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1  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / Re: It's time to have a Serious Discussion about Proxies Again on: August 22, 2005, 09:59:34 am
i had these exact same thoughts years ago when I ran the CT T1 tournaments that waterbury is modeled after in the late 90's..
then a lotus was 200-250 and moxes were 125-150..  and I thought "this stuff can't go up any higher"

and here we still sit today with 1000$ lotuses and 500$ moxes and 100$ mana drains...

you either want vintage to grow and stay a playable format for everyone or you are just too worried about keeping your investment in power cards..


My whole Gencon experience made me realize quite forcefully something quite important:

Vintage is completey inaccessible right now.  The prices are just astronomical on everything - not just power but basic staples.    People would be completely stupid to try to enter the format right now - esp say if you just recently got into magic and you are fascinated by Vintage.  There is no way in hell you can even get close to entering this format.  Something should be done about it.

Type one prices are a huge bubble.  The cards aren't going to move and they can't keep going up.  People WANT to play Vintage, but the barrier to play has never been higher. 
2  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / [Waterbury report] Mono Blue Chalice-Go to 24th on: January 19, 2005, 10:54:17 am
I think i got 24th.. may have been 25th or 26th though..

The misdirection will most likely become a shoal.. but in the testing I did for the last few monthes.. I replaced a morphling with DSC and never looked back. You never want more than one morphling, and should never be playing it if you can't defend it (ie make it untargetable).  

When I had two in the deck, I found myself using one as FOW fodder or not being as protective of them as i should have been bk i knew i had another..

as for the chalices..
the ONLY 1cc spells in the deck are the maindeck annuls and an ancestral/Mystical (tinker #2).  
Against combo, (storm) chalice for one is usually game.. but if I don't draw the chalices, annulling necro/bargain isnt shabby either...  and if i happen to draw the annuls with chalice for 1 out.. its force fodder.  
Most of the time, chalice came down for zero or 1.  I found 4 to be too many, and 3 just right.  Chalices also makes a great tinker target.

My maindeck chain of vapor is now a aether spellbomb (another tinker target, it cycles, and is non-color based bounce vs oath (pro-everything angels)).  

The Keiga spot (my 61st card) is being tested as Plat angel, as she's good against combo and oath and random stuff.

I'm sure this deck can be tweaked some more by others.. so Im in no way saying its supremely optimized.. but it worked well for me.
3  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / [Waterbury report] Mono Blue Chalice-Go to 24th on: January 19, 2005, 07:46:36 am
Keiga was thrown in at the last minute.. thinking it may be decent vs Oath if it were able to be oathed up or cast.. it probably should have been something better, perhaps plat angel.. that can be tinkered out, or cast off a mana drain and helps the deck vs Combo and Oath.

the thirst was brought in for an impulse a month or so ago after repeatedly drawing the DSColossus and not having a way to rid my hand of him other than having more than 7 cards in hand and discarding.  It digs just as much (1 card less) and with late game moxes or chalices, it never was bad.. and at worst was FOW fodder.

Misdirection was totally worth it and stays.. it won counter wars for me and drew me my opponents ancestrals numerous times.  It may become a shoal after BOK comes out though.

The morphling was priceless also.  what else can attack, then untap and block a Sundering Titan..?
4  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / [Waterbury report] Mono Blue Chalice-Go to 24th on: January 19, 2005, 12:17:30 am
The Background:
I started playing type one back in the early 90's down in CT.  Traveled to nyc for GrayMatter tournaments a ton.  Played with all the olde school New Yorkers when we were all just kids.. and even got cheater Jason Gordon kicked out of a tournament.

I began judging/running combined sanctioned T1/T2 tournaments in CT in Danbury from 95-98 or so with my friend Ron Kolbig (known as "roncon").  Eventually  I moved to Boston, type one slowly faded to black for a while and we stopped doing them.  I can't tell you how hard it is to watch alot of mediocre players win tournaments I judged back then.. Thank god Ray is doing these Waterbury tournaments now so I can finally play (as Boston doesn't have many T1 tournaments around unless you have a car)...

Onto Waterbury..
I had been testing Mono Blue with chalices for a few monthes now at YMG or whenever I could get a pickup game.. unfortunatly no playtest group yet to work with tho.  I debated moving to Oath, but it just didn't feel right although everyone and their brother on TMD said oath is a better version of mono blue.

I get my rental car at 9am in boston and fly down to CT with barely enough time to get there... but then i remember how late our old CT tournaments used to start and stop fretting about making the 11am starting time.

I get to Waterbury and see my old tournament cohort Ron Kolbig and his son Kent who is now a lawyer and in grad school.  I see a bunch of college kids that were 12 the last time I saw them playing magic.  I feel really really OLD.

Mykeatog tells me to run Arcane Labs over Control Magics in the side.. and I register the following deck:

4 Mana Drain
4 Force of Will
4 Ophidian
3 Annul
3 Impulse
3 Back to Basics
3 Chalice OTV
2 Powder Kegs
1 Morphling
1 Keiga Porn star (should have been plat angel or memnarch)
1 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Tinker
1 Darksteel Collosus
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk
1 Misdirection
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Chain of Vapor (should have been aether spellbomb)

7 island
5 blue fetches
7 SoLoMoxen
1 Strip Mine
1 Library of Alexandria
4 Wasteland

s/b
3 Arcane Lab (storm/combo)
2 Stupefying touch (welders) (jank, should have been hydro blasts)
3 Energy Flux (mws decks)
4 BEB (welders)
3 Chain of Vapor (oath, should have been aether spellbomb)

====

Round 1
Razvan ( Razvan on TMD) with Welder control

game 1-
I have no idea what he's playing and my hand is a little slow, so i drop an early chalice for 0.
he makes a play mistake playing a mox..  he eventually draws a welder, and i am not able to counter it..
he draws a darksteel citadel.. and welds in a titan.  I play my morphling and begin the race.. and draw into a sol ring so that I can attack and untap morphling with enough mana to pump superman on the back end to block Titan.

out-keiga,chain of vapor, mystical tutor,3 annul
in-4 BEB, 2 stupefying touch

game 2
i blast a few welders, he draws more.. i never draw much of anything and attempt to misdirect his ancestral and lose the force war.  he houses me.

game 3
I get a solid draw and he drops multiple moxes and a welder.  I topdeck a powder keg and play it.. he rack and ruins it and i keg away 3 moxes.  He has a welder and i believe taps out to tinker for titan eventually.  I draw a force and then tinker with force back up as i i'm confident a DSColosus will race his titan.  We play it out and he doesn't draw anything major to respond with and its over.

1-0  

my first t1 tournament in like 6 years.. off to a good start.. and everyone so far seems super nice and friendly to play (as opposed to the ptq/states/regionals scene which is full of rules lawyers).

---
Round 2
Justin (negator13 on TMD) with TPS

Game 1-
We chat a little bit and talk about what we played against first round.. he won't say, but i find out he played the mirror, which doesnt seem like too much fun.   I don't know what he's playing so it doesn't even phase me to keep a hand with saphire/island/drain/keg/ophid/b2b/wasteland...not even thinking that i should be muliganing into a force.
He plays 10 spells into a Desire and the desire fizzles with no kill or further draw, but he gets a walk in the 9th or so desire.  He drops bargain on the walk turn and i never see my turn 1.

out- keiga, 3 b2b, mystical, thirst
in- 3 chain of vapor, 3 arcane lab

Game 2
My game plan is to stop his card drawing (bargain/necro/etc..) and drop arcane labs
We both get slow draws.. I eventually play a arcane lab with force backup.. and lose the counter war.. but we both end up with one card in our hand, mine being an ophidian, which I play next turn.  I draw a ton of extra cards and I think i kill him with a morphling.

Game 3
I start off with a good hand holding an annul and a force.. with an impulse and another card to force with..  
he plays necro.. while i have 3 mana open.. i impulse to hopefully find a 2nd force but find the Lab, and annul the necro.
he tutors for im assuming Yawgwill, which he casts and i force. I drop a lab next turn with force backup.. and play 3 ophidians over the next few turns and draw an absurd amount of cards and counter a few card drawing spells he plays waiting for him to eventually play some sort of bounce on the lab.  I eventually tutor for tinker-> colossus and win.

2-0

Off to a great start.. and even in losing, both opponents are totally nice and friendly.. I like waterbury.

---
Round 3
Steven with IRM (mono red workshop)

Game 1.  
I believe this was the round that I sat down next to Mike Panas, who just happens to live in Boston also and we realize he goes to the college that I work at.  Small world

I show my lack of recent tournament experience by not aggresively muliganing yet again.  He plays a first turn workshop and lotus for a juggernaut and 2 welders.
I drop a mox and an island and say go the next few turns.. as I draw cards to stop anything else he could do.. but no gas of my own.. i throw an ophidan in front of his juggernaut and die in 5 turns

in - 3 energy fluxes, 4 beb
out - 3 b2b, mystical, keiga, thirst, chain of vapor

Game 2
He gets turn 2 workshop -> juggernaut, turn 3 juggernaut and REBs my counter.
I draw no gas and feel totally downtrodden as i just get run over.

2-1
way to beat down my confidence here..

---
Round 4
Scott with an affinity variant.

Game 1
Maindeck annuls wreck him.  he gets a ravager out.. but i get superman (morphling) with tons of mana and fly over him.

in - 3 energy flux
out - chain of vapor, mystical tutor, keiga

Game 2
I counter the first two ravagers he plays.  get two ophidians and start drawing 3 cards a turn into a full hand of counters.
I drop an energy flux and a few turns later tinker for colossus and he concedes.

3-1
perhaps I am ok at this magical card game


Round 5 and 6 are a bit of a blur..so I may have what my opponents played flip flopped..

----
Round 5
Dave with U/W scepter chant deck

Game1
We both play draw go for a while.. I annul a scepter and the go online with multiple ophidians and chain of vapor the creature he plays.
I draw multple cards a turn for a few turns and counter a few things  and drop a morphling.  He throws a few blockers out in front of the ophidians but superman wins it.

out 3 b2b
in 3 chain of vapors

Game 2
He plays meddling mage for chain of vapor
I tinker for colossus on turn 3 with force backup.
I feel like im playing a combo deck!
two turns later its done.

4-1

I get cocky here and think.. "hey, not much has changed since i used to play type 1 alot more"..  and say to myself.. if i can just avoid oath ill be all set.  
I go and watch Razvan beat a oath matchup where he has helm of possesion out with his a stolen platinum angel.  He had won the first game and the second is a draw.. meaning he won the match.. his opponent calls a judge, thinking that it should be a draw..  i guess its been a long day.

----
Round 6
Carl with, you guessed it, Oath.

Game 1
I know I win this one but my memory is getting sketchy here.
He gets an early orchard only draw with no oaths in site. I ancestral and play an ophid and drain his counter then force.
I play another ophidian and attack with his tokens he's given me and I know ive gotten lucky this game. I kill him with his 2/3 tokens he gave me and 2 ophids


out- 4 ophidians, thirst (thinking If i ever get to oath, i want something big up)
in 3 chain of vapors, 2 arcane labs

Game 2
I annul an early oath.  we play draw go for a bit.. Ive not playtested this matchup at all yet.. so Im learning as I go.
He intuitions and I dont have a counter.  he gets AK's.. and Ak's for 3.. then  AK's for 4.
He has a full hand and plays an orchard next turn  then oath and i attempt a lame attempt at a counter war that I lose.
He gives me a spirit token and I attack with it and I attempt to chain of vapor the token after I attack with it, which he counters.
He oaths up Akroma and I die 3 turns later

I bring back in the ophidians, and take out the arcane labs, and a mystical and something else.

Game 3
He gets a turn 2 oath.
I bounce the token after attacking.. not sure if i should have bounced the oath instead.. but i know he sided in the pro-everything angels so i cant bounce them.  
He creates another token and I draw a few counters.. but nothing to deal with the token or the angel he oaths up.
He gives me another token and doesnt block my spirits attacking.  he oaths up another angel (akroma i think) and i draw my next card and concede.

4-2

I may still be able to make top 16 as both of my losses are to players still in contention for top 16 so I play on.

---
Round 7
Jason with Landstill...

Game 1
We play an insanely long first game where I make multiple play mistakes (like putting a counter on my powder keg not realizing that he's playing landstill with a factory out.  he beats on  me with man lands and I make a play mistake and don't leave enough mana out to win a counter war over a crucible.  I eventually back to basics and stabilize for a bit but he keeps bringing back man lands with the crucible
i am very land light and cant play any creatures with counter backup and play draw go for many many turns.. he eventually draws multiple man lands and plows my ophidian and I lose.  20 minutes left in the round.

out -thirst, mystical
in- 2 chain of vapors

Game 2
I run out of the gates with a few moxes and waste his first 3 man lands.. he still draws more, but i play keiga which he has no answer to.  I counter his crucible and win this game with about 3 minutes left

Game 3
We both shuffle quickly and start playing.  Time is called and we go into our 5 turns after my second turn.
I have tinker in hand, and going for colossus is the only way I can win this one.  I tinker, he counters, I force, he forces. grrr.
Im pissed because we draw.. and I know im out of contention.  

I never even think of talking to my opponent about conceding until after i submit our slip . one of us would have a chance of making it in at 6-2 to top 16, but neither of us will at with a 5-2-1 record.
Oh well. ill think of it next time.


---
Round 8
Mike with FCG

Mike is honestly the first player I play all day that has that way too serious tournament demeanor.  It was painful to play him as everytime i did something, he sighed or tried to make me feel like i was just lucky and not good.  maybe he had a bad match prior or was just pissed that he was out of contention.. but regardless.. i was friendly and tried to chat him up.

Game 1
I keep somewhat of a good hand.. but annuls are useless against FCG and he plays turn 1 lackey into the chain of goblins and sets everything up.  He gets me down to 2 and  I eventually play a few ophidians and drain one of his 4 mana goblins. next turn I hardcast Colossus (with force backup) and the look on his face was priceless. I kill him over the next two turns with ophids back to block

out - keiga, 3 annul, 3x back to basics
in - 3 chain of vapors, 4 BEB

Game 2
He brings me down to 10 with piledrivers and their friends.  I draw multiple chains and bounce his warchiefs each time so im only taking 1 or 2 each time.  I topdeck tinker -> Colossus with drain backup.  He dies two turns later as I squish a piledriver or two.


We all hang out for a bit as Ray figures out the top 16 with some random issue of a top 16ers mom wanting them to go home.
I collect my packs and see that my opponents from the 1st and second rounds that I beat both place higher than I do, one of whom makes 3/4th (justin).  I totally dread the 2 hr drive back to Boston starting at 11pm, but I have to be back in Boston for sunday afternoon, so stayin in CT isn't in the cards for me.  a few redbulls later and Im home.

All in all a long day.. a ton of fun playing magical cards again.. with everyone I played being really rad and friendly outside of the last round.   I wonder if the Star City events are this fun... but somehow, i doubt it.  Perhaps I'll have to make the trip up to syracuse in February.. but sadly I'll miss Mykeatog's Vintage Evolution (BAAAAD WRESTLING NAME!!!) as I'll be on a sunny cruise ship in the caribbean as opposed to smelly convention center with unbathed magic players.
5  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / small world on: January 18, 2005, 09:02:40 pm
Razvan,
Its good to see that you ended up placing higher than I did (i was 25thish)...

no maindeck BEB's.. but in game 2/3 i brought 4 in and threw them at your welder's constantly.. i think its what kept me in game 3.

tinker -> DSC won many games for me that day..

both my first and second round opponents that I beat went on to place higher than i did.. grrrrr...

perhaps i'll see you up in syracuse
6  Eternal Formats / Global Vintage Tournament Reports and Results / congrats justin on: January 18, 2005, 09:01:19 pm
i was your round two opponent..

game one, I had no idea what you were playing so i didnt mulligan into a force as i had good opening hand if i ever had a turn...

you minds desired for 10 on your first turn and fizzle.. but pull a walk out of the desire.. and then bargain your second turn.. and i curse myself for not muliganing..

game 2/3 my plan was just to get a lab on the table or counter your card drawing.. which seemed to work.

game three.. i had the annul in my hand as well as a force.. but wanted to impulse for possibly another force (which got me the lab).  i was running 3 annuls main.  i probably could have killed you with the ophidians that game.. but was happy drawing 2/3 cards a turn.. you never would have gotten off truth/rushing river.. at least not late game.



congratulations for doing so well.. i ended up 25th or so at 5-2-1 (stupid draw with landstill... i should have won).. probably would have top 16'd if not.
7  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / [Deck] Edit: Mono Blue w/ varied CC for Shoals on: January 18, 2005, 04:54:59 pm
3xchalice, 2x powder keg worked wonders for me against the two slaver variants i played at waterbury..  and then post board i was running blasts (and would even be tempted to run hydroblasts)..

i tried out stupefying touch as a anti-welder tech.. but blasts seemed to work better.  another card i looked at was the blue magus from Ice age.. but havent gotten to test it yet.

im half tempted to run an aether spell bomb or two main deck as they can cycle.. and maybe plat angel as the 3rd creature.. as i can drain into her, or tinker her out.. (and the spellbombs act as another tinker target..

i cut control magics out of the side for 3 arcane labs

my two match losses were to Oath and IRM (mono red workshop).. both of which were more to my inexperience with the matchup than the deck itself...   i beat TPS (arcane lab), slaver (BEB), FCG (BEB) and a few other randoms (u/w, some ravager variant).. and drew with landstill (only because of a play error on my part..and again inexperience with the matchup)
8  Eternal Formats / Miscellaneous / mono-u on: January 18, 2005, 03:24:52 pm
I played a similar deck this past weekend at Waterbury to 24ish place..

maindeck AK's would have been horrible as every other deck with a blue base is running the intuition/Ak engine and you don't need to compete with that..

i was running 3 md chalice and 3 md annuls that worked wonderfully... I didnt face a deck all day that either of them were bad for.. and im glad i ran the annuls in place of leaks

i was running 1 md misdirection and used it 3/4 times mainly on either ancestrals or in counter wars to redirect counters on the stack.. its earned its keep.

i ran tinker/DSCollossus and only 1 morphling.. which worked fine for me all day.  bk of the main deck DSC i ran 3 impulse/1ThirstFK..

the only bad matchup i had all day really was oath.. mainly because id not played against it much and wasnt sure what to put in the board against it.. (i had 1 md bounce spell, and 3 s/b).. in hindsight i should've run waterfront bouncer or something..  i also s/b out the ophidians so if i was ever given the chance to oath, id oath into my morphling/DSC..

im sure the shoal will find it's way into this deck after this weekend..

im gonna try and post a tournie report tonight.. but see Razvan's waterbury report as I was his first round opp.
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