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Author Topic: T-1 Unpowered Goblin Sligh  (Read 6025 times)
Apprentice
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spaceboyXYU1979
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« on: February 02, 2005, 08:18:11 pm »

This is a good old deck of mine; Goblin Sligh. It could stand some revision due to new tech: Goblin Recruiter + Goblin Ringleader (actually, this tech has been around for quite some time. My second incarnation of goblin/burn used Recruiter without the Ringleader due to tempo advantage and reliance on topdecking)

LAND (16):

16 Mountain

Goblins (24):

4 Raging Goblin
4 Mogg Fanatic
4 Goblin Cadets
4 Goblin Lackey
2 Goblin Vandal (It isn't as aggressive on the field, but when you need it it HELPS. Are there other suggestions for this slot? Arguments against it? Arguments for Goblin Tinkerer?)
2 Mogg Flunkies (This usually doesnt bite me in the ass, but the chance is always there. With Reckless Charge and Raging Goblin it usually gets its attack in.)
4 Goblin Piledriver (Core of the deck. Sickest goblin ever IMHO)

Bolts (16):

4 Lightning Bolt (one is revised ^_^! BWM, don't say anything about your beta ones... I want to look cool for once :p)
4 Incinerate (2 are foily!!)
4 Goblin Grenade (This card makes turn three kill possible)
4 Reckless Charge (High synergy with Piledriver and Flunkies)

Total: 56

Could it be as easy as adding 2 Recruiter and 2 Ringleader? 3 and 1?? I really don't know, I would have an idea but TheManaDrain.com's search option is currently malfunctioning.

Card Questions: Is the manabase thick enough to handle Ringleader? I only run 16 sources, alot of sligh runs 20. I wont use Wasteland in here, I don't need it for my metagame. If I did PoP would definatly show up.

What do you think about Fireblast? I have 3, but that number seems high. 2 Could work. In place of 'Cinerate?

Does Goblin Matron make an appearance? If so, in what number? She can be usefull, but it seems like alot of waste of mana. However she will most likely win the game.

Strategy with new tech: Either Recruit for Ringleader followed by 4 Piledriver, or if you have a Charge in your hand, Recruit for Ringleader, 3 Raging Goblin and then Piledriver. This makes for a turn earlier kill when Piledriver is Charged.

-Apprentice
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SimpleHiker
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« Reply #1 on: February 02, 2005, 08:51:11 pm »

What advantage does this build have against underpowered FCG?

With FCG you can remove the Lotus and Mox Emerald for two Elvish Spirit Guides and replace the Mox Ruby with another mountain. There will be a loss of killer first turns with out the lotus but other wise the FCG doesn't take a huge hit it its power.

sh
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Discozombie
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« Reply #2 on: February 02, 2005, 09:10:10 pm »

I used to run a mono red goblin deck that I played mostly casual.  It was a hell of a lot of fun and gave most people fits.  

Goblins Go BOOM!  

4 Goblin Goon
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Ringleader
4 Goblin Welder
4 Goblin Vandal
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Mogg Fanatic
4 Goblin Sharpshooter
4 Goblin Warchief

4 Mishra’s Factory
4 Barbarian Ring
4 Wooded Foothills
4 Bloodstained Mire
8 Mountains
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Mark_Story
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« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2005, 11:31:47 pm »

I think the inclusion of matron is dubious and unnecessary in this deck.  It's a 3 drop that is not searching out a combo piece as in FCG.  In general they raise the mana curve, and that's no good.  Recruiting for ringleader and 4 piledrivers is a solid strategy if you have a way of casting everything, on the turn you draw them.  Otherwise the ringleader has slowed you down by using up all of your mana for the turn.  I would look at running some of the budget accelleration as well.  Lotus petal is great inclusion.  mana crypt is also useful if have the budget for it.

If you are going to be playing mono red goblins, there are a few goblins you need to look at.

Goblin Warchief - hasty goblins, that cost less are the tech! a definate 3 or 4 of.

Skirk Prospector - Very useful ability, letting you power out turn 2 warchiefs or enabling you to cast siege-gang/ringleader with more consistency.  Also synergizes well with sharpshooter, if you choose to run it.

Siege gang commander - Awsome synergy with piledriver, also can double as spot removal, or a finisher.  Probably 2-3 of them is good.

Goblin ringleader - I love these in FCG.  They are your only card draw engine.  They work less effectively with fewer goblins/increased amount of burn but even if they net 2 goblins they are worth the mana.  However, if you plan on having a heavy burn component to the deck I wouldn't run them

Goblin sharpshooter - Amazing against other aggro decks, laughs at elves and zombies as it blows them all up.  Also synergistic with siege-gang's shock effect, mogg fantastic, prospector.

Goblin recruiter - Also very playable, can be used to tutor up multiple goblins or set up for the deadly triple/quad Piledriver swing.

Other cards to consider.

Chain lighning - Less mana than incinerate, and not much regenerates in vintage.  However, I might consider not playing it if your meta is red heavy.  

Fireblast - Definate inclusion.  3 is about right.  Works as a finisher, removal, totally necessary to increase your clock a full turn.

I feel that the following cards should definately be removed.  They are sub-par or have other alternatives that have more utility.

Raging goblin - He's lame, no relevant ability after the 3rd turn.  Replace with prospectors.  They have a useful ability at all times.  

Mogg flunkies - conditional, and I find them clunky in comparison to a piledriver, or burn spells.

Also for a discussion on a similar deck archtype in legacy see:

http://mtgthesource.com/cgi-bin/ikonboard.cgi?s=1a25aa9dc3ba8f0c01e76e6019d24b83;act=ST;f=26;t=11

Good luck with goblins.  Also look at the FCG lists, they are not much different from the standard goblin sligh.  However, it offers the explosiveness of a huge food chain combo on the 2-3 turn.
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Law
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« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2005, 02:43:47 am »

Ok first off

-2 Goblin Vandal
-2 Mogg Flunkies

now thanks to some of the newer sets more good goblins have been made.

Heres some thing you might want to look at.
List of all goblins

You should find all good goblins in there as well as some you did not know about. Rember look for the ones that can do more then one thing and do not have a too limited ability. I might be of limited help right now but ill try to point out some of the better ones later.
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Norm4eva
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« Reply #5 on: February 03, 2005, 02:07:27 pm »

This is the build I used to win a 1.5 Creature Feature tournament (20 creatures of the same type basically, with the standard 1.5 banned list).  It's a format where Goblins are VERY hated on, so it wins in the face of some of the most ardent hate you can think of.

4x Mogg Fanatic
4x Goblin Lackey
4x Goblin Piledriver
4x Mogg Flunkies
4x Skirk Prospector
4x Goblin Warchief

4x Lightning Bolt
4x Chain Lightning
4x Incinerate
4x Fireblast
4x Goblin Grenade

4x Fetchlands
12x Mountain

SB:
2x BLOOD MOON
4x REB
2x Tormod's Crypt
9x Crazy crap I don't remember, wheretf is my deck :/

Flunkies vs SGC; one could go back and forth all day.  One's actually castable in a 16 land deck and can safely be run in multiples of four; one's 4 goblins you will never hardcast but will often win games on its own.  SGC also lets you run retarded things like Tangle Wire and crush face.  Razz
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Apprentice
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spaceboyXYU1979
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« Reply #6 on: February 05, 2005, 11:26:00 am »

I have decided that I dont want to go in the direction of the recruiter combo, first of all it slows the mana curve down and secondly, why don't I just play FCG? And I dont want to.

Warchief IMHO is too late to have a devastating effect. Yes, it gives me cheap goblins (that only 6 goblins benefit from) and haste, well I have Charge for that hopefully. Besides, on turn four I have gotten into bolt/incinerate/grenade range and playing goblins then is just win more. Warchief is a win more card in this deck.

Sharpshooter is overcosted for the same effect of a bolt or two. I will do more testing on this, but right now it isn't looking good.

How does prospector help at all times? Right now I see that it can give you a boost if a critter of yours dies. Usually I dont have mana problems. My goblins cost 1 or 2 and to get a broken play I dont need more than 3 mana. Also Raging Goblin has synergy with Piledriver and Flunkies. However, I am not one to be stubborn. I will test some new ideas in this slot, but I dont think Prospector is what Im looking for.

Chains- If I had 'em they would be in.


Recruiter- Right now its not looking good for him. Without Ringleader (which I am not including) he is weak and sets up a kill that may already be there.

Seige Gang Commander- I'm not willing to pray on lackey. I want all of my cards in my hand to have an immediate effect, save Goblin Grenade.

Law, what did you have in mind to take the place of Vandal? I saw nothing that really works as well as it. Surely you didn't mean Archeologist? Maybe I should run Bookie, too Wink.

+2 Fireblast
+R Strip Mine
+R Black Vise

Right now the deck is:

LAND (17):

16 Mountain
R Strip Mine

Goblins (24):

4 Raging Goblin
4 Mogg Fanatic
4 Goblin Cadets
4 Goblin Lackey
2 Goblin Vandal
2 Mogg Flunkie
4 Goblin Piledriver

Bolts (19):

4 Lightning Bolt
4 Incinerate
4 Goblin Grenade
4 Reckless Charge
2 Fireblast
R Black Vise

Total: 60

This deck is supposed to resemble Goblin Sligh. If you ask me, ofer the past few years people have forgotten about the low mana curve of sligh and goblin burn. Adding cards like GSC, Goon, Sharpshooter, and then compensating with Lacky, Warchief and Prospector is not the direction I want to go. I want the cards in my hand to be played as fast as possible, so they have an affect of the game as fast as possible. I like it that my deck runs nothing with CC 3 or more. This makes the damage race that much faster.

Of course, I could be wrong, and in fact I need to test out the decks you have shown me to really make assumptions like the ones I have. But as of right now I stick with my opinions.

-Apprentice
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Mark_Story
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« Reply #7 on: February 05, 2005, 01:08:20 pm »

I definatley feel you need to look at the warchief.  he is on the upper end of the CC for sligh, but at the same time he is SO good.  A second/third turn warchief makes all your other goblins more effective, and doubles your mana when casting piledrivers/flunkies.

As for prospectors, are you ever tapped out with burn to kill in hand?  Prospectors fix that.  So if you even find yourself in that situation I would think of adding them.
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Law
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LawMag7
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« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2005, 09:26:05 pm »

[card]Akki Avalanchers[/card]
[card]Akki Rockspeaker[/card]
[card]Goblin Balloon Brigade[/card]
[card]Goblins of the Flarg[/card]
[card]Warbreak Trumpeter[/card]

Those seam to stand out to me as good ones to try. The Brigade and the Rockspeaker seem like the better of the bunch. The trumpeter would be good if he could sit in play a while but thats not a good thing. Since flying is rare in red it could be a nasty shock to the opponent.

Thats just a few ideas I have.
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Razor
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« Reply #9 on: February 08, 2005, 01:25:52 am »

About three years ago I played both Goblin Recruiter and Song of Blood [flip the top 4 cards or your library, all of your attackers get +1/+0 for each creature flipped] in a Goblin Sligh deck.

Considering my old list, Siege-Gang Commander replaces both Goblin Arms Dealer and Goblin Marshall.  Reckless Charge gets Goblin Lackey through, nicely.

Aside: bebe played an Rg Quirion Dryad build which did ok a few years ago.
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