[Multiple Card Discussion] Artifact Hate, It's Place In T1..

[SpencerForHire]

.. and Efficiency

In it's current state, Type 1 is an artifact enviroment.  This means that having artifact hate should be a given.  There are definately preferences, no doubt about that.  But a few more considerations are efficiency, versitility, and card advantage.
The style of the denial for decks also must be a consideration.  While in some builds a simple spot removal for as cheap a cost as possible is the perfect fit, other builds require something more permanent or something that can take out multiple targets as quickly as possible.
The question then becomes, what is optimal in each deck; and why?

The Primary Choices

[card]Artifact Mutation[/card]:  This card is chosen because it can give aggro an additional edge or also because it can ruin an aggressive artifact deck for several turns after the spot removal.  In specific decks it can be more deadly.  One example is Food Chain Goblins.  If you think about it, with a [card]Food Chain[/card] out this card works three fold.  It destroys a possible threat or lock mechanism, it provides aggressive little buggers to assault your opponent, and it produces mana via removal for the food chain, almost like a ghetto [card]Mana Drain[/card].  I believe it is the best choice for such a deck.  However in other decks it is not as popular a choice, such as a deck that can't fit in both those colors, or a deck that has a more permanent solution.

[card]Oxidize[/card]: The cheapest actual cost for artifact removal.  This doesn't require mulitiple colors and can be run in many more decks, it gets off faster and isn't considered a waste for the most part hitting an early moxen.  The lack of regeneration makes this a firm choice in any deck supporting green and I have new respect for this card as opposed to when it first came out.  

[card]Rack and Ruin[/card]:  Three mana makes this one of the more expensive hard-cast options.  Card advantage is the trick here; netting two artifacts for your one.  In addition unlike oxidize, artifact mutation and such, this costs three and as a reward is a less likely target of chalices and isn'y a victom to trinisphere at all.  The unfortunate double edge is it requires two targets, before this might have ment hitting one of your own cards but in a world where artifacts make up a good percentage of almost all decks, this isn't as big a deal as one might think.  

[card]Null Rod[/card]: This option is more permanent and can help you in many situations where previous options cannot.  This option can stop cards from being effective while a welder is out.  It can stop you from losing control of turns and can deny many opponents about 1/3 to 1/2 of there mana base.  Null Rod can be played any time and still make an impact but it is best played early.  The casting cost seems to be the only true problem as chalice for 2 seems to be a strong choice.

[card]Damping Matrix[/card]:  Much like Null Rod but I felt it deserved seperate mention.  Matrix can stop creature abilities as well, it costs three so no effect by trinisphere.  Chalices have a harder time locking it (though I am not saying a chalice for three is exactly hard to do in decks like slavery).  This also stops welders which are just as pesky as the artifacts that we are trying to hate.

[card]Meltdown[/card]:  Meltdown has become one of my personal favorite as of late.  The one card I trully have any fear for is Chalice of the Void.  This gets around a chalice no matter what as it has an adjustible casting cost.  It also hits all artifacts as long as they cost less then the X so it can effectively reset your opponent.  ([card]Pernicious Deed[/card] works much the same way.)  This card has room in less decks then most though because there aren'y many red decks that aren't using a large base of artifacts.  Meltdown should be run to hate out moxen and chalices only as more efficient hate forms can be found for most other cards.

[card]Naturalize[/card]:  One of the most least popular yet, I felt it deserved mention because I remember when it first came out everyone threw aside there disenchants and cried out "Finally in a more popular color!"  Naturalize is strictly WORSE then Oxidize when it comes to artifact hate.  The only feature it has that makes it worth mentioning is it's versitility to hit enchantments.  There aren't enough enchantments in most metagames to make it worth considering over something else IMO.

[card]Nevindrals Disk[/card], [card]Powder Keg[/card], [card]Shatterstorm[/card]:  These are your huge bombs.  They take out the entire field (or close to).  The double edge they intail is nothing compared to the ability to wait until you are good and ready to use them.  My biggest concern in artifact hate is when a welder exists you will find yourself facing exactly what you just destroyed back on the field at the cost of an off colored mox within one turn.  These allow that to become less of a reality because they also take out welding targets (and in some case welders).

[card]Chalice of the Void[/card]:  This COULD be considered artifact hate.  It has the ability to lock a casting cost value.  Usually when used for this purpose it is set to 0 to counter moxen.  It has very little use as such and if you are going to hinder moxen you might as well run Null Rod.

[card]Gorilla Shaman[/card], [card]Goblin Vandal[/card], [card]Goblin Tinkerer[/card]:  A long lasting way to hate out many low costing artifacts.  Generally only used to pop moxen or one huge thing (if you can produce the mana in shamans case).  These however can also become threats and there is little double edge to them minus them having a creature body and thus becoming susceptable to creature hate such as Fire/Ice.


The end result is many options.  However each is depending upon the current metagame, or exactly what you wish to accomplish.  Null Rods, Chalices, and Mox Monkeys are used to destroy an opponents mana base a majority of the time.  RnR and Artifact Mutation are used more prominently to destroy "bombs" in artifact based or artifact fluent decks.
Cards such as Disk and Pulverize are used as reset buttons in many a deck.
Some of these can become inefficient such as when a welder is played, others can lose there reliability if a chalice is dropped.  (Which makes meltdown nice).  It all comes down to what you want to do.
Null Rod, Oxidize, and Artifact Mutation are very susceptible to chalice problems.
The Heavier costing ones make become wasted over one threat and you suddenly find another one plopped down the second a disk has been "popped" or the field has been [card]Pulverize[/card]d.

Your thoughts?

[PandaPokemon]

Damping Matrix: Much like Null Rod but I felt it deserved seperate mention. Matrix can stop creature abilities as well, it costs three so no effect by trinisphere. Chalices have a harder time locking it (though I am not saying a chalice for three is exactly hard to do in decks like slavery). This also stops welders which are just as pesky as the artifacts that we are trying to hate.

It deserves a seperate mention because it is not like null rod.  Damping Matrix doesn't stop mana.  Whereas Null Rod does and is used in budget decks with little moxen.

[Soupboy]

I think Dust to Dust needs a mention-  1WW Remove two target artifacts from the game.  Unfortunately it *is* at sorcery speed and white to boot, but I think the removed from game aspect is not to be taken lightly.  Granted, in actual game play getting double white can be tough, but in theory it should work

The Soup

[SpencerForHire]

First, it's sorcery speed means more then you'd think.  If it was an instant, you could play it in response to welding and hinder alot of progression.  As it stands it would need to cost {W} to be worth a slot in almost any deck IMO.  Unless you play parfait

[Gothmog]

Don't forget Pulverize, when you absolutely, positively have to kill every mother ... in the room, accept no substitutes; and its free (sac 2 mountains alternate cc).

[mask]

Damping Field is winter orb for artfacts, parfait

Phyrexian Gate is black natural answer, Sui still plays it

Mogg salvage also sees quite a bit of play in Slavery against fish / landstill

Shattering Pulse, with buyback is great

Echoing Ruin, socery speed, doesn;t have too many hits in type one of the same, only really again tnt, and stacker.

Pillage, casting cost of three and alternative selection of land.

Disenchant and shatter becuase of Ishochrons.

[SpencerForHire]

@Gothmog: I mentioned pulverize briefly, I didnt overlook it.  Its in the same catagory as disk and such.

@Mask: Phyrexian Gate is the answer the non viable deck Suicide uses.  Almost all other decks, including some suicide run Pernicious Deed.

Mogg Salvage: A great card to run IMO but sometimes hitting multiples is better.

Shatterpulse: Nice but sometimes costs too much especially in aggro etc..

Echoing Ruin is really useless in TnT and Stacker because your opponent can weld in respsonse and it just turns into a sorcery speed shatter.

Pillage costs three for one artifact, the ability for land hate isn't a big deal thanks to wasteland/stripmine.

Naturalize is the same as disenchant, and remember in this day and age, you have to factor artifact hate yourself making Isochrons hard to run.

[Gabethebabe]

*Incomplete thread alert*

Energy Flux
Goblin Welder
Magus of the Unseen
Seal of Cleansing
Serenity
Uktabi Orangutan
Viashino Heretic
Viridian Shaman
Viridian Zealot

[Cpkrug]

goblin replica

[rozetta]

Primitive Justice has seen some use recently, too.

[Colossus]

It really depends on the deck I think. . . I mean TnT alrewady has the welder in place, but could pssibly throw in a few Artifact mutations since it already runs Green/Red.
In Tog, or any other 5 color deck art mutation wins again.
In sligh?  It has to be mono red- so it has to be Shatter if you want instant, or perhaps Rack and Ruin, ect.  Gorilla Shaman I suppose will end up ruling because he does it repeatedly, but I think Shatterstorm may even be effective here.
Stompy?  Oxidize is the ONLY choice.  Running that few lands anything costing more is not an option.

Oh yeah, and for moxen removal there's Karn.  He rocks in TnT or a workshop deck because you can blow up moxes for one mana anytime they hit the board.  Useless against artifacts with casting costs other than 0, but that'll clear up a decent chunk of stuff.

[SpencerForHire]

The main considerations when choosing really just are the CC and the amount of artifacts it hits.  My largest concern is the number 1 artifact I wish to hate: Chalice of the Void, that makes any artifact hate with a CC of 2 VERY unusable in any matchup because a chalice for 2 is the only dangerous candidate for hate, a chalice for 1 is laughable, as is 3, 4 is hard to do and in those situations I just go aggro.  
Rack and Ruin, Meltdown, and Gorilla Shaman become my prime choices in this case.  As rack and ruin costs three I find it too expensive because on 3 mana I just plain win so, gorilla shaman and meltdown would be my prime choices for a situation where I hate chalices.  (From FCG standpoint)

[TutoreIlluminato]

Tel-Jilad Justice - 1G
Instant
Destroy target artifact.
Scry 2 (Look at the top two cards of your library. Put any number of them on the bottom of your library and the rest on top in any order.)
Illus. Alex Horley-Orlandelli
Uncommon

It has the same CC of Naturalize, but Scry is a good ability, allowing you to know your next draw or put on the bottom of your library the cards you don't need

[Abakar]

Right now, my favorite anti-artifact is Energy Flux which I believe to be an underused card.  Any deck packing 5 strips should seriously consider this card.  The biggest advantage of it being that it locks your opponent mana (pop moxen and require mana to keep other artifact) as well as it destroys artifacts, combined with wastelands, it can slow any deck down often giving you victory.

[paradigm]

Right now there the top candidates for artifact hate boils down to the following red, green, and artifacts answers

Bear in mind that "there are no wrong threats, only wrong answers."

Red

Gorilla Shaman
This is currently the most important artifact hate card. Bearing in mind that the target is Workshop decks (both versions), the Shaman is adept at shutting down Welder activations, which reduces the number of threats sharply, which is critical in that matchup since a number of cards - Thirst, Memory Jar (Draw 7s in Workshop) are most synergistic with Welder. In addition, it also solves problems involving Chalice.

Rack and Ruin
Usually most powerful against Trinistax and Workshop Slaver - not so much versus Control Slaver, it still serves the purpose as an instant speed two-for-one that can be Cunning Wished for. No longer as optimal a choice - especially if Artifact Mutation can be forced into the build, it remains an inclusion in most sideboards. The higher cost is intended to be negated by artifact mana and remains strong than Shattering Pulse primarily since there's always another source to hit (moxen), while with the prevalence of Force of Will in Slaver, it becomes difficult to activate a Shattering Pulse. Remains the key choice primarily for the instant speed ability. In addition, it becomes difficult for a dead to survive artifacts without a) Null Rod, b) Oxidize (which the monogreen decks use) or c) Red, and of the red options, Rack remains the easiest to splash and the most efficient.

Green

Oxidize - Essentially the only option available for green at this time (For Naturalize, there is a current lack of strong targets, especially in the tier one level, and Deconstruct is a niche card in Two-Land Belcher builds.) due to its low mana cost. However it has currently found it's home mostly in monogreen builds such as Big-O - if at all possible to force into a build, Artifact Mutation is the better choice.

Artifact Mutation - simple enough - swings the game while providing card and tempo advantage. It is best used as a proactive threat - hitting the first big target you can as opposed to waiting for an ideal situation to gain advantage - against Slaver you can sing, and against the now-dormant TnT you gain valuable chump blockers.

Artifact

Null Rod - almost always the superior choice due to the ability to shut down combo. For decks such as EBA that has tools such as Force of Will and Meddling Mage the Rod is not necessary (and thus Damping Matrix works better) - without those options the "budget" decks that are infamous for running Null Rod cannot afford the luxury of shutting down Togs and Welders for another mana at the expensive of a terrible combo matchup. This remains the standard for the proactive answer to moxen - it serves first as a mana denial component with the added bonus of also hitting Slaver with collateral damage. For these decks, parising aggressively into a Null Rod remains one of the few ways for (non-Fish) these decks to take down combo and Slaver.

Of these, Gorilla Shaman is becoming the most important with the dominance of Slaver. The key of course, is playing the Shaman right - not necessary popping artifacts at will, but waiting for the Slaver player to activate Welder, effectively stopping it for another turn - this manner prevents the Welder from being active without any surprises getting in your way. Stalling the Welder has the added effect of weakening their discard components (Thirst and Memory Jar) - particularly in Control Slaver which does not have Gilded Lotus (which is obviously difficult to Shaman).

Artifact Mutation is powerful, but the number of decks that can currently use it is limited, meaning that the most optimal sideboard answer remains Rack and Ruin (Red is more common of a splash and if you're forcing green for oxidize, you mise well try for the Artifact Mutation).