Grats on the finish.


Seems like an interesting strategy to side in a card that does nothing against it. Mindcensor costs 3cc.

Only played two of those. Remora and Tezzeret. Both games I lost .
Guess that statement is a bit to much as well though since every deck that resolves more card draw should win through card advantage. It's just that UGB Fish only has 5 cards to do this while other decks might run more so if I can't get a clock on the table they'll outdraw me.

I enjoyed it more than playing that Ichorid deck on Tuesday during testing. Now that's a boring deck to play.


Lists of the top8 should be known pretty soon, I'll post them here then.


I don't wish to make this thread about my ideas about Vintage but I'll give a reply to that. First of all, Limited and constructed are very different so I'll leave that aside. You mention that in type2 the Swan deck barely cares about what the opponent plays but you mention the same thing in Legacy where AnT basicly doesn't care what Goblins do. This is just combo versus aggro where aggro is the current meta in standard. Magic is about Rock Paper Scissor, this is known to all so it's normal that certain decks just can't compete with others.

In Vintage I feel it's different. Every game I played against a deck that ran card draw combined with counter just slaughtered me because they would get ahead and I had no way to fight their more broken cards. After they did their thing they left me no outs. Legacy is more focused about creatures and a true hard lock barely exists there. The only known one is Counterbalance Top but when those are on the table you still have outs, can play around it and have the time to find your solution.

It's not that I dislike Vintage in general but the chances you get for recovering from a 'broken' play from your opponent is nihil.

Ah Vintage, the game I never played nor liked. Oke I lied, I played Vintage once, back when I played Type2 just when Darksteel came out. I decided to play along for the fun of it and horribly lost, I don’t really count that as competing. I quit Type2 later thanks to Affinity and started playing Legacy. Some time passed and the team I played with changed drastically from the casual players to better and more interested players while the old guard left.

So neither of us had played Vintage, just Legacy. We had seen people play Vintage and found them to be playing rather sloppy, lots of errors being made. We started brainstorming about playing some Vintage ourselves but without power or the willingness to cash for the power we would have to resort to a hate deck. We tried some self-made builds but found them lacking. I either planned on playing RGW beats or BR-disruption. Neither fitted my play style though and I knew of the existence of BUG-Fish. After some searching I found a thread on themanadrain, well hidden on page5. I read through it completely and noticed that most people would not advice playing it without power, damn. I tried building it anyway.

After constructing a list I asked Benny, who plays Vintage from time to time, what he thought. He mentioned to me that Johan wasn’t coming and that I might be able to grab some of his power to play. Instead, I just borrowed his entire deck, which was a tested build of BUG Fish anyway. I’ve read plenty of tournament reports (also on themanadrain.com) to have an understanding of key cards in several decks and how I would be able or not able to fight them.

Jelle planned on going with RG disruption, running Spirit Guide to power out Null Rod, Chalice, Root Maze or Magus of the Moon and try to capitalize on that advantage. We went to play test on Tuesday evening and I planned on watching Johan play. Instead I played manaless Ichorid because they where a person short. I got 2-1 in the Swiss and lost in the top4 of this practice tournament. Jelle went 0-3 with his deck. We build Jelle a RGW beats deck running Chalice, Vial, Skullclamp, 29 creatures and 20 land. I went with the exact list Johan offered me:

BUG-Fish                                                                                                                                                                                                             

1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Ruby
1 Strip Mine
4 Wasteland
3 Underground Sea
2 Tropical Island
1 Bayou
4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
1 Island
4 Force of Will
4 Null Rod
2 Stifle
3 Negate
2 Thoughtseize
2 Duress
1 Echoing Truth
4 Dark Confidant
3 Cursecatcher
2 Trygon Predator
4 Tarmogoyf
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Brainstorm
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vamp Tutor
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Time Walk

Sideboard:
4 Leyline of the Void
3 Yixlid Yailer
2 Krosan Grip
2 Threads of Disloyalty
1 Darkblast
3 Energy Flux

23 people showed up so it was 5 rounds Swiss into a top8. The first price would be a Library of Alexandria and not a Mox if more people showed. Not that I cared since I can play neither of them.

Round1:
This was against the opponent that borrowed me the Ichorid deck on Tuesday. I was certain he wasn’t playing Ichorid. Some pre-match talking betrays him as I put him on TPS and I am correct. He knows what I am playing as well.

Game1:
He ships his hand of 7 which was a turn1 kill or so he sais because he knows that I play FoW. He goes down to 5. FoW on his Ancestral as I play my own. Null Rod stops some sources of mana while Tarmogoyf keeps coming in for 3. When I play Time Walk so that I can go in for lethal the next turn he is forced to Chain of Vapor the Tarmogoyf. I use FoW on his Hurkley’s Recall and he scoops them up.
 
Game2:
I keep a solid hand of 1 land, Confidant, Cursecatcher, Thoughtseize, FoW, Predator, Null Rod. His turn1 Thoughtseize shows this to him and I think he takes the FoW. Wasteland is drawn and Thoughtseize steals a card. He drops some artifact mana followed by a drawn SDT. I draw Null Rod and drop it, he uses SDT in response, switches it and drops it to the third place. As his next turn yields nothing I know that he has 2 more dead draws coming. A nice Strip Mine from the top takes care of his basic Swamp. Stifle stops the fetchland as well after some turns. I win this one easily.

1-0-0 (2-0-0)
Jelle is also up 1-0-0.

Round2:
I’ve never seen this opponent so I have no idea what he’s playing.

Game1:
His Trinket Mage tells me he is playing Bomberman. I draw plenty of counter though and while Null Rod forces him to play fair I keep getting in or some damage. I think I’ve drawn several Negate and FoW to stop him from recovering and win quickly.

Game2:
I Thoughtseize and see a land heavy hand. The other few cards that he has gets countered while I get a creature down and find myself some card draw to apply pressure. He loses this one due to a mana flood.

2-0-0 (4-0-0)
Jelle has also won his match and is now up 2-0-0.

Round3:
I’m paired against Ilja. I know he’s playing Remora Painter.

Game1:
Remora slows me down while he stops my threats from resolving. Once his Painter resolves he can use his Red blast to kill of my Null Rod. I scoop them up some time later.

Game2:
Remora comes down again. Trinket Mage gets a counter from me but the second one resolves, getting him an SDT. Once Painter resolves and I’m out of gas it’s all his game, he resolves a Grindstone and I let it resolve. He frowns and activates. I use Krosan Grip on the Painter and get milled for 2. Once I have 2x FoW, a threat, some cards to pitch and a Thoughtseize I decide to go for it. He shows me FoW, FoW, FoW, FoW, Mana Drain, Mana Drain and Red Elemental Blast. I lost this game.

2-1-0 (4-2-0)
We discuss my sideboard plan a bit. Should I have sided in Energy Flux or not? Null Rod basicly does the same but having both is superiour. We’ll never know now though. Jelle won his match and is 3-0-0 with 2 draws to go for top8.

Round4:
I saw this person play the previous round as he went into time with Oath.

Game1:
I get some damage in through a Tarmogoyf. I counter his Ancestral and he has no gas. With one card left and low on life he plays a Meditate and no cards left. I let it resolve with a Negate and a Time Walk in hand, thinking that the worst hand he can draw isn’t going to win him the game with the next three turns for me. He finds Eternal Witness getting back Ancestral which I counter. I play the Time Walk and with only 2 hits needed he scoops them up.

Game2:
He gets down a Remora and I let him draw one from my Mox Emerald to follow it up with a Goyf. Goyf goes to town while his remora goes to upkeep3 and him having no action. His second remora comes down. I drop a Confidant which also resolves. He kills the upkeep4 remora and draws without paying for the other one, it dies. He drops a third but as I drop a Tyragon Predator he just knows it’s over. He draws and scoops.

3-1-0 (6-2-0)

Round5:
I am paired with Jelle and draw.

3-1-1 (6-2-1)

I’m in the top8 in 4th place. The top8 was:
Tezzeret
Remora Painter
Oath
BUG Fish
RGW Beats
UWB Fish
Illusionary Mask.Deck (powerless)
Stax


Quarterfinal:
I’m paired against the other Fish player.

Game1:
A broken hand on the play. I open with Land, Mox, Lotus. Crack lotus for UUU, use one for Cursecatcher, tap Mox to play Merchant Scroll into Ancestral, use it with the remaining, drop Mox, Goyf. He doesn’t have an answer and drops to 10 due to following attacks. Then he manages to find a Jotun Grunt which lowers the Goyf but I keep hitting him as he attacks with his Grunt. I keep my Underground Sea in hand along with a Stifle because he has Wasteland + Strip Mine. When his Jotun Grunt has an upkeep trigger of 6 cards and only 4 left he decides to Wasteland his Strip Mine. Grunt upkeep gets paid but he’s at 1 due to Vampiric Tutor. Without a second blocker he dies the next attack.

Game2:
I open with some Mox and am low on land. He drops EE for 0 and uses it but I have the Stifle for it. Confidant comes down later and I win through card advantage.

SemiFinal:
At first I thought this player was playing Remora as well but I was wrong. It is the Illusionary Mask.Deck

Game1:
I open with some power followed by a Confidant. He drops an Illusionary Mask on the second turn and I ask the judge what it does exactly. Once I get the confirmation that he needs to pay at least the casting cost of the creature I know I’m safe for now as he’s outtapped. I drop Null Rod the next turn to shut down his mask after a Thoughtseize stripped him of a counter and showed me two more Mask. I have trouble finding another beater but once it arrives I win.

Game2:
He manages to land a Confidant after my counter on his Mask. I had a Null Rod but was scared of Krosan Grip. I guess that’s a fear I have from playing Legacy. Null Rod resolves from my end and then that Confidant lands. He rides the card advantage to a victory and kills me with Phyrexian Dreadnought + Stifle.

Game3:
I just have a Tarmogoyf to hit him and he is low on land. He gets out just a Cursecatcher but I Darkblast it. During my turn I follow it up with a Time Walk and kill him with two attacks.

Finals:
Tezzeret. He wants the Library, I don’t. We decide to split. So I get two Volcanic Islands and 25 euro while he takes home the Library. He still wants to play for rating though.

Game1:
I keep a hand with one land and Mox Jet but have double Duress and Cursecatcher. Duress sees one Accumelated Knowledge FoW and some randomness. I take the FoW. Accu eot and when I duress for the second time he plays a second Accu. I take a card and he draws the third accu after I play a Confidant. End of my turn he uses it to draw 3. Then goes nuts on his turn with Yagwmoth’s Win.

Game2:
I keep a hand with Turn1 Confidant and a Negate for later. The only thing I fear is turn1 Oath from him of which he sides 2 in. He has it and my only out is finding a Krosan Grip now. I don’t but get a Predator. He has a FoW as well. I get beaten later on by Emperial Archangel.

Props:
- Great organisation.
- Friendly players and new faces to me.
- Winning some cards
- Jelle also getting into top8.

Slops:
There wasn't much of a downside to this tournament but I still think that Vintage has to powerfull plays. If at one point you do not have an answer you just lose and have almost no way of finding a way out.

Tarmogoyf's power is equal to the number of card types among cards in all graveyards and its toughness is equal to that number plus 1. (The card types are artifact, creature, enchantment, instant, land, planeswalker, sorcery, and tribal.)

sacrifice Seal of Fire: Seal of Fire deals 2 damage to target creature or Player.

Let's say there is only land in the graveyard so Tarmogoyf is a 1/2. Opponents sacrifices Seal of Fire targetting the Tarmogoyf to deal 2 damage. Does the 2 damage resolve before the enchantment hits the graveyard?

Oracle Text:
As Pithing Needle comes into play, name a card. Activated abilities of the named card can't be played unless they're mana abilities.

Let's say I have an Eternal Dragon in my graveyard, can I still return the Dragon to my hand if a Needle is in play naming Eternal Dragon? I thought it did since the Dragon is not counted as a permanent but I am seriously doubting about it.
Also, what about dredge? Can you still dredge Life from the Loam if Needle is naming it?

Thanks in advance,
Citanul

I allways say: 'draw' and move my hand towards my library then showing clearly to my opponent that I am passed priority. All he has to do is say something along the lines of 'WAIT!'. Most of my opponents never do it at the start or when i was scouting them, but after a few minutes they actually start doing the same and i find it better that way.

To ELD: You say it takes up time but you are making the moving of your hand towards the library anyway, all you have to do is move the lips and tongue to make a word during that action giving your opponent a fair chance to respond.

Just for reference, this is the exact wording on the cards:

Umezawa's Jitte          2

Whenever equipped creature deals combat damage,
put two charge counters on Umezawa's Jitte.
Remove a charge counter on Jitte: (*Irrelevant text to the question*)

Equip   2



Mogg Fanatic             R

Sacrifice Mogg Fanatic: Mogg fanatic deals 1 damage to target creature or player.



Situation: Umezawa's Jitte is equipped to the Mogg Fanatic and I attack with the Mogg Fanatic. The opponent blocks with a 2/2 creature (Vanilla) and I put damage on the stack and Sacrifice the Mogg Fanatic to deal the extra damage.
The damage of the Mogg's ability resolves first dealing one damage to the creature: Here there are no jitte counters involved, since it isn't combat damage in the first place.

The question: The second damage from the Mogg Fanatic, which was on the stack, resolves and kills the creature. Does the Jitte get's 2 counters because it was equipped on the Mogg Fanatic when the damage was put on the stack?

My thoughts: I think Jitte get's 0 counters because at the moment the damage resolves the Jitte is no longer equipped on the source of the damage.

I'm 20 years old. Been playing Magic for about 8 years now and have seen a lot of the game and how it came to it's current state.
I only play Legacy and Draft with Friends.