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Vintage Community Discussion / General Community Discussion / Contering your own bad triggered effects with TS
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on: September 04, 2004, 11:52:51 pm
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I wonder whether another use of Time Stop might be to remove really serious "you lose" negative effects associated with otherwise decent cards that generate the triggers only once for low/no mana.
I am thinking of things such as not paying upkeep on a Illusions of Grandeur or an Oathed-up/reanimated lord of tresserhorm or phage the untouchable. After the TS-ended turn the Illusions is in the grave and the creatures are in play.
Are there other cards like these which might get stronger if there was a way around their drawback?
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Vintage Community Discussion / Casual Forum / Cheap & strong quasi-T1 storm deck
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on: August 28, 2004, 03:49:21 pm
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If you can get someone to play multiple necro, consult, and a couple mana artifacts (non power), then necro storm combo is pretty decent.
Try something like 4 of Necro, Ritual, Tendrils, Duress, Cabal Therapy, Shield Sphere 3 Consult, Spellbook, Chain of Vapor, Mox Diamond, Chrome Mox 1 vamp tutor, and demonic tutor, sol ring, Yawg Will, LED, Ivory Tower fill out with a few more 0 or 1cc spells and maybe a few B/U fake duals from Torment and any Underground Seas you've got.
If you can convince someone to let you play 4 Burning Wish too (or instead of the consults), you can cut some tendrils, put the will and a tendrils in the side, and make something pretty strong.
But even low budget mono black versions will have some game. Just pack SB Nausea to buy time vs. quick small critter decks like goblins or fish.
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Vintage Community Discussion / Casual Forum / Green/Black Stompy
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on: August 27, 2004, 10:30:37 pm
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I built a pretty good Green/Black stompy deck for powerless quasi-T1 called "One is all you need". It used: ESG's, Q. rangers, Rogue Elephants, Ogres and a few Dogs, 3 G.Growth, 4 Rancor, 4 Briar Shield, 1 berserk 3 Worb, 4 duress, 3 d.consult, and 3 CIRCLING VULTURES. I may have had a few paralyze in there too.
Not sure what I'd replace paralyze with since is weak when everyone else's spells are cheap too. Vendetta is proably too much life loss with the defecting critters (ogres and dogs). Maybe Sandstorm, Sicken or Drop of Honey. If you're worried about your critter count then maybe Festering Goblin or Taunting Elf.
The Vultures were really amazaing as long as you didn't have to cast them too early (and then one in hand can feed another and wild dogs can cycle). Usually the Vultures' drawback was irrelevant because your opponent would be dead or have removed it long before you run out of creatures in the grave. If they never dealt with your first wave, you should have won already. My wife beat me once with with a rancored and berserked Vulture for 10 in the air when I was just about to stabilize.
I think the format would make the Winter Orbs awful except as anti-cursed scroll/anti-manland measures, you might be able to get a similar effect with strip mines vs. a mana light opponent I suppose. Or if lots of folks play 4 Sol Ring and depend on them, then Oxidize could fill Orb's Role.
If you think mana denial is hopeless, So the Worbs should probably be Scavenger folk or Oxidize if you expect a lot of artifacts (or Lyrist/Emerald Charm for enchantments). This deck can't play scroll because of the rogue elephants and not wanting to play the long game.
Even without Land Grant the deck should be do-able with fetches, bayous, a few basics and B/G painlands. Losing the Elvish Spirit Guides is a much bigger deal. Dark Ritual doesn't help you cast anything important turn 1. You might be able to get some speed back with elves coming in free with concordant crossroads but you then lose out in critter quality.
Conversely, green/white stompy would get Icatian Javalineer, wax/wane, Plow, the 1cc critter tapper, and if you wanted them, Land Tax and the 1cc pro red and pro black guys. Much less exciting than swinging for 10 in the air though.
Man lands does inded sound like a good idea. I see something like:
4 Strip (why isn't this banned?) 4 Wasteland 4 Rishadan Port 4 Tabernacle at pendrell vale 4 Mishra's Factory 4 Blinkmoth Nexus 4 Treetop Village 4 Quicksand/ Maze of Ith/ Desert 4 Crop rotation (never so good as here) 4 Drop of Honey 4 Fastbond/Exploration 4 Sol Ring 4 Oxidize (for opposing Sol Rings) + Forests
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Vintage Community Discussion / Casual Forum / Looks like it'll be no-cap T1.5 highlander now
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on: August 17, 2004, 11:08:01 am
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I'm hearing that my legaue will likely ban the restricted cards and remove the salary cap limiting total deck price. The league also has a somewhat different restricted list that excludes mox diamond, chrome mox, mana crypt, mana vault, grim monolith, and Gush but includes survival of the fittest and recurring nightmare.
That removes the following cards I'd be remotely likely to use from consideration P9 Mind Twist Sol Ring, Iscochron Scepter Demonic, Vampiric, Mystical Tutor Yawg's Will Regrowth, Survival of the Fittest, Crop Rotation Strip Mine Stroke of Genius, Brain Geyser, Fact or Fiction, Tinker Replenish
So I've got the possibility of going more 5 color with one of each of dual lands and lots of fetch lands but most of the cheap and easy card drawing is gone.
I will be much more dependent on board sweepers or Squee recursion for card advantage.
Here are some possible replacements in decreasing quality Mana Drain Mana Crypt Grim Monolith Anvil of Bogarden (note that oracle wording means they still get an end step I can play instants in) Thirst For Knowledge Diabolic Servitude Wasteland Lim-Dul's Vault Oath of Druids (best with no other small critters besides Squee) Force of Will, Undermine, Misdirection The U/B talisman Concentrate (blue cards are ranked higher than they would otherwise) Read the Runes Last Rites (Mind Twist replacement for control matchups, fast mana helps) Scroll Rack with: Tithe, Fetches, maybe Mulch (no Land tax which needs basics) Compulsion Future Sight Bringer of the Blue Dawn Sylvan Library Null Brooch (SB card for control/combo)
(beyond here stuff gets pretty mediocre)
Sleight of Hand Serum Visions Gush Cunning Wish (to get stuff like Hurkyl's Recall, annul, blasts, countermagic, opportunity, sunder/upheaval from SB) Buried Alive (I'll probably dump Horror, so this is pretty weak) Hymn to Tourach (less good than Last Rites because of BB cost and no help in discarding big creatures?) Quirion Dryad (not enough card draw and non-green/artifacts to be good) Academy Rector (situational, could weaken oath of druids) Jalum Tome / Mental Discipline Roar of the Wurm, Call of the Herd Living Wish (to tutor for removal creatures and recover squee when it is removed from game) Long-Term Plans (works better with oath and draw/discard effects)
Most of the latter group are expensive, not instant, only situationally castble or good, and few of them are not blue to support FoW/MisD.
Did I miss anything or do you think I might have over or underrated anything for use in the deck?
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Vintage Community Discussion / Casual Forum / why reanimate is bad in highlander
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on: August 14, 2004, 02:25:51 pm
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Some mana accelation would be nice to go with the card drawing. But the card disadvantage of ritual is worth it only if you can consistently cast it early (and not always then). I'm also trying now to make the deck a bit more blue to support force of will and misdirection for free countermagic.
The 6-8 pt life loss from reanimate is only supportable main deck only if you can faily consitently cast it turn two to get a creature that totally disrupts your opponent's game (ex, Nishoba vs. beatdown or multani vs. control.
With only one entomb and limited tutor power (compared to 4x vampiric in old 1.x reanimator) that isn't going to happen. Early beats from some opponents will make casting reanimate leave you so low you can't win, if you have the life to cast it at all. Remember there's other pain in the deck too.
As for the other reanimate spells, they cost way too much to be able to cast them and protect with a counterspell. Maybe Diabolic Servitude is better than recur since it doesn't need acreature in play. but I'm not sure its better than having some other kind of spell entirely like another hard counterspell (such as undermine) to protect my guys once they hit the board, or slow down my opponent untill I can get fat on the board.
If you fill your deck up with fat and self-discard, so you don't have to use entomb to get fat to the grave, the deck will become wildiy inconsistent as well as be unable to disrupt the opponent.
SB-ed in Aagainst control which doesn't pressure your life total, then Reanimate might be okay. But Duress is probably better.
Plat. Angel is interesting (particularly if you can protect it with counters) but a big spirit linked critter is better against creature decks if you have no counter since you have the benefit of the added life even once the critter gets removed. Plat Angel has to stay in play to protect your life total.
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Vintage Community Discussion / Casual Forum / fine tuning a highlander deck (U/B reanimator)
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on: August 11, 2004, 12:22:56 am
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I’m trying to get the last few cards down on a Black/Blue re-animator deck I am working on for next season in a magic league I play in (D.C. area).
Anyway the format will be highlander duels, maximum allowed deck value around $250 with sideboard, excluding one “marquis� card. There’s no limit on the number of basic lands. That should explain the cheap dual-light mana base and lack of Mana Drain main and Chains of Meph SB.
The deck goldfishes pretty nice, seemingly being able to hold off creatures and combos long enough to drop a bomb, as well as punch through a couple big spells to beat control.
I was wondering if anyone here thinks there is anything seriously missing here.
Cards that use the grave Deep Analysis Skeletal Scrying Squee, Goblin Nabob Krovikan Horror (part of the discard Squee engine, gets trapped in grave sometimes) Yawgmoth’s Will (SLOW without fast mana, but recasting one ancestral or animate spell is OK)
Animate Dead Necromancy Dance of the Dead Stitch Together (Reanimate was too painful vs. fast aggro decks, threshold is easy) Exhume Recurring Nightmare (iffy, hard to use early, good late)
Creatures Psychatog Morphling (Maybe should be Rorix) Verdant Force Visara Phantom Nishoba (Maybe should be Rorix) Masticore
Cards that feed the grave Careful Study Fact or Fiction Intuition Forbid (maybe should be Last Rites, L.R. better early, Forbid later) Bazaar of Baghdad Zombie Infestation (helps feed Recur, nice with Squee/Horror) Entomb Sickening Dreams
More Draw, Removal, Disruption Ancestral Recall Impulse Brainstorm (was Vamp. Tutor, pain, limited early black mana, and card disadvantage hurt) Mystical Tutor (was Thirst for Knowledge, replaced to lower mana curve) Merchant Scroll (was better when I had bounce, but still gets draw/counters/careful study) Demonic Tutor Night’s Whisper (enchantment/sorceries interfering with my counters some, V.Tutor instead?)
Diabolic Edict (was Vendetta, but Vendetta or N’s Whisper had to go) Ghastly Demise Smother Strip Mine
Counterspell Mana Leak Memory Lapse Mind Twist Lighting Greaves (was Capsize, Boomerang, Chain of Vapor)
Mana Sol Ring 5 Island 6 Swamp Underground Sea U/B fetchland Underground River Undiscovered Paradise (this can be annoying to get early, U/B filter land maybe?) City of Brass Gemstone Mine Crosis’ Catacombs
I think the deck might have a little too much draw and might be short in other areas. But I want to keep the consistency and resilience to disruption it’s been showing.
For those about to suggest Isochron Scepter, the instant count is just a bit low, and forcing it higher would hurt card quality. Same for Force of Will and blue spells.
Anvil of Bogarden could set up reanimates and would net a card a turn with Squee for the low price of 2 colorless, but does it help opponents too much?
What sort of highlander decks do you think this deck might have problems with? I have reason to expect the field will include affinity, w/u control, mono-red land destruction, and a Recur/Survival type deck. Someone will probably try small-critter aggro.
Some SB cards I’m considering:
Affinity: Null Rod Hurkyl’s Recall Rebuild Annul Powder Keg (for artifact lands and 0cc stuff mainly, also removes t’s crypt)
Anti-Red: Blue Elem. Blast Hydroblast Chill
Anti-Rec/Sur (really just Rock with Survival/Squee and few off-color critters): Tormod’s Crypt Coffin Purge Sunder Wonder Hibernation/Perish (and Winter Orb)
Anti-enchantments/critter swarms: Nev’s Disk Engineered Explosives Wash Out
Anti-control: Duress Last Rites Winter Orb Symbiotic Wurm
Comments welcome on SB choices too. What do you think the toughest opponent will be?
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