US and European Vintage, Will the gap ever close?

[Smmenen]

Anyways, I think you are giving Kevin Cron abit too much credit here.  At least Gaea provided a good reason for not running balance, while you and smmenen have only provided opinions and nothing to support the case of balance.  Until you provide a good reason why balance/hurkylls belongs in stax, I am going to assume that Kevin Cron DOESNT have a clue about what he is doing.

and again:

Min kuk i din röv!!!

Did you ever think to consider that maybe Kevin, myself and mattheiu don't actually want to persuade or anyone else that we are right?  I could have written two pages explaining ourselves, but I see no reason to do so given that NONE of us have anything to prove.  I feel fine asserting that I am right without explaining why, in this particular instance.
Kevin has been playing Stax since April of last year.  There are meandeck and mana drain posts to prove it and, in addition, meandeck has an incredibly solid grasp of the archetype.  You can read an article Matthieu and I wrote last year to prove it:
http://www.starcitygames.com/php/news/expandnews.php?Article=5273[/quote]

[Gaea]

@Toad

we got here all unpowered decks you have spoken about but their results aren't so good to tell they're better than a sligh/zoo deck.

Gianluca "janus" verno made a lot of top8 with his fcg unspoilered but on the other side lots and lots of random players couldn't do better than a 0-2 drop with the same deck.

We do not have belcher here, maybe just because you can stop them with every card in your hand, maybe a null rod or a piropillar may help, and if the belcher got a 1° turn win all decks without fow will lose...

personal note: i don't want to criticize to much your decks but blood moon in a zoo deck, shit they cost 3 mana!! when will you be able to drop them? i saw a zoo deck around europe, maybe in germany, unspoilered of course, and that deck got 4 treetop, 4 mishra, mox chrome, mox diamond, troll ascetic, and other slooooooow cards... if this represents your tipical zoo i think it's not so hard to win...

dragon is the only unpowered deck that i think can be able to win tournaments, in fact Dario "lydonius" de Palma made so great results here that lots of guys built his deck, but on the other side he needs bazaar $$$

@toad: i would like to moderate myself but i see on other threads people like morefling telling that we italians are just able to made decks worst that they're... so i can try to be the more educated i can be but not every people here do the same

just my 2 cents

@Loa

vs tps i can assure you that an italian zoo as we know can't do so much, because the usual player is so frightened by hulk smash or mud to completly forgot that they aren't the only decks in the world
vs control he got the advantage of speed

of course magic is strictly related to maths but it's not closed to its rules, so we can have for 100 games god hands, because every time we shuffle the deck we restart and we got again a 4% to have a god hand just because shuffling the deck is completly randomic

@donkey

how you can say that the metagame is developed? i think that our metagame is better cause to an higher number of archetipes, in our meta you can find all decks that you see in your proxy meta (except TMS that no one plays!)  and also GOOD unpowered decks, that beats also our better players, the same players that made great results on other europeans tournaments

[Toad]

IMHO having a high number of archetypes in a metagame does NOT show the metagame is developped. Considering a given card pool, no more than 5 or 6 archetypes should be played. Just have a look at Extended or Standard, with a limited amount of decks being played. This is because in these formats the players just play the best decks, contrary to T1 where people have budget constraints or play with their pet decks.

[Zherbus]

Toad, there shouldn't be a 'humble opinion' about it. You're absolutely right.

Since this discussion went from analysing metagames to uncivility, poor presentation of arguement, and total off-topic-ness from some players of Spain, Italy, and Sweden - this topic needs to be locked. Enough warnings went out as a result of peoples inability to hold a respectable discussion.