Forgemaster builds are successful here in europe. Why shouldnt forgemaster be good in the american metagame right now? I dont see too much of a difference to the european metagame. I'd even say in europe, there are more null rods.

I found #7 was absolutely fine... =)

Looking forward to the next one!

Hi Rich

Very good report. I also play the almost same deck as you but often find myself having massive problems against MUD decks. Whats exactly your strategy? I used to play UBR Bob/Jace and it seemed to be much easier. With Gushstorm I play the same 7 hatecards as you. Do you have some tipps?

Thx in advance!

Hi Meadbert

Thanks for your post.

It's not that I want to protect a spellbomb. I obviously try to protect my leyline. The leylines aren't too random since I mulligan into them.

I run 4 Drains and 2 Mental Missteps.

Whats your take on Spellbomb vs. 2nd Yixlid Jailer?

I think the forces are needed to protect my leyline.

Do you guy's think a crypt-card like nihil spellbomb is needed? Against Yawg-Will the one spellbomb is just random, isn't it?. I
And isn't a second Jailer just better against dredge?

Hi Guly

I think you have a good mindset. I honestly still think that well built and well piloted fish-decks CAN make some serious impact. Keep playing the cards you like to play. Thats  what matters. I'd neither play a deck just because it's top 8 placements if I don't like it. It's a game where the player should enjoy the cards he plays. ... my 2cents.

btw: I believe the vintage community isn't too open minded and I alway's enjoy when someone brings something new to the table!

Wow, thank you all very much! I really have trouble with the understanding of this matchup. I almost never play against it outside of tournaments.

I still have some similar questions about crypt effects and the stack, just to be sure:
-If I activate my spellbomb after their bazzar activation in response to their Narcomoeba trigger, they don't enter the battlefield, do they?
-In their upkeep they put Ichorid on the stack. In order to prevent them to enter the battlefield, when do I have to activate my spellbomb?
-In response to the landfall trigger from Blood Ghast, can I activate the spellbomb so they don't hit the battlefield?
-If they sac a moeba for a cabal therapy, can I activate and sac my spellbomb in response to the bridge trigger... what exactly happens? Do the zombies hit the battlefield?


I also run two Mental Missteps in my maindeck. (playing UBR confidant control)

I currently board like this:

-3 Jace
-1 Vendilion Clique
-2 Hurkyl's Recall

+4 Leyline of the Void
+1 Yixlid Jailer
+1 Nihil Spellbomb

Does that seem acceptable?

I'm not sure if I should board in REB's to fight chain of vapor, Lightning Bolts or even Ingot Chewer.

Thanks in advance!

Hi all

I found myself having trouble with my dredge matchup. I always board in: 4 Leyline of the Void, 1 Yixlid Jailer, 1 Nihil Spellbomb.

One of my biggest problems is, that I don't really know when to fire off the Spellbomb.

I'd apprechiate it, if you guys could share your general strategies when you face experienced dredge player.

Thanks in advance!

Hi Stephen

I read your book and this is a very good addiction. I like your writing style.

My two decks I usually play at the moment are Bob Control or Gushstorm. I'd love to try your deck out, which is like a hybrid =). The only thing that I'm worried about: I don't think Predator is well positioned in my Metagame, since almost all Workshop decks here are based on Metalworkers and Steel Hellkites / Kuldotha Forgemaster. Which maindeck hatecards would you recommend against these decks?

Another question: You listed your sideboard plan in your article. In case that your control opponent plays bob's, I assume you board in the lightning bolts?

Thank you very much for your great articles.

Standard,... when do we see vintage?

How long till Top 8?

Keep the news up. What decks do these 5-0 guys play? Whats the metagame?

Very interesting. But I don't play the Cat's. I really think their weekness against other workshop decks is very bad. I play 4 Precursor's in the maindeck. Often they are a 1 turn clock. As for sideboarding in the mirror, nothing beats crucible's and duplicants. I know, duplicants are 6cc but they are so important!

Stephen - I'd like to hear your oppinion on #4 Sphere o. R. VS. #3 Null Rod. I found the 3rd Null Rod to be more important.

Hi Guys

Please don't blame me on my poor english. I guess you should be able to understand me nonetheless.

I want to let you know that I really LOVE your podcast. I always look forward to a new edition. I find it's a shame that only so few magic players actually play the amazing vintage format! For me at least, there's nothing like it. It's Magic at its best. The League of the elite . I can't explain how amazing it is how you dudes keep the format alive within the online community. I have a few things, that I'd love to hear you talk about in one of your upcoming episodes. I would be very happy, if you'd find a short moment in which you can discuss the following topic. I'd appreciate it very much. I hope you can find a bit of time to adress it.

-Do you think vintage magic will experience an upswing some day? If so, what do you think is needed in order to happen? Since Legacy is obviously on a noteworthy boom, the high demand on eternal cards push the prices for format staples like force of will, wasteland, duallands, fetchlands ... Do you think that hurts vintage, since its now even more expensive to enter type 1 if you never played it before and don't own these cards? OR on an other perspective, do you belive, the rediscovered love for the legacy format leads the players in a long term to use their (eternal-format) cardpool to enter vintage events? Because when a legacyplayer is able to proxy about 10 cards, he should be able to fix together a competitive vintagedeck quite quickly.

Also a very interesting topic would be, if you could adress the important strategies to beat certain decks. I often see usually good players just fail in their match against dredge because they don't know how to play against them and how to use the hate cards, which they have access to, effetively. I guess it would help lots of your listeners (including myself) since it's an issue that a ton of vintageplayers are struggeling with, since they can't playtest enough vintage in their local area.... especially not against experienced dredge-players.

Finaly I'd like to share my thought about your latest podcast about workshop decks. I have already piloted MUD in several events and I'd say that I understand the archetype quite well. I really think their 3 most important cards besides manasources are:
1. Tangle Wire (time walk for workshopers)
2. Lodestone Golem (i mean...you know, its the golem)
3. Chalice of the Void (shuts down moxen and hate)

And I totally agree that Phyrexian Revoker is just a HUGE upgrade to the deck. Personaly, I see two major MUD-strategies at the moment:
-Metalworker & 6cc drops (hellkite's etc.)
-Revoker's & Null Rod's

I had the pleasure to playtest both of the deckstrategies pretty excessively. I have to say that I think the deck with Revokers is favorable against control- and storm-decks while the one with Metalworkers is just way more powerfull against dredge and does obviously offer more insane second turns in general . In the mirror like 90% of the matches are decided in which player starts the game. Its not only beneficial, it's very important to have a Crucible Of Worlds and to have an active Metalworker OR (if youre playing with revoker) to shut the worker down with revoker or null rod. Theres nothing that hurts more than an active metalworker on the oppenent's side in the workshop mirror.

Best regards and thank you for your efforts with this AMAZING podcast! I hope you can adress my post.

Stephan

I'd even say Wire is way more powerful than Lodestone. Tangle Wire is the card that make players submit.

How many MUD's in the tournament? Not only 4 I assume? ^^

I also love Kiln Fiend and I assume its great in a control heavy metagame. Another interesting guy is "Storm Entity". But as far as I testet, Fiend is the best grow creature.

A few points on your list:
-I really dont think probe is an update. I'd much rather run 4 Duress & 4 Thoughtseize
-Gushdecks almost need 4 Preordains. I'd never cut them.
-My Fiend.deck is currently running 2 Lightning Bolts MD and 1 SB. I think I need them, especially if confidant sees alot of play. Fire/Ice may be good but I want to be able to kill Jace's and Lodestone / Precursor Golems.

I like the deck but I still have serious problems with MUD's. It's just the worst matchup if you play Gushdecks. Controllists with fewer basics and confidant's have alot easier games against our metalfriends

About your Sideboard:
-IMHO shattering spree and ancient grudge are far supperior to steel sabotage. Especially in a list, which wants a high spellcount!

Nice to see other people who like the Grow a Fiend idea.

Best,
Doggue

Word! I can just confirm what this man says ^^

Very interesting thanks! wow...all tutors out against MUD. And no bounce against Control / Gush seems very risky because of pithing needle. Sure you can still win with tezz's ultimate or tinker->bot, but it still seems risky. My playpartner is testing turbotezz builds very excessively. The downside of the Deck seems to be the drawengine. Sure its a combodeck and not a controldeck. Top is not bad but cant compare to the draw engine of competitive vintage control decks. But of course thats obviously. If you can't win within a few turns, the deck gets weaker every turn. But thats the naturalness of combodecks.

Thank you CHaPuZaS! I'm looking forward to it. =)

Thanks for your reply! Especially I'd love to know what he sided out against these decks. If you know, it would be great if you can post it. I'm currently testing a Turbotezz list and I'm not too sure about what to side out.

Thanks for posting. I wonder whats the exact SB-plan of the winnerdeck. Seems interesting. I'd like to know what he sided in and out against the certain decks. Any ideas or experience?

Well...it all depends on the deck youre faceing obviously.

In the mirrormatch the most important thing is metalworker and crucible. Metamorph (or sculpting steel) is very very nice too but not as important as for example crucible's. You have duplicants also. But dont get me wrong, Metamorph is VERY strong here! Against (noble)fish I liked it very much too but I'd much rather want a Hellkite or a Triskelion against them.

The matchup which finally brought me to the decision to run only 1 Metamorph and rather more creatures is the controlmatchup. I think I'm not wrong when I say that controldecks are decks which you will face often. You simply dont want a copy of confidants in your deck. Metamorph is good against the tinkertarget but its very likely that he has counterbackup. Its too late anyway by then most of the times. You have to have a lock, bring a critter through the forces and drains and win. You dont want to be the passive player here.

Please excuse my poor english, its not the best =)

BTW: Its very cool to share oppinions on our decks.

I tested the metamorph. I really dont like to say this but: There just arent enough slots in a Aggro-MUD build. You have to run at least 12 (aggro)Creatures + 4 Metalworkers. With only 10+4 (+ 3 Metamorph's) I often ended up with no creature and my lock just run out... Metamorph may have their place. But they dont replace the must have beaters.

Hi all

In the last 6 month i playtested the aggro MUD like following a religion. I have tested a lot of cards. My results:

I used to love sculpting steel so much when youre already dominate the game. But it doesnt solve problems exept the tinkertarget. But your steel just gets countered most of the times. I decided to run 16 Creatured with 19 Lands (only one of them beeing a city of traitors). Sculpting Steel got cut entirely. For mirror SB-Slots I much rather use Crucible's. Even now, whit the sculpting steel update: Phyrexian Metamorph I dont think its supperior to Crucibles against MUD and Fish.

As for the 6 drop: The only question I'm asking myself is how to split up the Triskelions and the Hellkites. 3 Hellkites 3 Triskelion or 4 Hellkite / 2 Triskelion. Our Metagame is totaly dominated by Controldecks and MUD's.
I tested the wurmcoil. I think in theory hes a lot better then he actually is. Hes a duplicant target, which Triskelion isnt. Triskelion also kills jace, confidant, metalworkers, welders, Trygon's, Kataki's.

What would you suggest for the Hellkite/Triskelion? 4/2? 3/3? Why?

 

So what do you guys think of this plan in a Draintendrills deck? I'm currently testing 2 Lightning Bolts instead of the Mountain.

+4 Ingot Chever
+1 Pithing Needle
+2 Lightning Bolt

-1 Thirst for Knowledge
-1 Merchant Scroll
-2 Repeal (0 left)
-2 Preordain (0 left)
-1 Dark Confidant

=2 Jace left in MD

Funny that you mentioned Preordain. I found it was very useful against MUD because it only costs one mana. Sure, Jace is very strong when he gets into play before he drops a creature. But that doesnt happen too often. Isnt a confidant better since he's searching for your massbounce and other hatecards?

Very fast reply, thank you Bisamratte =) His list is very very similar to mine. Does he run only 11 SB Cards? I would love to see the exact (in and outs) sideboardplan against the relevant decks. Thank you very much in advance. Could you also ask him, why he's playing Empty the Warrens over Tendrils?

Thanks for your input. I also play UBR-DT with 1 Hurkyls and 1 Rebuild main. At the time I'm a little bit unsure about my sideboard. You mentioned your teammate, what kind of sideboard does he play in DT and what does he prefer to side out against the certain matchups?

Interesting thread. My current sideboardplan in my UBR-Draintendrils against MUD is also +4 Ingot Chewer +1 Mountain +2 Pithing Needle. Im just not too sure about what I should board out. -1 Merchant Scroll -2 Repeal -1 Thirst -2 Jace -1 Dark Confidant (3 left MD). Does that sound good? What do you side out against MUD? And what do you think is more important against MUD: Jace or Dark Confidant?