Well, i've been playing a version of Doomsday with 4 Gushes and then i came here and looked at what was posted...

I will not comment on the already posted stuff because...it would be falming...

However, I would like everyone of you who has been testing the deck to consider this: Doomsday runs ONE gush, and personally i wouldn't go above one with any of the lists out there. When is the last time you've used gush to JUST draw 2 cards in Doomday? I myself did it, maybe 3 times(and won only once) since the original version of DD came out with BoD. It's not that there are not enough Gush in the deck, it's just that you want to win, well most of the time anyway, and that gambling on 2 cards usually isn't worth it.

I was running a version with Wraiths+4 Gushes...and then i went down to 3 Gushes and then 2. I'm even thinking of cutting it for one main reason: Getting 2 lands on the board with a combo deck because you want to bounce them to draw 2 cards... please, adapt the rest of the deck. What happens if on turn two you gush into: DD/Necropotence...and then you proceed to dig up with Brainstorm to find...nothing. You've just set yourself back 2 turns and I'm not talking about the Brainstorm, I'm talking about your non-existant mana base.

When playing Gush in Doomsday, people have to consider the fact that half the time, the deck is comboing with 1-2 lands out. Gush is broken and WILL be broken but this deck might simply not be it...at least not the way it is.

Look at it this way, if you cut the wraith for the Gushes what you're basically doing is: trading 1 cards, -3 life for -2 lands, +2 cards.



My opinion is simple: Gush is gonna be a choice in the deck (if the deck sees much tournement play that is) and that choice will be determined by the player. Now, I know that these are raw versions of Gush+DD decks but do you guys have any other modifications to the deck you were thinking about doing? Because I'd like to run Gush, just not like this...

Regular long might be faster, but if you get to go first as a DD player, you can just hit them with your disruption and usually seal the game right there...same goes for almost any other combo deck, as a DD player, if you get to go first, or they don't have a first turn kill, you can drive their hand to rubble and still settle in for a win.

After “some” testing vs. a few decks, namely; Fish, Stax, Bomberman, Boberman, Gift control, Gift combo, Manaless Ichorid disruption, Manaless Ichorid fast version, Mana Ichorid, Flash/Hulk combo, pitch long, and finally Grim long, (yeah played against most of my friends, we even did a gauntlet run to randomize most of the plays to see how different players would react with or against the deck).

I made the following modifications to the core of the deck:

-1 Strandyou guys already debated on it
-1 Island-u/b can be a lot more fun and a mono u can be problematic at times when you’re trying to combo harder sooner.
-1 Chain of Vapour I’ve been debating it for a little while and I ended up realising that the only time I needed a bounce during those matches we’re to either: bounce a Meddling Mage, bounce the result of Empty the Warren, Bounce Hulk combo at the right time or bounce a chalice at 0, 1 or/or 3… anyway, I realised that I was mostly interested in bouncing stuff that Chain of Vapor couldn’t deal with or that Echoing truth could deal with, just as well.
-1 Pact of NegationThe card is nice; however, in a well played and controlled match up, I’d rather have Duress or Unmask to be sure of what the opponent has in hand, too often I had the card in hand and ended up brainstorming it back into the deck to win with Unmask/will or just some disruption/DD. As a result, I chose to replace it with either Duress or Unmask. The card has some pretty nice potential in Gift matches, and I found it quite useful in certain DD stacks to defend the combo but, I don’t believe it has its place main deck.
-1 Time walk I debated a bit on this one, I wasn’t sure if I should take it out but I realised that, personally, I would overestimate the card most of the time and make risky plays based on it. Seeing that, I chose to put the Twister back in to get back the option to use the TPS killing style.

+1 delta
+1 sea
+1 Echoing truth
+1 Unmask
+1 Time twister


As for the Sideboard, I’d probably run the following:


4 Leyline
1 R and D
1 Tendrils
1 Duress
3 defense grid
1 chain of vapour
1 Hurkyl’s Recall
3 Massacre

Hmmm...

After looking at the list, I find it rather interesting; however, the absence of Time twister puzzles me and the absence of Chromatic sphere pains me after thinking of the possible stacks. I haven't read the article yet but I intend to do so soon...


After some preliminary testing I have found that:
-Chalice at 1 is a pain
-I miss Twister
-You usually still have cards to play in your hand when you hard cast a DD--> which means you can use brainstorm/recall to combo and get the necessary Storm count on the next turn.
-When my friend linked me this post, he also told me I would have to re-learn all of my Doomsday stacks which is not the case at all.
-Street wraith makes a nice addition

This version of the deck presents an interesting concept and pretty fun at that.
It kept the resilience of the original Doomsday (pretty much) and added some speed to it.


I am also curious as to why Smmenen doubts the deck could be playable, it still looks like a raw version of the deck that needs a bit of tweaking but, overall, it runs a lot more smoothly than the old DD did, except for a few weaknesses…

Well, to begin i'd like to point out that, for a deck to work it is dependent on the metagame(no secrets there)...

So as an example here in canada(quebec to be exact) dragon can't make t8 unless your packing 4 xanthid swarms, 4 duress and 4 fow...and even then... so we kind of stopped playing it (except for a few pple like me who just wont give up and get an occasionnal T8)

So, in some enviroments, 5c dragon will be better than U/B dragon.

5c dragon
-heavy stax
-heavy nonbasic killers
-more or less some control
-with the bazaar and the amount of card drawing, the fact that the mana base is colorful doesnt really matter
-Some new players may make bad decisions and that could cause them to lose some game

U/B
-well at first glance it seems a bit more stable
-it is often a good choice for non-iniated players because you dont necesseraly have to make lots of decision
-Somehow can be more fun for the non-initiated


basically its kind of a meta choice and i believe that all versions can be good...just depend on the environnement