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Eternal Formats / Eternal Article Discussion / Re: [Free Article] Oath 2: Electric Boogaloo
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on: May 13, 2010, 02:48:29 pm
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Like I told you, here is the last version of the build that i'm using : 1 Forest 1 Library of Alexandria 2 Island 2 Tropical Island 2 Underground Sea 4 Forbidden Orchard 4 Misty Rainforest 1 Inkwell Leviathan 1 Iona, Shield of Emeria 1 Terastodon 1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor 1 Tezzeret the Seeker 1 Black Lotus 1 Lotus Petal 1 Mana Crypt 1 Mox Emerald 1 Mox Jet 1 Mox Pearl 1 Mox Ruby 1 Mox Sapphire 1 Sol Ring 1 Time Vault 1 Voltaic Key 4 Oath of Druids 1 Ancestral Recall 1 Brainstorm 1 Gifts Ungiven 1 Lim-Dûl's Vault 1 Mystical Tutor 1 Rebuild 1 Vampiric Tutor 4 Force of Will 4 Mana Drain 1 Demonic Tutor 1 Ponder 1 Regrowth 1 Time Walk 1 Tinker 1 Yawgmoth's Will 3 See Beyond SB: 1 Extirpate SB: 1 Engineered Explosives SB: 1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn SB: 2 Pithing Needle SB: 2 Nature's Claim SB: 3 Duress SB: 4 Leyline of the Void SB: 1 Rebuild I can't resign myself to put the rebuild in SB, i'm really expecting a lot of MUD. A question I've got is about the Spell Pierce, I saw a lot of players playing them instead of Mana Drain, what do you think is better? more i test more i think i need something like 10 hardcounters in MD ... what do you think i can't put out to put something like 2 Spell Pierce? thanks  Awake. |
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Eternal Formats / Eternal Article Discussion / Re: [Free Article] Oath 2: Electric Boogaloo
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on: May 13, 2010, 10:27:41 am
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by the way, Gift Ungiven ... that's a card I'm hesitating to add to my build, it's actualy good with regrowth, but how do you play it? I mean can you give me exemples? (i never payed vintage, and never played this card, so i dunno if it's really good, i mean lots of players are running it, but getting 2 cards in hands and 2 in the grave, without beeing able to choose which one you wanna keep sounds a bit bad to me)
Gifts is absurd if you play it right. Consider Oath/Orchard/Demonic/Regrowth - it gets the whole Oath combo for you in one shot at EOT - and since have 4 mana available, you'll be able to play the whole thing as well regardless of the pile they give you. A pile of Key/Vault/Regrowth/YawgWin and sufficient mana auto assembles Key-Vault. There are any number of amazing things to do with this card- I use it in Storm decks where even piles like Sol Ring/Mana Crypt/Black Lotus/Dark Ritual can be game-winning (with YawgWin or a tutor in hand) - Gifts is highly skill intensive- feeling comfortable with your deck, what combinations of cards you might want at any given time, and how to put together piles of broken that give your oppoenent no MEANINGFUL choices are all important - I'd certainly consider it for any blue-based deck, and in Oath the fact that it can assemble both parts of both combos just seems too god to ignore. Hope that helps. oh yeah it's right, it's a really amazing card, I have to put it in my build xD ^^ thanks for your help mate it will takes time for me to master the deck and all the plays possible in it, but I really love this deck, so I'll take the time that I need to know the deck at 100% I'll post my new build lately in the day =) |
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Eternal Formats / Eternal Article Discussion / Re: [Free Article] Oath 2: Electric Boogaloo
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on: May 13, 2010, 08:58:24 am
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In regards to Imperial Seal:
It can certainly set up strong plays such as T1 Seal, T2 Oath/Orchard. It can find Ancestral, Will, Time Walk, or a piece of Vault/Key. At the basic level it is a tutor for any card in your deck, and as such it will advance the deck towards its goal. While I don't necessarily have a problem with the fact it loses a card, I do have a problem with it being sorcery speed. Knowing exactly what card you will need next turn can be problematic because your opponent has an entire turn to change the game state. Too many times I have cast the Seal and found that I tutored for a card that won't win the game because I lacked an entire turn's worth of information.
yes I aggre with what you say about it, but I have still the problem of knowing if I put it into my build, cause it's a great card, but with some negative points like you explained ... I really can't decide (cause for me the negative points are not that bad since I'm running 8 draw cards (jace, ancestral, BS, ponder, see beyond ...)) But if I don't put it in the deck, what do you think can take its place? Back when I wanted another topdeck tutor in Oath (and I don't right now), I used Lim-Dul's Vault. Its effect is similar to that of Imperial Seal, with these differences: + It's an instant. I think this is its biggest advantage, because it avoids the problem Rico mentioned. + It's blue. In a deck that's forced to run between 6-8 nonblue cards to support the Oath engine, it's important to have a healthy complement of blue cards to pitch to Force of Will. + It can set up more than just your next draw. More often than you might think, I've been able to put together whole combos with LDV by setting up Ancestral -> Tinker/Key or the like. Even outside of that ideal scenario, LDV at least gives you information on your next 4 followup draws, as well as what you won't be seeing anytime soon, because you put it on the bottom of your deck. + Merchant Scroll can find it. I think I only did this once or twice, but with LDV in your deck, Merchant Scroll can find Forbidden Orchard, Oath, or Will. It's a small point, but worth mentioning. - It usually costs more than 2 life. It's rare that this mattered for me, but if you're really unlucky and lose 7 life or more to LDV, I guess this could be significant. Since I typically use the card to set up an endgame combo, though, the life loss, even when it's big, has been pretty easy to ignore. - It's 2 mana versus 1. I don't think this matters very much, either. If you're in a position where you can't play a 2cc topdeck tutor, then you probably can't play whatever you want to be tutoring for either, with the possible exception of Ancestral in some circumstances. But I think topdeck tutoring for Ancestral is generally not a very strong play, and doesn't get the most mileage out of a tutor. Well that can be a very good alternative to imp seal i guess, of course I've got to test it, but it looks strong and yes, the loss of some life is something you have to do with, like you say it helps assembling an end game combo (not all the time, I know, but it helps you assembling any combo of the deck) so yes the life loss can be ignore. I go to try with 1 LDV instead of the imp seal. |
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Eternal Formats / Eternal Article Discussion / Re: [Free Article] Oath 2: Electric Boogaloo
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on: May 13, 2010, 07:27:06 am
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In regards to Imperial Seal:
It can certainly set up strong plays such as T1 Seal, T2 Oath/Orchard. It can find Ancestral, Will, Time Walk, or a piece of Vault/Key. At the basic level it is a tutor for any card in your deck, and as such it will advance the deck towards its goal. While I don't necessarily have a problem with the fact it loses a card, I do have a problem with it being sorcery speed. Knowing exactly what card you will need next turn can be problematic because your opponent has an entire turn to change the game state. Too many times I have cast the Seal and found that I tutored for a card that won't win the game because I lacked an entire turn's worth of information.
yes I aggre with what you say about it, but I have still the problem of knowing if I put it into my build, cause it's a great card, but with some negative points like you explained ... I really can't decide (cause for me the negative points are not that bad since I'm running 8 draw cards (jace, ancestral, BS, ponder, see beyond ...)) But if I don't put it in the deck, what do you think can take its place? |
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Eternal Formats / Eternal Article Discussion / Re: [Free Article] Oath 2: Electric Boogaloo
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on: May 13, 2010, 06:55:39 am
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Hey Guys, I'm a new player in vintage, but it's a format I would really like to try.
Anyway here is my contribution (list I'm now playing (in proxys ofc ^^)):
1 Flooded Strand
1 Forest
1 Library of Alexandria
2 Island
2 Tropical Island
2 Underground Sea
3 Polluted Delta
4 Forbidden Orchard
1 Inkwell Leviathan
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
1 Terastodon
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Tezzeret the Seeker
1 Black Lotus
1 Lotus Petal
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Sol Ring
1 Time Vault
1 Voltaic Key
4 Oath of Druids
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Brainstorm
1 Chain of Vapor
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Rebuild
1 Vampiric Tutor
4 Force of Will
4 Mana Drain
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Imperial Seal
1 Ponder
1 Time Walk
1 Tinker
1 Yawgmoth's Will
4 See Beyond
SB: 1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
SB: 2 Pithing Needle
SB: 2 Nature's Claim
SB: 3 Duress
SB: 1 Engineered Explosives
SB: 4 Leyline of the Void
SB: 1 Rebuild
SB: 1 Extirpate
I love the See Beyong play, more I try it more I love it; My SB could probably be better, this is not something i gave a lot of time to.
I was first playing an Iona's Oath, with a storm kill ... but I didn't like it, probably because it's too sensitive to ancestral recall or anything making us draw.
The creature choice has been made with the help of this topic, i really love the terastodon/Iona's play, and Inkwell is my target for tinker, I love this "shroud" that other tinker's targets don't have.
Can you help me make this build better, or say me what you think about it =)
Thanks,
Awake.
You really want to be playing at least 4 fetch. And if they’re not all misty rain forest, you don’t want to be running that forest. Chain of vapor might bite you in the ass Thirst for knowledge is better than see beyond because you can get +1 to ca, as wall as instant speed. So I’d cuz a see beyond for it. Top help’s you never get into some of the problems that see beyond fixes, as well as just making your draws really good. I’d go -1 see beyond + 1 sensei’s divining top Test out regrowth, its pretty good with time walk (or any restricted/broken card), I’ve seen it win a lot of games. I’d probably move rebuild to the side and stick this in there. If you add regrowth consider gifts ungiven. I general, I loves me some imp seal, but without a good draw engine, I’d cut it because of the -1 to CA and not instant speed thing. Yeah i didn't change the fetches since my last Oath's version, this is now done ^^ The reason why i'm running rebuild MD is that in my meta (belgium meta) there are quite a lot of MUD; now I admit it's maybe better in SB, i go to playtest it and see. thist for knowledge is great, the only problem i got with it, it's that you don't put a card back into your library, you put at least one (sometimes 2) in your graveyard ... but i'll give it a try too. by the way, Gift Ungiven ... that's a card I'm hesitating to add to my build, it's actualy good with regrowth, but how do you play it? I mean can you give me exemples? (i never payed vintage, and never played this card, so i dunno if it's really good, i mean lots of players are running it, but getting 2 cards in hands and 2 in the grave, without beeing able to choose which one you wanna keep sounds a bit bad to me) I really love imp seal since we are running some good draw engine like jace, see beyond, ponder, BS, ancestral recall ... even if the seal is not in instant, the few games i've been playing with were really good =D thanks for your advice oh and btw, sorry for my poor english, I'll try to improve it ^^ |
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Eternal Formats / Eternal Article Discussion / Re: [Free Article] Oath 2: Electric Boogaloo
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on: May 11, 2010, 10:52:21 am
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Hey Guys, I'm a new player in vintage, but it's a format I would really like to try.
Anyway here is my contribution (list I'm now playing (in proxys ofc ^^)):
1 Flooded Strand
1 Forest
1 Library of Alexandria
2 Island
2 Tropical Island
2 Underground Sea
3 Polluted Delta
4 Forbidden Orchard
1 Inkwell Leviathan
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
1 Terastodon
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Tezzeret the Seeker
1 Black Lotus
1 Lotus Petal
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Sol Ring
1 Time Vault
1 Voltaic Key
4 Oath of Druids
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Brainstorm
1 Chain of Vapor
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Rebuild
1 Vampiric Tutor
4 Force of Will
4 Mana Drain
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Imperial Seal
1 Ponder
1 Time Walk
1 Tinker
1 Yawgmoth's Will
4 See Beyond
SB: 1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
SB: 2 Pithing Needle
SB: 2 Nature's Claim
SB: 3 Duress
SB: 1 Engineered Explosives
SB: 4 Leyline of the Void
SB: 1 Rebuild
SB: 1 Extirpate
I love the See Beyong play, more I try it more I love it; My SB could probably be better, this is not something i gave a lot of time to.
I was first playing an Iona's Oath, with a storm kill ... but I didn't like it, probably because it's too sensitive to ancestral recall or anything making us draw.
The creature choice has been made with the help of this topic, i really love the terastodon/Iona's play, and Inkwell is my target for tinker, I love this "shroud" that other tinker's targets don't have.
Can you help me make this build better, or say me what you think about it =)
Thanks,
Awake.
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