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Author Topic: Loan Shark  (Read 2051 times)
corncob
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« on: July 22, 2004, 01:05:34 pm »

Loan Shark
1R
Creature -- Goblin
1/1

Artifact spells your opponents play cost 1 less to play.

Whenever a nonland artifact comes into play under an opponent's control, you may put a debt counter on it.

At the beginning of your upkeep, you may have target player pay 1 for each  permanent he or she controls with a debt counter on it.  If that player doesn't, you may gain control of target permanent he or she controls with a debt counter on it.


Loan Shark
R
Creature -- Goblin
1/1

Artifact spells your opponents play cost 1 less to play.

Whenever a nonland artifact comes into play, its controller may pay 1.  If that player doesn't, you may put a debt counter on it.

T: Gain control of target artifact with a debt counter on it until end of turn, then remove a debt counter from it.
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Ephraim
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« Reply #1 on: July 25, 2004, 03:17:03 am »

I'm having a bit of trouble gauging the power level of this card, but I am inclined to say that it is too powerful. I suspect that most decks running many artifacts are well prepared to pay for them already. However, whether they can pay full price or not, you're forcing a discount onto them and them and them setting up a system whereby if the number of artifacts they control ever exceeds their mana generation, you get to start stealing artifacts. In the meanwhile, you're keeping their mana tapped out and if/when they do give up an artifact to you, you get to choose what to take.

One way in which this card might be balanced a little bit might be to say something like, "When an opponent plays an artifact spell, he or she may pay {1} less than that spell's mana cost. If he or she does, that artifact comes into play with a debt counter on it." Then, keep the rest of your card's ability the same.

That way, if they can pay full price and wish to do so, they don't go into debt to you. I am also pretty sure that the above wording dodges the problem of putting debt counters on things discounted by other means (Helm of Awakening, for example). It also doesn't put a debt counter on artifacts brought into play by other means, such as Tinker or Tooth and Nail.

Finally, the flavour of this card simply isn't red. Red doesn't steal artifacts, typically -- especially not permanently. Steal Artifact was reprinted in 8th Edition, so there's clear evidence that permanent theft of artifacts is still a solidly blue effect. Finally, the idea of loan-sharking and racketeering seems much more blue or black than red. I would be comfortable seeing this card being a 1/1 Wizard for {1}{U} or {U}{U}. It's a shame that Cephalids were a one-time creature type. Loan-sharking seems exactly the sort of thing they'd be doing.
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Marco
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« Reply #2 on: July 25, 2004, 09:40:43 pm »

I like this a lot, as a goblin, with "When an opponent plays an artifact spell, he or she may pay 1 less than that spell's mana cost. If he or she does, that artifact comes into play with a debt counter on it."
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Jacob Orlove
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« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2004, 12:32:16 am »

Keep in mind that making a card a goblin can dramatically raise its power--an effect that shouldn't be underestimated.

This card does seem a little too complicated, however. To keep it red, it should probably tap to gain control of the "indebted" artifact until end of turn.

Then it could also have 2: remove a debt counter from target artifact. Any player may play this ability.
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corncob
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« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2004, 01:00:33 am »

Thanks for the suggestions.  I was trying to figure out how to replace the last ability with something more elegant for a while.  Here's the revised card:

Loan Shark
1R
Creature -- Goblin
1/1

Artifact spells your opponents play cost 1 less to play.

Whenever a nonland artifact comes into play, you may put a debt counter on it.

T: Gain control of target artifact with a debt counter on it until end of turn, then remove a debt counter from it.
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Ephraim
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LordZakath
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« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2004, 11:01:06 am »

This seems even worse now. Rather than them having any outs whatsoever (ie: paying the upkeep cost), you're forcing them to receive debt tokens on every artifact played after this and then you can take any of those artifacts at will. The fact that it is temporary is almost inconsequential. This is an immediate slow artifact hoser when combined with any card that lets you sacrifice artifacts/permanents.
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corncob
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« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2004, 07:26:16 pm »

Oh, that's not a bug, it's a feature!  But I suppose making it optional wouldn't hurt:

Loan Shark
R
Creature -- Goblin
1/1

Artifact spells your opponents play cost 1 less to play.

Whenever a nonland artifact comes into play, its contrroller may pay 1.  If that player doesn't, you may put a debt counter on it.

T: Gain control of target artifact with a debt counter on it until end of turn, then remove a debt counter from it.
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Matt
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« Reply #7 on: July 26, 2004, 08:28:49 pm »

Read the rules, especially #3.
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corncob
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« Reply #8 on: July 28, 2004, 11:48:44 am »

24-h clock
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Jacob Orlove
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« Reply #9 on: July 28, 2004, 11:49:57 am »

Wait, now this is a one-mana goblin. This needs to either be two mana, or some other creature type.
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corncob
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« Reply #10 on: July 28, 2004, 11:55:25 am »

Why another creature type?
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Jacob Orlove
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« Reply #11 on: July 28, 2004, 11:57:52 am »

Because being a goblin is really, really good.
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Team Meandeck: O Lord,
Guard my tongue from evil and my lips from speaking guile.
To those who slander me, let me give no heed.
May my soul be humble and forgiving to all.
corncob
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Posts: 65

I have acute Foot-in-Mouth disease.


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« Reply #12 on: July 29, 2004, 09:39:17 am »

Eh.  Even in a goblin deck, its utility is marginal.  You need a sac effect to make the most of its ability, assuming the opponent gives you an opening to use it.  Now that the debt counters are effectively optional, it's hard to find a reason outside of casual to run this if you're looking for any sort of hard artifact removal.
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