Quiacatl's Incarnation

[Bram]

This card, together with another one I'll post shorty, will mark my last poison-themed cards for the time being. I won't drop the Aztec-theme however, but will be taking a more bottom-up design approach rather thna a top-down one.

This card is one that Ephraim and I discussed a while ago, and the idea that I referred to in Jebus' poison-doubler enchantment thread. Iit's meant to be a huge, overcosted, Timmy creature with a cool effect that requires massive dedication to the poison theme to be of any use at all.
The tougness is random (I picked 10 because that's the all-important number for poison). It could be any other number >5 as far as I'm concerned.

Quiacatl's Incarnation
{B}{G}{G}
Legendary Creature -- Avatar
0/10
If a player would get a poison counter, that player gets two poison counters instead.
1, Remove a poison counter from target player: Put a 1/1 green Snake token into play under that player's control.
"When snakes draw near, the God is here." -Xolot proverb.


Current wording:

Quiacatl's Incarnation
4BBGG
Legendary Creature -- Avatar
0/7
If a player would get a poison counter, that player gets two poison counters instead.
1, Remove a poison counter from target player: Put a 1/1 green Snake token into play under that player's control.
"When snakes draw near, the God is here." -Xolot proverb.

[wonkey_donkey]

Would this card not lend itself well to being indestructable? It seems like it'd be hard to kill, and it does nothing by itself - it's almost transcendent. Any thoughts on this?

Tom

[orgcandman]

making this indestructable wouldn't fit the flavor. Nature shouldn't have lords that don't die. it's just not natural, whereas death is.

[wonkey_donkey]

making this indestructable wouldn't fit the flavor. Nature shouldn't have lords that don't die. it's just not natural, whereas death is.

Equally, however, this is not a very natural lord - he's a planeswalker, from somewhere else. It wouldn't want or be forced to obey the same laws of nature that the rest of us abide by. I don't think it's too bad from a flavour perspective, but maybe it's only me.

Tom

[Bram]

Well, both of you could be right. Arguments for indestructability are the fact that this dude is an incarnation of a God (or planeswalker) which does add an air of imperviousness to him. Arguments against it are that:
1. he isn't the God himself
2. avatars / incarnations in magic haven't been indestructible (or anthing other than lust really large and weird) up to now
3. it makes the rules text longen, which I really don't want
4. it doesn't help the card. How are you going to 'destruct' a 0/10 dork in the first place?

...so I'm not gonna add it. Any other ideas on this?

[Zelc]

4. it doesn't help the card. How are you going to 'destruct' a 0/10 dork in the first place?

Many things can kill an 0/10:
Rend Flesh
Wrath of God
Terminate
2x Shrapnel Blast
Afterlife
Drop of Honey
Swat ( )
Desert Twister (Timmys Duke It Out! )
Etc.

I think it's fitting to make this Indestructible, since I think it's pretty stupid to have this get killed by a simple G costing enchantment (and it'd be pretty cool flavorwise if this avatar of poison protects your creatures from the "poisonous" honey), not to mention Swat.  However, making this indestructible will probably necessitate the existance of sacrifice or removal effects in the block.

That being said, it's still probably a good idea to give it some way of killing creatures.  When something attacks this avatar, I think the avatar should be able to do more than to just send some 1/1 snakes at the attacker.  Maybe giving the blocked attacker -X/-X until end of turn, where X is the number of poison counters you have?  It'd be hell on the text box, though.

[Bram]

I think it's fitting to make this Indestructible,

Disagreed, amongst other reasons because I think Indestructible is a stupid mechanic.

That being said, it's still probably a good idea to give it some way of killing creatures

No, no, no, please. Not MORE unrelated lines of ruels text. The two ones it already has are barely held together by the snake/poison theme on some of our other cards. I could add like an infinite number of random abilities to make this better but it'll just end up looking more stupd and less like an actual magic card that could see print.

I wanna clock this if there are no further objections.

[GerryMander]

a 0/10?  That seems silly.

Can we change the toughness just a little bit?

a 0/7 would practically have the same amount of burn evasion, and not look as weird.

[Bram]

The tougness is random (I picked 10 because that's the all-important number for poison). It could be any other number >5 as far as I'm concerned.

In other words: yes.

[Jacob Orlove]

This feels a little random. The abilities are fine, but the p/t and mana cost feel very arbitrary.

[combo_dude]

I'd probably prefer "Quiacatl's Avatar" as well, although this is much more up in the air.

I agree with 0/7 though - it's big enough so that it's pretty rare that one would have a spell to kill this, but not kill a 0/10.

[Bram]

Well, the P/T and CC ARE arbitrary. There's really no reference for this. Any ideas as to make it fell a little more, I dunno, 'logical'?

[Jacob Orlove]

Well, seven mana for an 0/7 would at least feel a little more cohesive, for example.

[Bram]

Agreed. I hardly think this is broken at 3BBGG  
Clock.

[Bram]

Closed and added.