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Author Topic: Sideboarding with gifts against PithLong  (Read 1886 times)
Fred The Ev
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« on: August 20, 2006, 05:18:52 pm »

I am a fairly new gifts player and I don't know how to sidebaord against PitchLong. I think I had a fairly viable Sideboard plan against GrimLong but now PitchLong with it's annoying force of will's and MisDs are just screwing me up. My list looks like this:

Artifact Acceleration(10)
5 Moxen
1 Mana Vault
1 Mana Crypt
3 SoLoRing

Land(15)
5 Island
2 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
5 Fetchland
1 Tolarian Academy

Draw/Tutor Engine(16)
4 Brainstorm
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Mystical Tutor
4 Merchant Scroll
4 Gifts Ungiven
1 Fact or Fiction
1 Demonic Tutor

Disruption(10)
4 Mana Drain
4 Force of Will
2 Misdirection

Miscellaneous(3)
1 Rebuild
1 Echoing Truth
1 Random Utility Slot

The Combo(6)
1 Time Walk
1 Tinker
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Burning Wish
1 Recoup
1 Darksteel Colossus

Sideboard(15)
1 Pyroclasm
1 Rolling Earthquake
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Tormod's Crypt
4 Chalice of the Void
3 REB
1 Pithing Needle
1 Darkblast
1 Rack and Ruin
1 Hurkyl's Recall

General advice on the sideboard, Ideas for Sideboarding against PitchLong, and ideas for the Random utility slot are all welcome.

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I am Karl. Not Fred. I play CS. Maybe GAT someday as well. I fund my magic playing endeavors by mowing my neighbors lawn. I like math and magic. And cocaine. Not really. I don't do drugs. But if you met me, you probably would think I do.
sundering jerk
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« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2006, 06:23:16 pm »

more duress is needed in the sb, I've had turn 1 Duress win me the game against combo. Also it helps against other good decks.
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ashiXIII
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« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2006, 10:52:31 pm »

What? I'm sorry, but I don't really see where you're having a problem with Pitch Long. Your deck is ridiculous against them to begin with and you have so much hate in your sideboard that the only way you should be losing this matchup consistently is if there's a huge gap in playskill. Also, I think the utility card should probably be Vampiric Tutor and the E-Truth in the main should be Chain of Vapor. Chalice @ 2 is very good against you; no reason to make it better by only having 1 out instead of 2 (plus tutors.) That being said, sideboarding should probably go something like this:

-2 Bounce
-2 Mana Drain
-2 Gifts
-1 FoF
-1 Burning Wish
-1 something (random off-color mox, Vamp, etc.)

+1 T-Crypt
+3 REB
+4 Chalice
+1 Tendrils of Agony


I think something like this is right for sideboarding, although I know someone's going to berate me for taking out multiple Mana Drains. I'm not entirely confident that 2 of them should come out, but I'm almost positive I would take 1 of them out.
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Fred The Ev
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« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2006, 11:08:20 pm »

I know I am amazing against them, but it still is important to have a viable sideboard plan. Why not take out misD instead of mana drain. Also, are you sure to sideboard in REB? does PitchLong have enough Blue to make it viable?
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I am Karl. Not Fred. I play CS. Maybe GAT someday as well. I fund my magic playing endeavors by mowing my neighbors lawn. I like math and magic. And cocaine. Not really. I don't do drugs. But if you met me, you probably would think I do.
Moxlotus
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« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2006, 11:47:28 pm »

I know I am amazing against them, but it still is important to have a viable sideboard plan. Why not take out misD instead of mana drain. Also, are you sure to sideboard in REB? does PitchLong have enough Blue to make it viable?

Pitch Long definitely hates seeing sideboard REBs.  FoW+REB beats Pitch Long a huge chunk of the time.  On turn 1 you have 2 counters available--that's ridiculously good especially considering that they will blow their load trying to do their broken start.

I would suggest not boarding out free counters against a deck that uses pitch counters as its only protection.  There is a reason why Gifts is a scarier matchup than Slaver--its all about Misdirection.
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ashiXIII
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« Reply #5 on: August 22, 2006, 08:54:23 pm »

I know I am amazing against them, but it still is important to have a viable sideboard plan. Why not take out misD instead of mana drain. Also, are you sure to sideboard in REB? does PitchLong have enough Blue to make it viable?

 There is a reason why Gifts is a scarier matchup than Slaver--its all about Misdirection.


And Merchant Scroll.
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EotGiftsGG?
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« Reply #6 on: August 22, 2006, 09:24:17 pm »

Werd. This deck needs Improvement.

1. The Maindeck.

Try running the Tri-Fecto: Rebuild, Hurks, ANd Chain. Truth is just not as good in a "combo-deck". Three Scroll and Three Gifts Is Good Enough. You Only Need One Gifts to win the Game, and Gifting for other Gifts is pretty un-affective.
My Maindeck is still Amazing and still tools on tools.

2. The Chaclice Is Insane In The Board. Hence, the reason i Played It =) .
I Usually side out (being on the play obv.) Setting it to 1 Is ALMOST GG on the draw and 0 on the play.
 
Being Honest, As being a Gifts Player and having ALOT of success, Listen when i tell you that GGifts has NO (ZERO) Game Against The new Pitch long variants.


Mox Pearl,
Lava Dart,
2 Gifts

For

4 Chalice
 
And Maybe a Single REB



The rest of the board..

4 chalice
2/2 Reb/Pyroblast
2 Seal Of Removal
3 RnR
1 RRiver
1 FISHY META CARD





Sideboard(15)
1 Pyroclasm
1 Rolling Earthquake
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Tormod's Crypt
4 Chalice of the Void
3 REB
1 Pithing Needle
1 Darkblast
1 Rack and Ruin
1 Hurkyl's Recall

Not Trying to be a jackass, but this is muy terrible.
I wouldnt waste two sideboard slots lo fish. The Only Cards making sense are The Chalice and REB's.(which i would play four of.)

RnR is the house against a plethora of decks, so two should be ideal. A random and singleton T.Crypt is wicked Janky. Same With The Single Needle.
The Odds Of drawing the one TC are FAr Worse then them Finding and resolving Will.


Think Of this, What is Tormod's Crypt in the board for?
- If Your answer is Dragon and random Control Decks and MAybe Combp Then Why Not Seal Of Removal? It Auto wins the Dragon matchup and oath has no game with it on the table, hence improving two fairly tough matchups.

Reb Against Combo.
You - Fetchland Go.
Them - Rit,Rit,mox bargain?
you- Reb?
them- GG

Its not a very good game plan against Combo. Unless you find cards in the main that are worse than rebs, than keep them in the board, for other control decks.

And Sundering Jerk <3's Beta Time Walks...



Until next time,



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ashiXIII
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« Reply #7 on: August 22, 2006, 11:30:02 pm »

I know I am amazing against them, but it still is important to have a viable sideboard plan. Why not take out misD instead of mana drain. Also, are you sure to sideboard in REB? does PitchLong have enough Blue to make it viable?

 There is a reason why Gifts is a scarier matchup than Slaver--its all about Misdirection.


And Merchant Scroll.

Actually it's all Merchant Scroll.  Scroll for FoW or Drain is a HUGE pain in the ass, as it replenishes countermagic much faster than Long can rebuild.

I know.
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Fred The Ev
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« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2006, 04:18:23 am »

Quote
Try running the Tri-Fecto: Rebuild, Hurks, ANd Chain. Truth is just not as good in a "combo-deck". Three Scroll and Three Gifts Is Good Enough. You Only Need One Gifts to win the Game, and Gifting for other Gifts is pretty un-affective.
My Maindeck is still Amazing and still tools on tools
I partially agree with your first point. Chain of Vapor should go over truth, However I would like to disagree with putting hurkyl's in the maindeck. Against anything but stax it is just another dead card clogging up my hand. I think my game against stax is good enough so that I can wait til game two.
On your other point, I tested 3-ofs for both gifts and scroll, and bumped them back to 4-ofs, each for a different reason.
Merchant Scroll- I just loved playing with this card. It gives the deck so much flexibility. Think your opponent has a bomb or playing against combo? grab FoW or Mana Drain. Playing against Stax? Grab a rebuild. Battling for card advantage? Grab Ancestral. It really just helped the deck flow and work 10 times better.
Gifts Ungiven- The thing that I really like about this deck is that it can sit there for like ten turns winning small counter wars just controlling the game... and then BOOM eot gifts and gg. The deck can just WIN whenever it feels like it. When you play 4 gifts, it almost guarantees that you will have it when you need it. and if you get 2 gifts early on, just pitch one to force of will or shuffle it back in to your library. 4 gifts is a neccessity.

Quote
Being Honest, As being a Gifts Player and having ALOT of success, Listen when i tell you that GGifts has NO (ZERO) Game Against The new Pitch long variants

ummm actually I beat pitchLong on a fairly consistent basis...


Quote
Mox Pearl,
Lava Dart,
2 Gifts

For

4 Chalice

And Maybe a Single REB

Reb Against Combo.
You - Fetchland Go.
Them - Rit,Rit,mox bargain?
you- Reb?
them- GG

I've grouped these together because they seem to be saying the same thing. Ok I see your point that there are some spells you can't counter with REB, but they aren't your only counters for god's sake. Let me give you a scenario that I guarantee is more likely than the one you showed above

Them- Bargain
Me- Mana Drain
Them- FoW
Me- REB
Them- ....mana drain resolves

you see? REB, like misdirection, is not there to counter their bombs, but to win your counter wars. It is given to side in 3.

Quote
The rest of the board..

4 chalice
2/2 Reb/Pyroblast
2 Seal Of Removal
3 RnR
1 RRiver
1 FISHY META CARD

This is a highly metagamed, and undiverse board. Stephen menendian has written at length about the importance of keeping a diverse sideboard. 3 Rack and Ruin is almost ok when you are playing a stax-only environment, but even then, it is better to find other cards that hit stax from differnet angles.


Quote
Sideboard(15)
1 Pyroclasm
1 Rolling Earthquake
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Tormod's Crypt
4 Chalice of the Void
3 REB
1 Pithing Needle
1 Darkblast
1 Rack and Ruin
1 Hurkyl's Recall

Not Trying to be a jackass, but this is muy terrible.
I wouldnt waste two sideboard slots lo fish. The Only Cards making sense are The Chalice and REB's.(which i would play four of.)

I am mortally afraid of fish, with new sauce like SS and Jotun Grunt around and about. I am devoting all the sideboard help i can get!

Quote
RnR is the house against a plethora of decks, so two should be ideal. A random and singleton T.Crypt is wicked Janky. Same With The Single Needle.
The Odds Of drawing the one TC are FAr Worse then them Finding and resolving Will.


RnR is good against Stax, and only stax. Playing 1 is as far as I'll go. I admit that the random T Crypt is wierd, but it just randomly wins me so many games. Same with needle, needle is such a house against stuf like CS and Stax. You are also forgetting that I have tutors

Quote
Think Of this, What is Tormod's Crypt in the board for?
- If Your answer is Dragon and random Control Decks and MAybe Combp Then Why Not Seal Of Removal? It Auto wins the Dragon matchup and oath has no game with it on the table, hence improving two fairly tough matchups.

My answer is that it wins me the game against Combo. Cutting them off from the graveyard is amazing. It forces them to shoot straight through my counters and lose. There is no dragon in my meta.

thx for the help and advice!
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I am Karl. Not Fred. I play CS. Maybe GAT someday as well. I fund my magic playing endeavors by mowing my neighbors lawn. I like math and magic. And cocaine. Not really. I don't do drugs. But if you met me, you probably would think I do.
Character000
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« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2006, 08:42:58 pm »

Quote
RnR is good against Stax, and only stax.
Quote

RnR is ridiculous against infinite decks right now. oath, playing chalice and null rod (both seem bad for you). fish, playing chalice, null rod, and aether vial (which seems extremely bad for you - keep in mind the fact you're a control deck, and them evading your countermagic with dudes like meddling mage isn't good for you. ) this doesn't necessarily mean to play two, just keep in mind the other uses for RnR than hosing stax.

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