[Deck] not so Mono Blue Painter

[Bone]

Please go to Reply #15 for updated blue/black/red decklist

Right after the realease of Painter's Servant i built a mono blue painter deck. But since there was not much vintage tournaments  I used the combocards for my Imperial Painter deck for Legacy. Now I have traded away my Imperial Recruiters so I want to check out if this deck can be good again. Here is the list:

Mono Blue Painter

Creatures { 8}
4 Trinket Mage
4 Painter's Servant

Spells {23}
1 Brainstorm
1 Repeal
1 Ponder
3 Counterbalance
1 Fact or Fiction
2 Mana Drain
2 Counterspell
1 Mystical Tutor
4 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Tinker
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Wipe Away
2 Misdirection
2 Rhystic Study

Artifacts {11}
4 Grindstone
1 Engineered Explosives
3 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Sol Ring
1 Platinum Angel

Lands {18}
1 Academy Ruins
4 Flooded Strand
2 Polluted Delta
1 Tolarian Academy
4 Seat of Synod
6 Islands

I have a total of 19 artifacts in this deck. I don't have Force of Will in my collection, when I get them they will be added -2 Counterspell, -2 something else. If I get more Mana Drain then they will be added to. Why do cards need to be so expensive? I'm not 100% sure about Platinum Angel but it can be a gamewinner (stall enough so my combo gets off) some times. I have also used Pact of Negation with Platinum Angel but not so much success because it can often be a dead card, FoW is better. Counterbalance with Sensei's Divining Top is great, only problem is my matches thend to take a while and I don't want to go time. Rhystic Study is a great card in this format and deserve to see more play.

How will Tezzeret be in this deck? I don't have it in my collection but can probably get one or two easy if you guys think they can improve this deck. It seems like a perfect fit since it can get my combopieces, untap my artifacts and work as an alternate win condition with it's last ability. Ps. don't plan on splashing other colors.

[Harlequin]

The first thing is to beef up the mana base.  19 mana is bearly enough for a low cc burn deck.  Your run far too many spells in the 2 and 3 cc range to get away with 19.  You should add at a minimum 2 stable mana sources or 3 unstable mana. 
You could do something like: +1 Lotus Petal, +1 Tolaria West, +1 ... something.  It really should be Library of Alexandria. But you could always add a fetchland, or even test something like Chrome Mox.

I'll just assume that Rystic Study is a very bad misspelling of Mystic Remora. 

Other than that, you might want to decide which cards truely help your strategy, and which cards are just "nice to haves" because running alot of 2 and 3 ofs is generally a bad sign.

[honestabe]

Tezzeret would really help

Not only can he fetch moxen for free, bu then turn all those artifacts into 5/5 Beat Sticks

[Bone]

-1 Grindstone
+1 Lotus Petal
Easy change

-1 Wipe Away
+1 Tolaria West
Easy change

-2 Counterspell
+2 Tezzeret
Or do I need the 2xCounterspell? Anything better to remove?

-2 Rhystic Study
+2 Mystic Remora
I really like Rhystic Study but will give Mystic Remora a try Thanks

[mr.grim]

I do agree tat a tezz or twoi would be great
I also would like to see a set of forces whae you get them
and if ya got tezz dont forget his watch....time vauld

Then it will give you yet another way to win.

I also dont see why you would run a single ee in the deck,i can maybe see it in the board but main deck that could be a tezz or force spot.

[Bone]

Current list is now:

Creatures { 8}
4 Trinket Mage
4 Painter's Servant

Spells {22}
1 Brainstorm
1 Repeal
1 Ponder
3 Counterbalance
1 Fact or Fiction
2 Mana Drain
2 Counterspell
1 Mystical Tutor
4 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Tinker
1 Merchant Scroll
2 Misdirection
2 Mystic Remora

Artifacts {12}
3 Grindstone
1 Lotus Petal
1 Engineered Explosives
3 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Sol Ring
1 Chrome Mox
1 Darksteel Colossus

Lands {18}
1 Academy Ruins
3 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
1 Tolarian Academy
4 Seat of Synod
6 Islands

Have tested against Goblins, BG Oath, Hulk Flash and Suicide Black with good results. At testing I didn't feel that in any situation I wanted Tezz instead of another card in my hand so I will not try to get him yet. Am very unsure about what sideboard this deck should have, any card that is auto include? Back to Basics? Echoing Truth? Repeal? Pithing Needle? Chalice? I don't think I manage to get a playset of FoW before next tourney but that's no worry. Only situation I wished I had in my hand during playtesting was against Hulk Flash when he played Flash on turn 2.

[Mantis]

You need like 7 Drains, unfortunately you are only allowed to run 4. So +2 Mana Drain, I don't know what to cut. Mystic Remora seems weak in the most creature infested metagame Vintage has seen in years. In the sideboard I like the Remoras a lot better and they could be great for the Drain mirror.

EDIT: Right, I'm sorry didn't read your thread well enough I and just assumed every Vintage tournament would be proxies anyway.
By the way, how is Academy Ruins?

[nineisnoone]

I would consider Chalice for upping your Artifact count.

Also I don't think Rhystic Study is good enough.  It comes down too slow and it only needs 1 mana to be prevented.

I feel Negate is better than Counterspell.  I've also fiddled around with Muddle the Mixture which would give you a way to tutor for Painter's or Counterbalance.

[Bone]

Mantis:
+2 Mana Drain is on my want list along with +4 Force of Will. Keeping the two Mystic Remoras in my maindeck with another two in my sideboard. Academy Ruins have in fact never found the way to my hand during playtesting. Hopefully I find out before next tournament (think I'm going for january 24th) if it's worth a Island slot.

niceisnoone:
Going for +4 Chalice in my sideboard. Rhystic Study is gone with Mystic Remora taking its place. Not so sure about Negate since almost every card in my deck produces blue mana except Sol Ring and Academy Ruins but I will consider them. Muddle the Mixture is a cool card, never gave it any attention before. I will consider this card also and try to use it in some playtesting.

On the sideboard subject this is my current list:
4xChalice of the Void
4xBack to Basics
2xBlue Elemental Blast
2xHydroblast
2xSerum Powder
1xTormod's Crypt

[nineisnoone]

Just to be sure we are on the same page with Chalice, you would be running it pretty much exclusively for Chalice @ 0 right?  I just read my post and wondered what I was thinking because Chalice @ 1 or 2 would hose your combo, and figured that must have been what I was thinking.  You might also want to switch the Crypt for Relic if you decide to go with that direction.

Ahh, your right about Counterspell.  I didn't realized you don't run much acceleration.  Muddle the Mixture still does seem like a decent addition.  Though I'm not sure what transmute package you would run with it. 

With 19 Artifacts you can also consider Thoughtcast.  I run it in my Bomberman deck which has about 20-ish artifacts and can often cast it for 2 mana. 

For the sideboard, I would play Gainsay over Hyrdo/Blue Elemental Blast.  Unless you really expect there to be more Red than Blue in your meta. 

I would consider Grindstone 2-3 and Top 2-3 to be on the cutting board as well.  Perhaps instead of Thirst for Knowledge you can go with Intuition and Accumulated Knowledge/Deep Analysis?  While you would only have a singleton Grindstone you can go Intuition for 3x Trinket Mage when you need it.

[Bone]

Just to be sure we are on the same page with Chalice, you would be running it pretty much exclusively for Chalice @ 0 right?  I just read my post and wondered what I was thinking because Chalice @ 1 or 2 would hose your combo, and figured that must have been what I was thinking.  You might also want to switch the Crypt for Relic if you decide to go with that direction.

Ahh, your right about Counterspell.  I didn't realized you don't run much acceleration.  Muddle the Mixture still does seem like a decent addition.  Though I'm not sure what transmute package you would run with it. 

With 19 Artifacts you can also consider Thoughtcast.  I run it in my Bomberman deck which has about 20-ish artifacts and can often cast it for 2 mana. 

For the sideboard, I would play Gainsay over Hyrdo/Blue Elemental Blast.  Unless you really expect there to be more Red than Blue in your meta. 

I would consider Grindstone 2-3 and Top 2-3 to be on the cutting board as well.  Perhaps instead of Thirst for Knowledge you can go with Intuition and Accumulated Knowledge/Deep Analysis?  While you would only have a singleton Grindstone you can go Intuition for 3x Trinket Mage when you need it.

Thanks for helping me with this deck

I just got a great bid for my chalices and since there is no moxen/lotus stuff in my area I think I sell them. Then I can do -4 Chalice of the Void +4 Gainsay in my sideboard and still keep the REB/Pyroblast. I prefer Thirst over Thoughtcast because it's an instant, but will keep it in mind when testing more. The Intiution + Accumulated Knowledge package I feel cost too much mana, and the Deep Analysis is sorcery. But again you have giving me something to think about. There are alot of things to try out in this deck and feel I need to test alot before next tourney. Also want 4 Force of Will but have not the money for them yet. Ps. tested against alot of rogue decks this weekend with great success.

[nineisnoone]

On TFK versus Intuition there is a rather interesting discussion going on about the merits between the two cards. 

A snippet...

Again, I'll state my hypothesis (since I have little to no time to test right now).

Intuition is better than thirst for knowledge in a deck that relies on a two card, low mana cost combo to win.  This does not mean intuition + ak, this means intuiition.  A stronger tutor package is better than a tutor package + minor draw spells.

This would seem to indicate Intuition > Thirst for your deck. 

I have played with both a bit (Intuition in WGD), and I've found that when I am solely using either to draw for cards, I've always preferred Thirst.  The Intuition investment just for card drawing is usually not worth the overall investment of a Intuition draw package compared to the raw efficiency of Thirst.  However, in a deck like WGD where you can go 2x DA and 1x WGD/animate win condition, Intuition becomes better because you are not just Intuitioning for card draw you are furthering your gameplan.  In a deck like yours I could see a similar play in 2x Academy Ruins + Grindstone or Servant.   

I'm not sure if this means that Intuition is the right card, I'm not really experienced with Painter decks.  But I know that WGD is an aggressive combo deck and thats why it plays Intuition over Thirst, depending on how aggressive you want your deck to be it may become an option.

[Bone]

Testet alot this weekend. I don't like Mystic Remora so much in this deck. It's most likely to get switched out for 2xMana Drain or 2xForce of Will if I get them soon. Want to perhaps put -2 Mystic Remora, +2 Rhystic Study in the deck before next tornament (January 24th) but not sure. Played alot of fish/gobbos deck during playtesting so perhaps it (remora) will perform better in the tournament meta.

[Bone]

Played in a tournament with this deck yesterday:

Creatures { 9}
4 Trinket Mage
4 Painter's Servant
1 Darksteel Colossus

Spells {22}
1 Brainstorm
1 Repeal
1 Ponder
3 Counterbalance
1 Fact or Fiction
2 Mana Drain
2 Counterspell
1 Mystical Tutor
4 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Tinker
1 Merchant Scroll
2 Misdirection
2 Mystic Remora

Artifacts {12}
3 Grindstone
1 Lotus Petal
1 Engineered Explosives
3 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Sol Ring
1 Chrome Mox

Lands {18}
1 Academy Ruins
3 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
1 Tolarian Academy
4 Seat of Synod
6 Islands

Sideboard {15}
4 Serum Powder
4 Leyline of the Void
3 Stifle
2 Hurkyl's Recall
2 Pithing Needle

Played only 4 swiss rounds because I did not make the cut. Won against Flash easily because of Leyline, Serum and Needle. Won against RG Beats easily. But I lost against UG Aggro Landstill and Merfolks. Both decks where very similar. They had fast creatures with islandwalk and they had some way to counter my combo. Kinda crappy think I would have won both those matches if I had Propaganda in play. Will most likely include 4xPropaganda in my SB for the next tournament. Is there some other changes I can do to improve the deck? (2xMana Drain, 4xForce of Will, Power is allready on my want list) Feel I need more draw, what about the Intuition package? What cards should I take out and what cards should I put in to include it? Thanks

[EnialisLiadon]

Not to hijack the thread, but what did the flash deck look like, with 9 slots to fill to cover the missing 3 Brainstorm, 3 Flash and 3 Merchant Scroll?

[Bone]

Okay, not so mono blue anymore. Here is my updated list after last tournament:

Major changes:
Added Black for 4xConfidant, Vampiric/Demonic + Yawgmoth's Will
Added Red for Pyroblast and Red Elemental Blast
Platinum Angel instead of Darksteel Colossus

Creatures { 13}
4 Dark Confidant
4 Trinket Mage
4 Painter's Servant
1 Platinum Angel

Spells {21}
1 Brainstorm
1 Repeal
1 Counterbalance
1 Merchant Scroll
2 Mana Drain
1 Mystical Tutor
4 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Tinker
2 Misdirection
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Yawgmoth's Will
3 Pyroblast
1 Red Elemental Blast

Artifacts { 8}
2 Grindstone
1 Lotus Petal
3 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Sol Ring
1 Chrome Mox

Lands {18}
3 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
1 Tolarian Academy
4 Seat of Synod
2 Steam Vents
2 Watery Grave
3 Island

Sideboard {15}
4 Serum Powder
4 Leyline of the Void
3 Stifle
2 Hurkyl's Recall
2 Engineered Explosives

[Sporkcore]

Have you thought of playing Lim-Dul's Vault over some of the Tops to act as a pseudo DT to help find combo pieces? I've found that multiple Tops tend to clog up the hand and don't do much when you have more than one on the board.

[LordHomerCat]

Have you thought of playing Lim-Dul's Vault over some of the Tops to act as a pseudo DT to help find combo pieces? I've found that multiple Tops tend to clog up the hand and don't do much when you have more than one on the board.

As opposed to multiple Lim-Dul's Vaults, which just fill your hand with cards that you don't want to cast because you have set up the top of your deck AND cost you a card each if you do want to cast them so every one you draw is basically a mulligan (particularly after the first!).

Extra tops don't sit on the board, they turn into the best card on top and then are shuffled away.  That's the beauty of the thing.