TheManaDrain.com
September 13, 2025, 06:52:55 am *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News:
 
  Home Help Search Calendar Login Register  
  Show Posts
Pages: [1]
1  Eternal Formats / Eternal Article Discussion / Re: [Premium Article] So Many Insane Plays -- Understanding Dredge, By the Numbers on: June 16, 2009, 09:23:15 am

I'm also rather sad that there are a full 4 dread returns in the list, you only need to resolve one game 1 to cement a win, and games 2-3 they are often garbage since your yard is hated so much.  Whoever is using 4 dread returns, stop.  The freed up space will give you a stronger deck, 2 is enough.


I agree that 4 is a bit of an overkill. I feel comfortable with 3, but I am new to the deck and am having trouble winning game 2 and 3. Maybe 2 is enough.

Wiley, what is the gameplan after you board to try to hate out their hate. If you are not DR'ing anything how do you win? Just try to overload with tokens or hardcast nacros? This is where I am failing with the deck.
2  Eternal Formats / Ritual-Based Combo / Re: Ad Nauseam Tendrils: Good enough to take on Tezz? on: May 14, 2009, 02:05:56 pm
I'm using the Chain of Vapor - Repeal - H.Recall trio main and won't be changing that config any time soon.

Using the above premise, has anyone tested a singleton SDT, especially with maindeck Confidants?
I'm thinking it could be a good cantrip since most of the times we're producing lots of black mana anyway, making blue cantrips less appealing.

I actually use a lone Sensei's Top in my build as well. I like that it can nab cards you stack with the topdeck tutors (Mystical, Vampiric, Imperial) to use "right now". The library manipulation is nice too in topdeck mode or with fetchlands.

I currently use 2/1 on the Chrome Mox/ Mox Diamond. Neither are stellar in the early game unless you're resolving an Ad Nauseam usually. In theory you just need to draw one black source to combine with Ritual effects etc. off a succesful Ad Nauseam. I also only use 2 Cabal Rits and run the full set of Moxen to compliment the early Ad. Ponder also is in my list.

A SB card that I really run a singleton copy of and like to use in a matchup with few win conditions (like Tezz) is Bitter Ordeal. Combined with my 6 fetch and Lotus Petal/ B. Lotus it often has at least 1 copy to add to the stack if not 2. Then again I've always had an irrational love of some "bad" cards.

This is interesting as my only problem with this deck is that sometimes you run into lots of clusters of mana when your topdecking. I run into a lot of situations where I am doing "draw-go" without any action. Maybe adding sensei's top could combat this.

I was also thinking about using Lim Duls Vault which could technically filter a good part of your deck and get optimal results when you shoot off an ad naus. - Also great for imprinting on chrome mox
3  Eternal Formats / Ritual-Based Combo / Re: Ad Nauseam Tendrils: Good enough to take on Tezz? on: May 14, 2009, 08:10:44 am
Chrome mox pretty much is one of the main cards that makes this deck work.

Sometimes even in my opening hand I have used it to pull off a turn 1 ad naus or an duress or brainstorm. It is not that bad when you need the mana and when ad naus flips a chrome mox I am extatic because I know I have mana to work with.
4  Eternal Formats / Ritual-Based Combo / Re: Ad Nauseam Tendrils: Good enough to take on Tezz? on: May 13, 2009, 05:11:02 pm
Have anyone considered running bargain? It's more powerfull then ad nauseam and fills the same role....I'm thinking it would be played like the 5th ad nauseam or instead of the 4th. I've not tested this much, but it seems better then ad nauseam (although to be fair, i've won just about every game where nauseam has resolved)

/Zeus

This is an interesting point, but I think Bargain is wrong for this deck. There is a delicate balance of "bombs" that any deck can run and the upside of running "Draw X cards for X life" number 6 in this deck is not as good as the downside that you have a good chance of hitting it when you are drawing off Ad Nauseam.

I like everyone's suggestions so far and will be Tinkering with the decklist as I test it more.

I do think Pact Of Negation is a Red Herring and makes this deck in to a Goldfish deck that it simply cannot be in the current environment. Mystic Remora is a major reason that this deck can't run Pact Of Negation. Your Pact will not do much of anything for you against a resolved Remora. Thoughtseize can at least keep the standstill long enough for you to find Chain for the Remora.

I do like Xantid Swarm in the SB and agree that Academy should probably be cut, but how should the manabase look between MD and SB in that case? How many green sources MD and how many SB? (Academy is not useless in this deck as you'll often at least get to tap it for UU and often UUU and that can get you to 5 mana more quickly so you can cast Ad Nauseam in the first place.

I'm also curious to know what people think of Tinker/Robot plan from the SB. What would they come in for? Is Inkwell better than Sundering Titan for this deck?

1 MD Intuition might also be interesting to test with but I really don't see how I can fit it when I'm also running Confidants and keep the shell of the deck intact. Is dropping Confidant entirely an option?

The thing is guys, Confidant makes this deck play out a lot more like Stephens Grow deck that he played at Stratford on day 1 and Tarmogoyf from the SB really REALLY does. This deck can't try to do too many things well because otherwise it will do nothing well.

This is why I like Xantid Swarm. It supports the strategy of resolving Ad Nauseam and it is a house against Remora decks (one of this deck's weakest matchups if not THE weakest). I think Chains Of Mephistopholes could also be warranted from the SB but that is something I'll have to consider with regards to space. Confidant is a good choice but it is about as far as I'd go towards making this deck a "short burst" type of deck vs. a true "all-in combo" deck. The problem with short bursts against Drain decks featuring Vault/Key is that sometimes the "win small" approach will backfire when you give them the critical Time Walk they need to assemble the combo. Combo has gone from being a "win the turn before I die" type of deck to a "OMG I don't know if I have the gas to go off this turn so I'll do a mini-win and win later/ I'll wait a turn. Shit, one turn too late." Combo has no center or linearity to it any more and is beginning to die off and I think it is due to 5 factors:

1) No Brainstorm or Ponder
2) Faster Control Decks (Vault/Key)
3) Remora is first turn play and is better than its red counterpart: Pyrostatic Pillar
4) Combo is difficult to play so players play slow-play cards that are more easy to use like Confidant or Tarmogoyf to supplement (in actuality dilute) the gameplan.
5) Combo is difficult to play so players overcompensate by trying to make the deck "Goldfish" and thus ruin its ability to interact at different stages of the game. Combo should not = Turn 1 people.

I agree with what your saying. I personally do not like Confidants main deck, they have their advantages but I mean your not there to grab off Bob. Your main concern is to run out and bust an ad naus through whatever your opponent may be playing as soon as possible. Bob will give you card advantage but I do not think he is right MD. SB he can be a bomb when people don't expect you to have it.

I was actually thinking about throwing in Remora MD into this deck. I am not sure what I would take out for it but it might be worth a try, even though it sounds crazy Very Happy. I mean in theory it might work because it will slow anyone your playing down, you can usually get enough lands into play to keep it up for at least 2 or 3 turns. This could just buy you enough time to setup for an amazing ad naus. What do you guys think?
5  Eternal Formats / Ritual-Based Combo / Re: Ad Nauseam Tendrils: Good enough to take on Tezz? on: May 13, 2009, 02:27:06 pm
I think 4 thoughtsieze is wrong.  I'm pretty sure the correct number is 0.  Pact of negation is better here because it doesn't cost you life and doesn't ping you when it's revealed and you're just going to use it to protect yourself when going off anyway.  If ad nauseam resolves on your turn you're not goign to have another upkeep most likely.  Life is a binding variable in this deck so you need to carefully consider any card with a life total effect.  Thoughtsieze will cost you more games through life loss in the long run I think than it will win.

I wouldn't drop thoughtseize altogether. It is very important to know where your opponent is turn1, I rather have 8/60 chance of drawing that turn 1 "duress" effect than 4/60. This lets me know what they are playing and if I should worry about going all in or playing slowly to stabalize before I cast ad naus.

I have been playing with 4 duress and 3 or 4 thoughtseize and the life loss has never caused me much downside. Even if I drop to 13 or 12 life I can still almost pull off a lethal tendrils or at least a mini tendrils to get me ready for the next hit. You have to remember you dont ALWAYS have to hit for 20 with a tendrils, hitting for 10+ can put you at such an advantage your next one will be very easy.
6  Eternal Formats / Global Vintage Tournament Reports and Results / Re: Baazar of Moxen 3 - Quick Tournament report on: May 06, 2009, 11:49:17 am
If you add green, xantid swarm might be a better choice than the comes ino play tapped land. Xantid is a bomb against control.
Pages: [1]
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.029 seconds with 19 queries.