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1  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / Oath of Druids - Is it the New Goblin Welder? on: October 28, 2004, 07:07:04 am
If Oath becomes a popular deck, then 4CC will have to find space in its SB for Aura Fracture. Once 4CC forces it through... it's pretty much game for the oath player, plus cranial extraction is another great Board card vs Oath. :lol:
2  Eternal Formats / Creative / Planning a Sideboard for 4cc, but cant find any Flametongues on: October 22, 2004, 07:54:04 pm
With those two slots remaining... I would use 1 STP and 1 Cranial Extraction.
3  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / U/G Oath on: September 29, 2004, 11:13:20 am
I see the point of one Cogni, no problem there. having only one cog increases the probability of it being 20/20 or more.

I agree that it's painful if breath is in your hand, but isn't that what the brainstom + fetchland system is supposed to help you out with? The chances of an instant kill once the cog is oathed out is worth 1-2 Breath. 1-2 cards for 1 turn faster win is worth it, I believe. That one turn when Cogni is oathed out and still has summoning sickness, is still a window of opportunity for the opponent to do something nasty to your plans, no matter how well laid they may seem. A faster win simply means that there are less chances for the win to be disrupted.
4  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / U/G Oath on: September 29, 2004, 05:47:06 am
I believe Cognivore is a great choice! Especially if you add Dragon's Breath!
2 Might be good though in case the 1 meets with STP. With regards to the issue of tormods and REB than bring in DSC from the sideboard if you're expecting such boards. Good Luck!
5  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / [Singlecard-discussion] Forbidden Orchard on: September 26, 2004, 10:27:40 am
Drop of honey seems interesting for Oathchard but isn't it devoting too much for too specific needs? Fire/Ice and/or STP are more flexible solutions to the welder issue.  Battlefield Scrounger will only serve to slowing down the "killing process". Why not attempt to achieve earlier kills than try to use a "CONTROL" creature.  Since we're discussing Oathchard, what are possible ways to deal with the deck itself? What are its inherent weaknesses? What will be the reactionary type of hate vs. this decktype? (Whether control or combo-control variant)
6  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / [Singlecard-discussion] Forbidden Orchard on: September 24, 2004, 07:50:37 pm
Quote from: Covetous

Thanks for correcting me on the Oath/Dragon Breath interaction.  I was reading the card too literally.  I still wonder if it's necessary to run Dragon Breath--do you really need to win on that turn?  As a control deck, I would think that against most decks you could let the colossus wait a turn to do his face-smashing thing rather than wasting 1-3 maindeck slots for a card that does nothing by itself.  Cunning wish-->Berserk seems better because Wish by itself is useful (unlike Dragon Breath).  I guess I just tend to approach this deck as a control deck that wins using a combo (well, the combo win adds to the control aspect) rather than a deck that needs to win NOW.


I have playtested the old Cogni-breath in old extended when tinker-stax was prevalent. Bottomline is the extra turn does make a difference.  Back to Vintage, I do feel that the Oathchard deck slightly does deviate from a pure control deck and become more combo-control. The control aspect of the deck is now more devoted to protecting the combo. Cunning wish is good but sometimes when we're desiring a third turn kill, the wish might not reach. Speeding up kill clock is better for the deck because it leaves less opportunity for the opponent to do something nasty. I agree that Orchard does beef up the decktype a whole lot. Let us be open into seeing the decktype as something that can take full advantage of this evolution.
With regards to this infamous welder issue... I feel the deck can pack enough maindeck answers for maindeck welders. More anti-welder goodies can also be boarded in game 2 like damping matrix. Let's see your opponent weld that baby in for the DSC.  3-color  Oathchard is workable, just pick your poison, whether it be red or white...
I cannot wait to begin playtesting!
7  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / [Singlecard-discussion] Forbidden Orchard on: September 24, 2004, 10:48:05 am
@VGB: Thanks for the info.

So now that dragon's breath + either DSC or Cognivore is viable, Oath + Orchard becomes a potent kill set-up combo. True it may not be as fast as D4rGOn, but still decently fast nonetheless. Dragon's breath saves a turn which, in my view is a world of difference. It is now a possibly viable tier 2 combo deck. Hoorah for oath! :lol:
8  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / [Singlecard-discussion] Forbidden Orchard on: September 24, 2004, 09:59:04 am
Quote
[card]Oath of Druids[/card]

* Re: Dragon Breath

The player puts that card into play and all other cards revealed this way into his or her graveyard.

Both effects are simultaneous ("and"). It does work.

* Re: Dragon Breath + Gaea's Blessing

The active player controls both effects, hence he can stack them at will. It does work.


Are you sure about this? Doesn't the oracle referrence to simultaneously refer to cards being put into the graveyard simultaneuosly an therefore giving the controlling player the ability to put the cards in the graveyard in any order? Doesn't the putting a creature into play have to be resolved first based on the sequencing in the oracle description? Am very interested to clarify this... Thanks. Smile
9  Eternal Formats / Creative / [Deck] Simplified Stax for Post Gen-Con world on: September 15, 2004, 01:23:17 pm
What happend to the memory jar? In my personal experience, the jar's been quite useful. It's also re-usable through the tender loving care of the welders.
10  Vintage Community Discussion / General Community Discussion / Budget testing group on: September 01, 2004, 02:38:11 am
I'm interested to assist in brainstorming, discussing, whatever!
11  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / [deck] mono-green survival/crucible on: August 21, 2004, 08:08:45 pm
Why isn't the wonder in the maindeck? It's in UG madness builds...
12  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / The Man Show :The good, bad, and ugly on: July 24, 2004, 08:56:52 pm
First of all, congratulations on doing well with a "rogue" deck.  A lot of people do not appreciate the intricacies and subtleties in metagaming that this deck has brought.  I truly appreciate the aggro-artifacts damage clocks you employ in the deck. Overall, it is a very solid deck. There a good balance to the amount of presure the deck seems to be able to provide and the "metagame material" in it.
I find 2 welders to be interesting.  If they're there simply for some kind of resiliency for the deck then why, 2? Or any at all for that matter? They could be 2 other threats. :lol:   The only thing that is rather "off" for me in the deck is the burning wish. Perhaps it is because I did not personally playtest the deck, but I seem to be unable to fully appreciate its intended versatility as much as I should, I suppose.  
Again, well done.  It's good to see that there can a beacon of creativity that pierces through vintage's slowly shifting meta.  Very Happy
13  Eternal Formats / Creative / [T1]3c-Keeper with Oath-Engine in SB - please comment! on: June 29, 2004, 11:15:34 am
Have considered White as the third color? This gives you access to stp and funeral pyre. I must admit that black is quite tempting with all its broken cards and all, but blue can make up for the lack of tutoring with redundant library manipulation i.e. impulse etc. Stp is the best removal spell in the game and it deals with all those unwanted critters on the table.
If black really is your preference, then why not coffin purge in the sb instead of crypt? I don't really believe arc lab is the best sb for the mentioned decks.
Stifle is quite adequate to deal with draw 7 and tps etc. I noticed you dont run the full SoLoMoxen so why not consider null rod in the board? Nothing wrecks ravager decks like the old "Love Rod".

Just some thoughts...Cheers!
14  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / [T1]Keeper-Oath - what can I improve? on: May 26, 2004, 11:38:50 am
Manlands in the deck is a good idea, but the oath deck will no longer be able to sustain a lot of colors.  What colors do you recommend? (aside from UG of course). There's an oath-still thread in the budget forum for some reference if anyone's interested. i feel it needs a lot more work though.  I really believe in gaea's blessing in an oath deck. There's nothing better than renewable resources.  :lol:  How about the SB, any suggestions?
15  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / [T1]Keeper-Oath - what can I improve? on: May 26, 2004, 09:43:02 am
Wow great thread! Just to share some ideas out there, here is the current keeper-oath i am running, its gotten me 3 t8 finishes at a few tournies.

3 Wastelands - hate those manlands
1 strip mine - see above
4 Flooded strand - Gotta have that right secondary color
2 Polluted delta - See aBove
4 Tropical islands - Hmm, i think oath needs green to cast
4 Tundra
3 Volcanic - for my Sb (but am considering dumping this color)
2 Underground seas - Gotta Tutor for those answers!

4 Brainstorms - Great with all the reshuffle in the deck
4 oath of druids - I eat aggro decks for lunch! Very Happy
4 Force of Will - never leave home w/o 'em
4 Counterspells - don't own drains, otherwise would play pure keeper
2 Gaea's blessing - For that wonderful reshuffle!
1 Akroma - The BABE! Will race most aggro in my experience
1 Darksteel 11/11 Monster of a beatstick! - nuff said, 2 turn clock ( used to be morphling but he was too slow a clock)

2 Cunning Wish -  this is a keeper deck ain't it?
2 Iso Scepters - Shades from old iso-keeper builds, not bad
1 Balance - Hmm.. i'll be left with Akroma and you'll be left with what?
1 Enlghtened T - Gotta find those oaths
1 Ancestral recall - Duh!
1 mystical T - gotta find that ancestral!
1 Regrowth - gott regrow that ancestral!
1 Fact or fiction - Hey it's not bad!
1 Vampiric T - Gotta find whatever, too bad it hurts, (am thinking of moving it to the SB like other Keepers)
1 Demonic T- Gotta find whatever w/o the pain.   :lol:
1 Swords to plowshares - Best removal in the game (am thinking of adding 1 more MD)
1 Fire/Ice - FUN fun fun with the scepters. Will have to go though, if i dump red
1 Sol Ring - Great for times when i had to hard cast Akroma
1 Lotus petal - Gotta smoothen out that mana
1 Zuran Orb - sometimes i need a little time to out race aggro, i normally tutor for it right after i get the oath on the board when Life is low.

SB: (Haven't fixed it up after replacing maindeck morphling yet)

1 Swords to plowshares
1 Hurkyll's recall
1 Sphere of law
1 Heoroes' reunion - gotta love it when it's on a stick!
1 Blue E
1 Coffin purge
1 Stifle
1 Disenchant
2 Red E
2 Rack and Ruin
1 Woodripper - i used to lose to MUD, he's new
1 Ray of revelation
1 morphling

Here it is. Just thought i'd share my build.  Very Happy
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