[Shards of Alara]Ahum... Sharuum!

[BruiZar]

Sharuum the Hegemon - manacost: too much..  
Legendary Artifact Creature - Sphinx
Flying
When Sharuum the Hegemon comes into play, return target artifact card from your graveyard to play.
5/5

Alright, I haven't given it much thought yet but I'd like to get your opinion on this. There has to be something possible with oath of druids and some amazingly expensive and equally overpowered artifact that you can pick out of the yard with this thing... What do you think? Is there any viability and what would be the best deck to squeeze it in if you would be obliged to use this card in vintage?

That would essentially make Oath count as tinker 2-5, hm?

[andrewpate]

It would have to be better than milling Cabal Therapy when you Oath up Academy Rector, then sacking it (possibly after a Krosan Reclamation) to get Yawgmoth's Bargain into play.  It would also have to be better than milling Yawgmoth's Will when you Oath up Eternal Witness.  Both of these decks have always proved ultimately underpowered despite the promising combo.  I can't think of any artifact that would be better.  Any broken artifact is already readily available via Tinker anyway.

[the boogie man]

I think that the point is that you can run 4 oaths.

[Elfrago]

Mindslaver?

[Raph Caron]

I'd rather play Bringer of the White Dawn with Mindslaver.

[M.Solymossy]

This card would be fine in Cerebral Assassin or a Reanimator deck.

Reanimate ~this guy~, then the guy reanimates Sundering Titan.

[Sharuum]

i had the following idea: I play it with Manaless Ichorid. It is possible to dredge tru the deck in second turn with a little luck. Then Dread Return Sharuum and activate the endless circle. Everytime she hits the graveyard she will trigger the Bridge from Below. You end up with a Zillion 2/2 zombies in turn two. If you have enough creatures you return a Akroma's Memorial for unlimited damage in the same turn. the best is: you dont spend a single mana on all of that... cool? you could also bring back ashnod's altar for unlimited mana... but who wants mana, right? 

Also i like the Artwork a lot and the fact that it creates a real Hegemony tru a zombie Army without even "beeing in play" for real... a nice social-critic subtext, huh?

What do you think of that?

greez

Sharuum

[Oath of Happy]

hmmm flame-kin zealot is pretty good in ichorid and doesn't require that you use crap cards like akroma's memorial, so why the hell would you play this piece of shit card?

[Duncan]

i had the following idea: I play it with Manaless Ichorid. It is possible to dredge tru the deck in second turn with a little luck. Then Dread Return Sharuum and activate the endless circle. Everytime she hits the graveyard she will trigger the Bridge from Below. You end up with a Zillion 2/2 zombies in turn two.

What endless circle? How does Sharuum go to the grave and comes back again?

[andrewpate]

Maybe he has a way to repeatedly sacrifice it, and he thinks that you can do so in response to the ability and have it repeatedly return itself?  That's my best guess.

He also might think that you can do this by running two of them, having the first return the second, and the second's ability return the first after the Legend Rule is applied.

[brianpk80]

Sharuum the Hegemon - manacost: too much..  
Legendary Artifact Creature - Sphinx
Flying
When Sharuum the Hegemon comes into play, return target artifact card from your graveyard to play.
5/5

Alright, I haven't given it much thought yet but I'd like to get your opinion on this. There has to be something possible with oath of druids and some amazingly expensive and equally overpowered artifact that you can pick out of the yard with this thing... What do you think? Is there any viability and what would be the best deck to squeeze it in if you would be obliged to use this card in vintage?

That would essentially make Oath count as tinker 2-5, hm?

I don't know if it would make a competitive deck but one of the best high casting cost artifacts to abuse is Possessed Portal. 

[Duncan]

Maybe he has a way to repeatedly sacrifice it, and he thinks that you can do so in response to the ability and have it repeatedly return itself?  That's my best guess.

He also might think that you can do this by running two of them, having the first return the second, and the second's ability return the first after the Legend Rule is applied.

Both options require you to run extra cards. Either the repeated sacrifice (which costs mana most likely, which you dont want in ichorid) or an extra Sharuum. Running two Flame-Kin Zealot which are good with only 1 in your grave seems significantly better to me.

[meadbert]

Possessed Portal might be the best artifact and it has some nice synergy in Manaless Ichorid since Brainstorm, Ponder and top deck tutors can put good cards on top as you pillage their hand.  By dropping Possed Portal they cannot draw.

Also, because Portal is a replacement effect for your draw you can probably choose to replace draw with a dredge instead thus you can continue to dredge.  There should be plenty of Bridge tokens to sacrifice forever.

[Sharuum]

Well my guess was the following: You sacrifice 3 creatures (maybe 2 narcomoebas and a ichorid) dread return Sharuum with another sharuum in the graveyard. you can sacrifice sharuum all the time because you have plenty dread returns in your graveyard. can't you just sacrifice ONE creature to dread return, so the effect of dread return doesent come and the dread return remains in the graveyard? sharuum comes into play, you bring 2nd sharuum into play, legend ability triggers, 1st goes to the graveyard  brings in zombis with bridge from below and the ability of the 2nd Sharuum rescues the 1st out of the graveyard. then second hits the graveyard and triggers bridge from below again. that should be a cycle... or am i wrong?

[Harlequin]

No, On several accounts:

#1 - Announce spell, declare target, pay costs.  (if somehow the cost cannot be paid, gamestate is rewound to the anouncement).   This applys to flashback as well.  To "cast" dread return, you anounce dread return, you declare the target (a creature in the graveyard) and pay all costs (in the case of flashback its sacrafice 3 creatures).  If you can't sac 3 creatures, you can't cast the spell and therefore cannot cast any.

#2 - Theres no way to use the legend rule to start a chain reaction.  The best you could do is:  Dread return dude1, bridges and dread return resolve.  Dude1 enters play.  Targets for triggers must be declared.  You choose dude2.  That ability resolves.  Dude2 Enters play.  Now we need to resolve gamestate before we can move on to getting priority again.  Dude2 entered play, so we right now (while dude 1 and 2 are in play) we have to choose our target.  So dude1 is not legal.  So we choose some random mox in the yard... now before anyone gets priority, we have to apply the legend rule.  The legend rule simultaniously sacrafices the two legends.  They enter the yard, and put a bunch more bridge triggers on the stack.  NOW you get priority.  Dude2's trigger is on the stack under a pile of zombies, but unfortunatly without a willbender or something you won't be able to return anything other than a mox.

[Sharuum]

oh you mean "yes" i AM wrong actually

what means: "If you can't sac 3 creatures, you can't cast the spell and therefore cannot cast any." you mean if i cannot sacrifice 3 creatures i cannot cast the spell and therefore i cannot SACRIFICE any?

What if i had a 3rd Sharuum insted of a mox in my graveyard?

Thanks for your help harlequin. I really appreciate it. i play casual magic since the alpha and have all the stuff, and now i try to get into vintage... didn't play for a long time and now everything kinda confuses me...

[Harlequin]

what means: "If you can't sac 3 creatures, you can't cast the spell and therefore cannot cast any." you mean if i cannot sacrifice 3 creatures i cannot cast the spell and therefore i cannot SACRIFICE any?

What if i had a 3rd Sharuum insted of a mox in my graveyard?

~ Yes You can't partially pay for costs (be it mana or otherwise).  And in this case the cost is Sac 3 dudes. 
If you ~could~ partially pay for costs then, it would be comperable to saying:  "Well I'm about to burn for 3... so instead I'll just reveal Darksteel collosus, start to cast him - spend 3 mana, and then  not cast him ... so I don't burn" 
Or another example would be like... I have tapped birds of paradice with Ubral manatle equiped.  I'll activate the ability, but I can't pay the instead I'll just pay {untap} - I don't actually get +2/+2 because I didn't activate the ability, but I partitially paid the untap - that seems fair.

The example with 3 Sharuums actually would work.  Dude 1 returns Dude 2.  that resolves and Dude 2 targets Dude 3.  Before dude 3 enters play Dude 1 and 2 Legend kill each other.  You get zombies, and then Dude 3 enters play.  That resolves and Dude 3 targets Dude 1.  Before dude 1 enters play Dude 2and 3 Legend kill each other.   Now Dude 1 Enters play and returns Dude 2 and you are back at the begining.

[Sharuum]

great! thats all i wanted to hear. it doesn't matter if you need 2 or 3 creatures to do it because you will have them in your graveyard anyways in turn 3. so we really end up with an unlimited amount of creatures here in turn 3. the reason why i will use acromas memorial to reply to OATH OF HAPPY and his "piece of shit card" question is: I need to CAST another dread return to bring the flame kin zealot into play wich can be countered. The effect of Sharuum can not. so i can concentrate all the cabal therapies on bringing only ONE dread return wich will end up in an unlimited amount of creatures wich can attack in the turn they come into play...

Thx harlequin!

[BigBarn]

Actually, you check SBE's before you choose targets for Sharuum, so with 2x Sharuum's you could go infinite (along with bridge from below).

Dread Return targeting the 1st one, ability is on the stack - target Sharuum #2.  Sharuum #2's ability waits to go on the stack as soon as you have priority, and you'll check for State-Based Effects (the legend rule) before then.  By the time you choose targets for #2's ability, they're both in the graveyard.

Repeat.

[Sharuum]

wow... hm... so that REALLY means that it creates an infinitive loop with two of them? Even better. What do you thing about the Acroma's Memorial versus Flemekin Zealot thing?

[Mr. Type 4]

yes - you can make infy guys with 2 Sharuum, but I really dont think it will be better than Flame Kin Zealot.  FKZ easily gets turn 2 or 3 wins - sharuum requires you to dredge up 2 of that guy, a dread returns, several narcomobias, and Akroma's memorial.  It;s a cute trick, but not more competitive. 

though if attacking with infy gigantic zombies turns you on, then I'm sure the Johnnies of the world would enjoy this.  It's just not going to win you more tournament matches.

[Sharuum]

Thank you mr type 4 what is type 4 by the way?