I wish to comment that I completely agree with your statement on how we need to move on and accept time vault as a part of the format.  Wizard's really isn't likely to do something to "fix" vintage in terms of Time Vault, it is simply up to us to do that.

why the whispers of the muse? is there a function that they serve that im missing...

i see, i missed that interaction.

why? it seems that would only open you up to wastelands...

wow i cant believe they just nailed another blue draw engine. wtf? this is ridiculous. why am i even playing now.

You can definitely use pacts to get the first oath through. just have the pact trigger go on the stack first, and than the oath trigger so that you get to oath in angel before you (don't) pay for the pact.

I'm having a real problem against landstill, is anybody else having this problem too?

Im curios as to how thirst for knowledge would perform in this deck. have you tried that out all or not?

i was thinking:
+4 TFK
-2 MisD
-1 C. Capsule
-1 Mem. Jar

With the new unrestriction of this spell, it seems like it could be utilized fairly well by storm decks. Ideas?

The talk of restrictions is ridiculous. I completely agree with the above poster on everything that he said. Vintage should be a format where you can play with and enjoy the most broken cards printed, its not some sort of ancient aggro format like legacy. Furthermore, Dark Ritual and Force of Will are vintage staples. Without being able to run them as four ofs, the entire format would change even more ridiculously than it just did. And honestly, if it ever gets to that point, i think i'd quit too. So please stop bringing this futile discussions over restrictions up, because honestly if wizards does indeed read these threads, they could be convinced to do something even more stupid than they already have. and that would not create the type of vintage you want to play.

what was he playing?

ive recently had a lot of success with trinket mages in my fish builds. but i play weird, so maybe its just me.

anyways, if you include those you get main deck access to some awesome cards (pithing needle, crypt, ee, top) which improve lots of matches and of course black lotus.

i have also found (perhaps obviously) that standstill and jitte are nuts. run those main-deck, 3/4 and 2/3 copies respectively.

grunt is hot, and so is mage. not to sure on other beaters. maybe mindsensors. personally, i like running a small amount of black to splash in confidants. the card advantage generated off them is nuts.

magus of the moon could be potent.

and i truly dont see any need for enlightened tutor or orams chants. you could try some null rods maybe. or jittes.

that could help.

and if you plan to stay to the angels for a win condition, i agree that upping the count could be useful.

also, why not pyroclasm instead of moat? its cheaper, easier to cast, and more of a definate answer even if it kills some of your dudes too.

Add a Fire//Ice in place of Recoup. It is great removal and I can't believe you dont have it already.

I have to agree with the people speaking against Wheel, though. As a control player, the last thing you want to do is fuel your opponent with seven potential fresh new answers to the bot you just discarded and welded in. This card doesn't really work all to well in your favor. Maybe try another welder/bot/top/anything else instead.

Just my two cents.

I'm sorry, but I really have to disagree. Mind tricks may be a part of the game, but only to a certain extent. And I truly believe that in this situation it was really dishonest and wrong to do such. I'm sorry that you all seem to believe cheating is good.

To me, tricking people into conceding can never be defined as outplaying and opponent. Its just extremely questionable sportsmanship.

Congratulations to everybody that did well, it was definitely one of the most fun events in a while.

Still though, what is your problem Lou? I mean seriously.

How would you accommodate this, what changes would you make?

and congratulations.

why do you not play with demonic tutor and yawgs will?
if you moved the maguses of the moon to your sideboard, you could make more room for key spells and have the ability to side them in during future matches where their value is unquestionable.

although i get the concept off going for a solid lock and then using the barbarian rings as recursion, i think you definately are in need of more threats. a trike, as mentioned above, would really help add an extra element to the deck. i am a real fan of mishra's factories in stax builds, they just work. perhaps they could be tried here.

why not try a leveler as a win condition? it removes any response your opponent has while giving you a giant guy as a win condition. and i think that some removal effects would definitely be of value to you.

congrats on the top 8.

and thanks again scott for being awesome.

life from the loam could strengthen mana denial and helps to boost mongrel, just my 2 cents

i think removing the tinker/colossus/angel from the deck would free up more space. you don't really want high casting cost creatures to be revealed to the top or bob. i would also cut the crypt and the chrome mox for more actual moxen. frantic search also seems to be a pointless include. with the high number of basics you run, you could safely remove some for some wasteland effects to complement the strip mine. another bounce spell (even aether spellbomb) would also probably be a good include.

i have recently started testing a deck similar to this myself. my questions on the overall design: why not run the underground seas main, making more room in the sideboard?

also, have you found slight to be better than wraith? i have been using serum visions over both(personal preference) because it digs deeper.

looks good though

can you post a list please, i am interested.

Hello, and let me offer a slightly belated welcome to The Mana Drain!  While we're happy to see you participating in deck discussions, our posting standards require more content than mere requests for decklists standing alone.  Please review the forum rules to avoid this problem going forward.  We look forward to your future contributions.  -DA

i highly disagree with the titan in the maindeck. with gush to save lands and its general uselessness against decks like ichorid and stax, it is simply not as good as it used to be. not to say it is bad, but even the decks it is good against (like flash and maybe storm) it comes out to slow to matter. it should be moved to the sideboard and replaced with a trike or a pentavus.

also, singleton gifts? it seems like a good choice, but a card easily boarded out.

otherwise, the list looks good.

perhaps high tide should be given more consideration. would a high tide/gush deck work?

i would personally consider moving the kudzus to the maindeck, they are a real beast there. how good is living wish though? it seems to be interesting tech, but I question somewhat its value over other slots.

Congratulations Carl on a tournament well played. I'll try harder to top 8 next time though. Congrats to you to Adam.