This tournament was a ton of fun and I strongly recommend people coming out for the next one. 

Me and GI an played Identical list of Bomberman and we both top8ed so it did its job.  I brutally lost to Bill the Duck's build of flash in the first round of top 8.  The new list played very well.  As for our changes I don't think I cast Intuition all day, but in theory it gets the combo just as well as gifts and can also let you tutor up a salvager or even a  force in a tight spot.  I found top good but only situationally, although all the targets of mage are.  This deck seems to have gotten much better with other drains disappearing from the format and would recommend it to anyone looking to pick up control.

Hi, my name's ElyasMachera and I was really hoping someone could put me in the Restricted Posting usergroup because the people who are in it must be lonely, and I figure I can entertain them with my hilarious internet hijinx!

Okay.  -DA

Just wondering, would sky hassur be an option also.  Sack hulk to go get guide and feeder, get hulk with guide and sac to go get kiki.  Copy guide to get hulk, sac and go get sky hussar.  Hussar untaps all your stuff make infinate hussar tokens with kiki and win.  I guess this isnt really better, but I already typed the post so here you go.

Ancient tomb also gets a lot better with Tomb.  If you need to get past your own void it casts everything and can also just tap for a black.

I find that Braids is almost always uncastable.  Is ritual a possiblity or have I just been having bad draws?

Harlequin: I noticed your list only has 20 permanent mana sources, but you are running lots of mana intensive spells aka Minds eye and Masticore.  Have you had trouble with other people playing chalice and waste?  Having played a lot of stax myself I feel like you control the mirror if you get a heratic online but that seems hard to do going through all the mana denial and your low count. 

On the same note, Eye has always been awful for me.  5 mana for a card that wont do anything untill your next turn is pretty bad.  Me and Ray(your round 5) have talked about Smoke Stack many times and thats only 4 mana.  This is 5 and offers no disruption.  Im not saying add stack, just look to other things.

Fish is another example where wish is usefull cause it grabs pryo or even massacer.  Trying to fit one in right be the right idea.  Still, im already having trouble with getting the deck down to 60 cards as it is.  So game 1 against fish might just have to take the hit. 

Just wanted to throw my 2 cents in here.  Scott knows the deck 100% better then I do so I'm not going to try and address any points. 
Cutting necro was a bad choice.  I can't deal with 61 card decks and which goldfishing, which was all I had a chance to do with this deck, Necro seemed out of place.  After running through the 7 rounds that I actually played in I understand the deck much better and would never cut it. 

The rebuild was my only piece of bounce in my games.  I don’t like chain cause it gets hit by chalice and only does 1 thing.  I would much rather take care of all the stax lock pieces then just 1. 

Running 1 kill condition main deck really only hurt me once, and that was due to a play mistake.  There is enough disruption that when i'm going off, I know that it is for the win.  A burning wish could be used though.  I wouldn’t run empty main just because I think the tendrils is enough and the wish would end up getting utility such as therapy, stupor, bounce etc most of the time. 

I really need some more time with the deck to give any useful analysis, but I will say it seemed more powerful then any gifts list i've played before. 

@ Scott:  Have you tried 3x dark rit and 1x cabal or even 4 and 1?  Seems good if your lotus is already in the grave.
Oh and thanks for the list

Thanks a lot guys.

@vroman
How I ended up at 3 bazaars was I asked myself if the first card I drew was that or recall which would I rather see.  Do you think I should have cut one of the artifacts for the 4th?  It was a really hard choice because I don't like diluting the lock piece count, and I'm interested to hear what you would have done (besides played mono-red). 


Oh, and I didn't play day two cause I celebrated a little too much that night.

@ Evenpence

1)The five color mana base of this deck really isn’t that much more unstable then the mono red version.  I run 8 sources compared to 6 and only have 8 colored cards compared to 4.  8 out of 60 means I should get one by my 8th card.  And the deck can easily run without one.  Also, 3 mountains with no fetches are just as scared of wasteland if you ignore color requirements.  I am only running 25 sources, but it worked so it’s either right or I got a little lucky.
As for null rod, I only play it when my mana base was developed enough to ignore it or it hurt my opponent more then me, so it never really screwed me out of my colors.


2) The 8 colored cards I included MD in my opinion are the most broken possible. Welders are self explanatory, but the other 4 are all cards I like to see no matter what.
Recall draws a ton of cards, tinker gets any card into play, balance wins games or is an amazing safety net and tutor gets everything.

Fastbond is broken if you have crucible and a strip effect.  Crop rotation is good if you have a crucible and can fix some hands, if you like 1-0 card disadvantage.  Both these cards can be very bad top decks and don’t win games by themselves.  Time walk goes both ways.  Sometimes it is going to win the game, and sometimes it will just do nothing.  I wanted to keep my colored cards at a minimum so it never made it in the deck, I don’t know if it’s the right choice or not.


3)Tinker and Titan are amazing.  I won a ton of games with this and welding titan in off bazaar is just mean.  Hardcasting it is not too hard either.  Of my 4 games that I won in the top 4, 3 of them were due to titan.  Of my wins all day It’s always titan or just a disruption lock.  The uba lock showed up maybe twice all day. 
Duplicate was a bit sub par, but I wasn’t playing against tinker colossus type decks.  Also at one point I was playing against dragon with a active bazaar and welder with dupe in my hand.  Its not my favorite card but I think its necessary.

4) See below, I think you are over valuing bazaar in the deck.  I love the card, I just don’t think you need 4 of them.


5)The sideboard worked very well for me all day

1x darkblast / Amazing against u/w fish and other people’s welders
1x duplicate / never got brought in
2x triskelion / brought in all day, sometimes with nullrod still in the deck (slaver)
2x rule of law / never really had a use for it as I didn’t play storm combo, but having something that cant be rebuilt is very key
2x ray of revelation / Every stax deck needs to have an answer to flux.  This is mine and it happens to be a bomb against oath and dragon
2x heretic / If this gets online in the mirror the game is over.  I also like to bring it in against slaver as it blows stuff up and fizzles welds
2x ensnaring bridge / Only saw play where it mattered once, but it kept two grunts away till they died in top 4.  Seems like a solid answer to fish but I need to test it more
3x Tromods crypt / This card is awesome, but two might be enough.
Room for a third heretic should be found.



@ SMac

Thanks a lot and congrats to you too on the Recall.  It was a really good last set of games.

The reason for 3 bazaars is simple.  Seeing one in my opening hand is only ok.  Seeing 2 is just awful.  Clearly having color land, welder, mox with turn 2 bazaar is awesome, but it doesn’t happen all that often.  I like seeing it later game after uba or welder has resolved.  Also, having bazaar in your opening hand is not like a mulligan in any way because it costs a turn.  For some people it is worse because they keep bad hands hoping to draw into what they need.  Uba without bazaar still has uses as it stops counters and stifle as well as being able to stop stuff like top decked Will with a welder out.

As for mana vault, I hate the card in stax.  Temporary mana in stax is awful, because 1 card is not going to win you the game.  The point of the deck is consistent threats.  I’m not saying the card is bad in stax, because it can do broken things; it just doesn’t fit how I view and play the deck.  Playing lotus is a stretch for me, but its way to good to not include.  Also, it’s just one more thing hit by my own null rods. 


@Scott_Limoges


Thanks a lot.  Its good to see your still playing, it really is some old school type 1.

Jeff Greene here.  Ill start off by saying thanks again to all my opponents, I had a blast playing all day.
As far as match by match you can thank my roommate for turning 21 on Friday and go look elsewhere, but I'll do my best to talk a bit about the deck.

My deck list and some card choices:
Mana / 25
4x City of Brass
4x Gemstone Mine
4x Workshop
3x Wasteland
1x Stripmine
1x Tolarian Academy

5x Moxen
1x Lotus
1x Sol ring
1x Mana Crypt

Creatures / 6
4x Welder
1x Duplicate
1x Sundering Titan

Disruption / 22
4x Smokestack
4x Crucible of Worlds
4x Chalice of the Void
3x Tangle Wire
3x Uba Mask
3x Null rod
1x Trinisphere

Broken / 7
1x Ancestral recall
1x Balance
1x Tinker
1x Demonic Tutor
3x Bazaar

SB / 15
1x Duplicate
1x Darkblast
2x Viashino Heretic
2x Rule of Law
2x Ray of Revelation
2x Triskelion
2x Ensnaring Bridge
3x Tormod's Crypt

Before this tournament I had been playing Intuition AK Gifts to a few of top 8's at stuff like Beanie Exchange and 1 piece of power, but after the meta shifted back towards fish I had been getting crushed.  At Waterbury I decided to play Stax as it was the deck I had the most experience with and got tooled on.  I didn’t play type 1 until about a week before this event and once again I decided to play stax.

I went with 5cc Uba because I love the welder bazaar engine esp. in tournaments around here where there are so many drains (although not as many as there used to be).  I played uba a while ago so I do have some experience with the deck, but it had been a while.

As far as 5cc these are the reasons:
1)Tinker
2)Balance
3)Recall
4)Tutor
5)The most busted card of all, Ray of Revelation

Playing 5cc just blows open the side board of this deck Rule of law and darkblast are great, and having an answer to energy flux is a MUST have for any stax deck IMHO.  The fact that its bomb against Oath and Dragon is just icing. 
As far as the deck itself I borrowed very heavily from Vroman's Gencon list.  I Fixed the mana base so i could support more colored cards, cut mana vault cause I think its  the worst mana source ever in stax, followed closely by lotus, and went from there.

I was not running null rod up until about 15 minutes before the tournament but was desperately trying to find room for it.  After talking with GI what ended up getting cut was Bazaar Uba and Wire #4.  This ended up working very well, but wire #4 would be nice to have.  I hate seeing those cards in multiples and null rod is just a bomb.  Playing 5cc with 25 mana sources and null rods is a bit on the edge, but obv it worked out for me this tournament.

I'm not going to insult my opponents by trying to remember what happened so:

My match ups were
1 Stax Mirror
1 Dragon (Got luckier in this match then pretty much any game of my life)
1 UR phid.... Ben, I got an opened pack of Cold Snap with your name written all over it
1 Bomberman
1 Slaver..  My loss in swiss and my top 8 opponent
1 Bomberman/Fish Deck that had me guessing even after game 3 was over
And a ton of fish

I never saw, oath, storm combo, gifts or hate.dec. 

So, feel free to ask me anything about the deck, but there’s nothing really groundbreaking here.

Oh and if is anyone wants a twister signed by mark poole instead of Mark Tedin, I got the hook up for you

Hey it’s Jeff, so I had replied in this thread and it was posted but now seems to have been deleted.  Not quite sure why but here we go with a shorter version.

Thanks to everyone for the show of support, even if the post was only a joke it still pissed me off to see it.

Everyone at the tournament was awesome and all my opponents were some of the best people I've played against in a while.

Special thanks to the dragon player for not caving my head in after my game 4 (1 draw) Workshop 3Sphere go on the play.

This win was just a friendly reminder that there are a few remnants of Hadley still out there....

Ok once again the staff kill for everyone who does not undersand it:

Combo off with the Cog pieces, NOT the staff.

1st make a ton of guys play walk and attack GG

If walk gets countered then play staff, welder, greaves and trike.  Ping twice, and kill trike, attach greves to welder, weld trike in for mox, ping 3 times, use staff to untap welder, weld out trike, use staff to untap welder, weld in trike, ping. GG

If walk and one of the staff kill pices gets countered cast retriver and get piece back and play it.  If welder gets countered cast one of your other 3.  GG

Metal work is NOT involved with the kill.  There is no need to have the artifacts in your hand.  Worker was already in the deck and just happens to have insane sinergy with staff.

For the last time the kill is NOT a turn slower, it happens the turn you combo off just like bauble.

i had a good reply but it got deleted so ill just throw down the main points.

1)  Staff is the focus the way bauble was as in not at all.  I guess if they extract with staff you only have walk and twister but im willing to take that chance.

2) After going off, they stop you when staff is the kill by having counters for 1 time walk, 4x welders and then Timetwister and having the mana to counter them all...

3)The difference bewteen 58 and 60 is small esp since there is a mana investment so its not really 58.  Also the win is from a 4 of and a 1 of  that you can tutor up very easilly, not 2 random one of's.  The combo is worker and staff to draw whole deck.

4)Having a way to race faster combo is good.

5)I understand that the decks goal is to play lots of small threats that eventually just kill, that ability is there and just as strong but with added flexablity that lets you win games you shouldnt.  If the deck just always wins for you then OK but in the same way TPS runs Darksteel this deck can be given much greater flexablily with little to no damage to its combo plan. 


Every time i draw buable in my opening hand or mid game its just bad or it cycles.  After going off it does the same thing that any of the other kills talked about does. 

Drawing Staff opening or mid either is a instant kill or is a card that can be utility, or a card drawing engine. Staff is dead only if you have very limited mana which is a problem with this deck but bauble doesnt stop the waste from blowing up your workshops.  After going off it does the same that any of the other kills talked about does. 

Drawing Trike opening or mid is either a way to deal with welders or Shamens (which are a bigger threat then welders )etc or is a dead card(the way having a 4/4 with ping ability is ever dead).  It doest do anything for the combo but does drawing 1 extra card do that much either?

6)Staff is not the focus of the deck in anyway.  Yes this is the same as #1 but you keep saying that its changing the focus and the reason your build is better is cause of the redundency.  With staff there is just as much redundency.  Its a 2-3 card change in the list.  All the important pieces are still there in the same numbers. 

Right, and you can get staff back as well.  So both set ups can win through a lot of counters..... we have already established that.  Also, there no deck is going to have more then 2 or 3 at the most so its kind of a moot point. 

Ok, im not going to bring this up anymore cause like you said this is your thread, but I think you’re missing the point of what I'm talking about.


The thing is you just didn’t read my post or my point just went right over your head.  The deck is still the same.  The combo is the cog and it sets up the same way.  Get all the pieces and then win.  The difference is that instead of going off, playing walk having it countered and then baubling it you just play staff after the walk is played and win that way. 

The entire point of my post is that have great utility like trike and staff and possible random wins with tutoring out staff is better then having bauble and sphere.  A one of mana fixer isn’t really going to add consistency and bauble is really just ok at recurring stuff. 



Ok, so maybe staff and darksteel was a bit of a reach, but not by far.  Also, I don’t understand when you say the deck builds cards advantage and then wins followed by saying you don’t care about taking 11 to the head a turn.  Those things just don’t make sense together.  And finally, if you could explain how taping a welder is going to stop them from setting up an infinite slave lock that would be great.

I'm not going to try and claim to be better with the deck then you, but it feels like you think I’m suggesting changing the focus of the deck and I'm not.  All im saying is tweak 2 cards to add utility and brokeness without loosing the real strength of the deck.

1st off you dont have a one card kill, you stated that C. sphere was there cuase you needed to cast walk and twister which is the kill so that means bauble and sphere is the kill. 

About staff vs bauble:  In your summation i think you prove yourself wrong.  Staff is a must counter, bauble creates 1 more must counter so the threat count is the same.  As for the second card, trike, it replaces a card that is only there because of the bauble. 
Granted neither of the cards are cantrips, but Bouble and Sphere dont EVER say tinker/ tutor me out now and just win.  Also, worker/staff is just one more combanation of cards that can make you win but theres only 2 pieces as opposed to 5.

 If mana issues are really that big a problem for the deck then stay with the bauble/spherefor the 1 exrta card, but killing welders and tapping darksteel Colls seems much stronger.

combo off with staff.  Play trike, welder and greaves your welder.  Ping opp twice and trike once.  Weld trike in for a mox.  Ping them 3 times.  use staff to untap welder.  Weld trike out for mox.  use staff to untap welder.  Weld trike in for mox.  ping 3 times.  Repeat.

Its the same kill speed as stroke, is usefull on its own and if you hand is mox mox trike with metal worker and staff out on board you win where as mox mox stroke is not a win.

Trike is much better then stroke.  Just get your whole deck in your hand and play it, a welder and greaves or time walk - GG.  Also, Trike is a lot better then stroke in this deck as there are workshops and metal workers.  This also lets you cut Chromatic Spheres, add a 4th chamber and other good stuff you cut.  With this set up you can combo off with both the Retrievers/ironworks/chamber or worker/staff and having trike is never a bad thing in a deck that uses welders against a field of stax and slaver.

You can win now with or without the staff combo added, but I think it makes the deck much more versatile with the inclusion of 3 cards which are all pretty good on there own (staff, greaves and trike) and lets you drop cards that are not (Conjurer's Bauble, C. Sphere).

EDIT: Oh ya, and the talisman should prob become darksteel ignot with this set up.

ya your right, Thanks

This list was posted from origins:   Does anyone know what the 2 jens main deck are?

4 workshop
4 bazaar
4 waste
5 mountain
1 strip
1 academy
1 riftstone portal
5 mox
4 lotus/ring/crypt/vault
4 uba mask
4 chalice
4 smoky
3 crucible
3 null rod
1 trinisphere
4 welder
2 jens
2 duplicant
1 s-titan
1 karn
1 moxmonky
1 wheel fortune

side
4 lava dart
3 orb dreams
3 v-heretic
2 duplicant
2 mith
1 n-rod

This tournament was a lot of fun and run well after the initial mess up, but with that attendance Prize support should have increased a lot.  750 dollars just from the entry fees and only about 350 in prizes, if your generous on the price of the mox due to condition. 

You wanted him to scoop because you had an arcane lab in play and time was running out when he was up 1-0 in games?  God, someone please lock this thread.

EDIT:  Ok, I need to explain my self more then this.  You said it yourself, this is competitive type 1.  The nature of the game is that there has to be time limits put on rounds and there are certain strategy's that come with this.  Neither of you had a win condition left, so you chose to use the decking rule to try and win while he choose to use the time constraint rule to force and draw and there fore win. 
You wanted him to scoop after you shut down his decks win condition, but then why didn't you scoop after he took all of your decks win conditions?
If he was stalling then call a judge, but stop bitching and flaming because you lost 1 game.

First off, i played stax up untill the restrictions and havent really played much since and sensi is combo the way tog was, which is not really. 

The real point of this is that you should have tried to play as fast as possibe and he should have tried to play as slow as possible, with out stalling. 

Also, the fact that he capped all your stuff does make a diff and should have been in the original post.  If you thought there was a problem you should have called a judge, but he was doing exactly what any tournment player should do in that situation. 

So what you failed to mention is that he had Jester Capped away all your decks win conditions (I know this kid).  So the only way for him to win was playing slow, and for you it was playing fast.  I fail to see how this is that big a deal.  You were both in no real position to win.  Also, the time frame you gave is off according to him, but thats really doesnt matter.

I can't help but feel like these were the two things not to do to the format.  3Sphere wasn't dominant, just annoying and there are more then enough tutors in the card pool.  

The format was balanced with room for innovation as show by starcity.  
Oh well, glad I picked up those foil 3Spheres this month.....

I've been tooling around with this deck for a while and this is my current list.  


Creatures - 18
12 kobold
3 tinder wall
3 elvish spirit guide

Draw - 11
4 skullclamp
3 glimpse of nature
1 ancestral recall
1 timetwister
1 wheel of fortune
1 windfall

Other stuff - 11
2 tendrils of agony
1 Yag Will
1 Necropotence
1 demonic tutor
1 vampiric tutor
1 rebuild
1 crop rotation
3 cabal therapy

Mana - 20
4 forbidden orchard
1 city of brass
1 tolarian academy
8 solocrypten
1 lotus petal
4 dark ritual
1 mana vault


Card choice
winfall -  this slot is one of the open ones in the deck.  I have windfall as it serves as an early draw 7 and a late game way to dump your hand if it fills up with unless cards from claming etc.  

Tinder wall - this is a great creature to go off with.  Its a net cost of 0 to draw 2 with clamp, but it does cost a green so there are only 3.

rebuild - 3sphere and platinum angel exist.

cabal therapy - a lot of builds seem to run no disruption which cant be done in a combo deck(what numbers has belcher put up?).  This also has the ability to just rip people's hands apart and can up the storm count very fast.

forbidden orchard/ city of brass - This mana base makes much more sense to me.  It give access to more cards, lets you fight against oath before you go off and has the same weakness as the land grant builds to waste.

I think I would go with the 5 color mana base.  This way you get acess to the draw 7's which are obv. good in this deck and you also get annul in the board to deal with workshops game 2/3.  If a 3phere hits i dont see getting to 3 mana before the game is already over, unless you get lucky and lay like 3 moxes 1st turn.  Annul solves that problem, just delays going off a turn.