizards (because of the mana drain) and you used it to tell them you lost a couple hundred dollars. That seems selfish.

I hope you can get over this and the client and still attempt to play the format. Honestly I found most people love playing online and I hope you'll be around online.

  Well said Diopter

I will be there. This will be great.

I think a meandecker, Dixon, Folonius (if he goes), JACO, Shawn Griffiths, Joel, or GLACKIN will win the event.

Soly is only going to 0-2 if he doesn't drop after losing round one and tilting.  

People will do that for sure but not a lot. Online vendors maybe mass pack buying.

Honestly If the events stop it will be the legacy players and current people with vintage decks who still get prize packs in large amounts.

@JACO The limited events stop July 3rd. They said they are unsure if they are going to keep the limited format in the draft room (constructed is safe and will be here forever). They will be for sale until September in the store but without drafts and sealed people are going to open less packs. People might gamble for power but that would be the only way potentially.

If your going to draft anyway I wouldn't rush in to getting power. I would get cards not from the set #1 being wasteland and fetchlands.

And dont settle on zendikar fetches if they are cheaper and you only need to fetch blue because they will get reprinted this year and there will be a big gap between ols ones and zendikar ones. So might as well pay the extra now because in case you need a polluted delta or strand fetchability (stoneforge in legacy I guess?) in the future, and protect your investment.

I logged in since god knows when to verify this is true.

We did it! We have successfully copied and updated the European metagame from seven years ago.

Thanks to Mr. Detwiler and Paul I will be attending!

Im pretty psyched to fight!

I'd like to thank Ray for hosting a great event! It was trippy being in that hotel again for Waterbury

I had a lot of fun and it was great seeing the vintage players I used to play with, the NYC/Philly kids, and my fellow Meandeckers.

Watching James & Egan yesterday was hilarious and made my day....Jimmy is a god among men haha

I got 2nd playing this:

4 Duress
4 Thoughtseize

4 Ad Nauseum
4 Dark Ritual
3 Cabal Ritual
3 Tendrils of Agony
3 Chain of Vapor
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Imperial Seal
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Demonic Consultation
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Necropotence
1 Hurkyl's Recall

4 Chrome Mox
4 Polluted Delta
3 Underground Sea
2 Swamp
1 Island
1 Bayou
1 Tropical Island
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Jet
1 Lotus Petal
1 Mana Vault
1 Mana Crypt
1 Sol Ring

/Sideboard
4 Xantid Swarm
3 Dark Confidant
3 Yixlid Jailer
2 Hurkyl's Recall
2 Tormod's Crypt
1 Slaughter Pact

I'll be there! I hope I didn't forget how to play vintage in my three month break.

I will be there!

I can stay for another day if anyone else has room for me to crash (either at someone's place and I'll buy beer, bud, fun or a hotel and I'll throw down bills)

Joe you should just drop that person off an hour earlier and tell them to read a book or sleep. I did the same thing once dropping someone off at jfk than going to Philly (different order). It's doable as long as there isn't some kind of crazi long island traffic fuckup like a flipped over tanker or the cloverfield monster.

I'm back!

I'm not going to trash talk.....no bark all bite son.