Fact or fiction
I believe this card could be removed from the B/R list without causing a huge warping of the format. Also, it is a very skill intensive card with player interaction, and that is what vintage should be about to me. This should not be a rock paper scissors format where decks simply roll to or over eachother, but where skill can be a large factor in winning.

Regrowth
Having eternal witness off the list and this on seems quite redundant. Also, what is regrowth really going to do to the environment? The most pernicious thing I can think of is tutor>recall>regrowth>recall which honestly doesn't seem all that broken to me. Drawing 3 cards for 3 mana is basically a thirst for knowledge.

Entomb
I would like to see entomb come off the list to make dragon or possibly even reanimator viable. Who needs oath when you can ritual entomb/animate a 8/8 hasty beater. As far as helping to get a strip lock i think this is a minor concern. You would need a workshop to play the crucible then a black mana to play entomb and wait a turn to get it online, putting you at least at turn 3. Because of the increase in viability that entomb would bring to several architypes I think it should come off.

If you are looking for more game vs dredge ground seal is an interesting choice. A two mana cantriping enchantment that turns off dread return as well as welders vs. slaver.

I searched that current list and i think unearth has a lot of potential. I have been trying to break it for a while, but I just don't know... I mean fulminator mage makes a pretty juicy target, along with bob and goyf.

I think the goblin trenches idea sounds pretty solid. Like it was said above it allows you to tax every turn and will overwhelm an opponent if not taken care of quickly. With all of the land sacking and mox diamonds it would require crucible probably, but it seems like a solid idea to me. Also it helps you win the permanent war against stax and would give fish and goblins a hard time getting through on the ground.

what do you guys think helm might go to?

Please don't ask questions that have nothing at all to do with the topic.

Rich

I'm not saying your wrong, but starcity says otherwise...

http://www.starcitygames.com/pages/judgefinder.php?keywords=Helm+of+Obedience

Full time student at michigan state university

Thousand year elixir seems like it would be okay in shop decks as well. Haste welders and pretty crazy things with metalworkers seem possible.

This isn't really a fake issue, but how would you get a japanese arabian nights city of brass? Chronicles I'm assuming, but I thought that was only printed in italian?
http://cgi.ebay.com/4-Japanese-City-of-Brass-Arabian-Nights-NM-MTG_W0QQitemZ250167268226QQihZ015QQcategoryZ19115QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Glen Elendra Pranksters   
Creature - Faerie Wizard 
Flying
Whenever you play a spell during an opponent's turn, you may return target creature you control to its owners hand.

seems like it would be really strong with the clique, as well as perhaps the 2 mana cost counterspell which bounces a permanent.

What do you guys think about this auction, he assures me that the BB are not CE. I made him an offer and he said that he would pull them down and ship them to me. Could paying with a credit card help me be protected?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270165610822&sspagename=ADME:X:RTQ:US:11

So you couldn't use a set of Wyvren backed hymn to tourach's in a tournament?

Nothing says style more than blowing your opponents head off with a
http://sales.starcitygames.com/carddisplay.php?product=17814

@ Harlequin I agree that more tutoring is needed, and I will probably splurge on a I-seal in place of a brand. I'm not sure about street wraith though, it seems to be either that or confidant.

As far as mono , do you think that there is enough tutor power and draw blue does give you things like recall, walk, tinker, and perhaps even transmute artifact, but what draw would you suggest outside of that? Maybe Thirst?

What disruption do you have in mind, and what are your thoughts on maindeck graveyard hate?

I firmly believe there is nothing more satisfying than turning a huge creature sideways. Because of this, I have always been a fan of mask, and I have tried various incarnations over the years. I believe that red/black offers the strongest set of spells possible to the mask player. There have been two flaws that mask nought has always lacked, speed(you can never have too much) and threat density. Here is my recent decklist with a few ideas for additions, and help you could provide would be greatly appreciated..

Combo:16
4 Illusionary Mask
4 Phyrexian Dreadnought
4 Hunted Horror
4 Brand

Broken: 4
1 Necropotence
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Consultation

Solid: 12
4 Dark Confidant
4 Fling
4 Duress

Open slots: 4

Mana: 24
4 Dark Ritual
1 Sol Ring
1 mana Vault
1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Ruby
1 Lotus Petal
1 Mana Crypt
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Badlands
4 Swamp
1 Mountain


Hunted Horror/Brand - I know this looks janky, but it really helps the threat density in the deck. Hunted Horror functions well either alone under a mask or with brand. This also gives you a way around null rod should it hit the board.

Here are some possibilities that I think would fit, but feel free to add anything that you think will help. I know I am light on disruption...
Magus of the Moon - Most of the combo is colorless, and this is a hoser who beats for 2.
Mass Hysteria - speeds up the combo a turn for one red mana, and no one plays bigger creatures than mask.
Cabal Therapy - With magus I think there would be enough creature base to run this card.
Leyline of the void/Planar Void - Basically every deck in vintage needs the yard

Have you ever tried voltaic construct, infinite mana can never be a bad thing...

I have been out of the loop for a while, and this is somewhat of a side note but has anyone tried vinelasher kudzu in this deck. With lots of fetch lands and 4 gush it could pretty much become dryad 5-8.

I was just trying to think of a 1of that I hadn't included in this updated list. I have room for 1 wretch right now, what would you cut for the other one, a basic maybe?

Here's what I'm looking at right now. I decided to add in negators against combo/control which I have few other options. I still have 4 swords pre board and to a lesser extent seals.

Face Smashers: 16
4 Illusionary Mask
4 Phyrexian Dreadnought
4 Dark Confidant
4 Phyrexian Negators

Hate: 12
4 Seal of Cleansing
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Duress

Tutor: 6
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Necropotence
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Demonic Consultation

Mana: 25
4 Dark Ritual
1 Lotus Petal
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Vault
1 Mana Crypt
3 Bloodstained Mire
3 Polluted Delta
4 Bayou
5 Swamp
2 Plains

I still have 1 open slot for something, not sure what I should be. A lone wretch would be random, perhaps balance?

First of all this deck is unpowered at the moment, however if I had power I would switch to blue.  In order for h-recall to be not hurting me I would need to not have any artifacts in play, and in that case i would already be in a jam. Also swords kills welders, oath fat and every other creature in the game for a mere 1 mana. Not counting recall blue has no way of dealing with artifacts on the board already, and null rod/needle are both GG unless you can remove them.

Gabethebabe
I'm still not sure about the the finds or not, this deck doesn't have a lot of threats and we all know how hated out artifacts usually are. Of course it's not something you'd like to see early, but it does help. While this loss was balanced out by a few negators I'm really not sure about running them main, I don't plan on facing much combo or control where he really shines. The rest of the card choices however seem great, and I forgot about mana crypt!

Changes that I'm going to be making so far... Also thanks guys for all the imput, it has been very helpful. I'm not sure about adding strips, I feel like I have quite a bit of hate already(though not toward land of course). I know will isn't broken in here, but it's pretty much an excellent card in any deck running black. And while I would like to add a imperial seal, I'm not going to spend $100 on vampiric tutor #2.

-3 chants(to the board for combo matchups?)
-4 castigate
-1 argivian find
-4 plains

+2 fetch
+1 swamp
+2 swords
+1 necro
+1 consultation (I've had bad luck in the past, but it gets you what you need now)
+2 seal of cleansing
+2 darkblast
+2 wretch
+1 lotus petal

    It has been a while since I have posted here, but I figure I would give it a shot. From the first time I layed eyes on masknought it has been my favorite deck, though unfortunatly not without it's problems. Mono black suicide was  one of the first incarnations and it was very narrow. Auto-scooping to a resolved null rod was never any fun, no to mention the inability to deal with any top decked hate the opponent drew. Anyways... I have been testing a B/W version as of late and I think that it shows some promise. Many of the area's that mask has been lacking seem to be much stronger with this addition. I would like some help with card choices however, I'm having a hard time deciding what should make the cut.

Core cards: 21
4 Illusionary mask
4 Phyrexian Dreadnought
4 Dark ritual
4 Dark Confidant(with a mana curve that pretty much ends at 2 this guy is a definite)
4 Duress
1 Yawgmoth's Will

Search: 3
1 Enlightened tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor

Disruption/Protection: 16
3 Orim's Chant(counter protection, combo killer, and sometimes a conditional timewalk, what's not to love?)
2 Hanna's Custody
4 Castigate(yes it costs 2 when you could be playing your mask, but it's a lot better than tossing one out in the dark)
3 Argivian Find (brings back either part of your combo instantly for 1 mana, 3 too many?)
2 Swords to Plowshares
2 Seal of Cleansing

Mana: 20
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Vault
4 Scrubland
2 Flooded Strand
2 Polluted Delta
5 Plains
5 Swamp

I feel like the white portion of the deck is trying to do too much at one time. I would really like to up the swords count, maybe at the expense of seal. Secondly is 20 mana enough for this deck? Hardly anything costs more than 2. Other than those questions feel free to comment, and maybe we can get some life back into mask! Also, in case you didn't realize I don't have power, not that it would have a huge effect on this deck anyways.

you could always run ninja's which come in under the standstill and are a 2 power threat.

Is goblin grenade too unpredictable to run? Five damage for one mana is pretty good I hear...

Not to be a stickler but isn't the draw 3 discard 2 at random very close to control of the court and goblin lore?

I'm looking for someone who I can play apprentice with to test various decks of mine against, and just get in some playtime. Is anyone interested?

Until the end of the turn whenever a red spell(source maybe?) would deal damage, it deals double it's damage instead.

I could see regrowth getting unrestricted. With fork and mind over matter they unrestricted cards that aren't very good by themselves. Besides they just reprinted a regrowth with legs for an extra G. I think it and key are the most likely targets for unrestriction.