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Author Topic: GWb or RWb Aggro control: The answer to mana drain?  (Read 7986 times)
Guli
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« Reply #30 on: May 13, 2009, 03:49:26 pm »

I have always had this personal issue running REB main deck. But if it is ever justified it must be in the current times.

How are the wasteland/basics effecting the mana base? Do you find yourself in the position that you can't cast things sometimes? (for example hide/seek)

What does Grunt do in here? Don't say ichorid cause grunt doesn't cut it anymore.

How is the shop match up?

Looks like this deck indeed should walk over blue. But doesn't it weaken the other match ups? Is the SB enough to take the 2 post board games?

These are some questions I wanted to ask on the spot. Don't get me wrong though, I think that list should walk over blue all day long IF you get paired against them at least.
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smasher
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« Reply #31 on: May 13, 2009, 04:36:46 pm »

I have always had this personal issue running REB main deck. But if it is ever justified it must be in the current times.

How are the wasteland/basics effecting the mana base? Do you find yourself in the position that you can't cast things sometimes? (for example hide/seek)

What does Grunt do in here? Don't say ichorid cause grunt doesn't cut it anymore.

How is the shop match up?

Looks like this deck indeed should walk over blue. But doesn't it weaken the other match ups? Is the SB enough to take the 2 post board games?

These are some questions I wanted to ask on the spot. Don't get me wrong though, I think that list should walk over blue all day long IF you get paired against them at least.

My metagame is a lot more blue decks than anything else. REB maindeck works great. If I face something like shop or ichorid it gives me an easy time boarding in everything I want.

The manabase does pretty well. Designed to deal with wastelands yet still have a decent amount of each color mana. Hide/Seek is easily castable. It can be hard to back it up with REB or Duress unless you have plenty of mana in play. The trickiest part is deciding what basic to get first if you find yourself facing wastelands.

Grunt is my goyf for the most part with the bonus of doing one of a few things.
A) Recycling cards in my yard.
B) nerfing opposing yawgwill.
C) Helps with ichorid. It is not enough by itself but after boarding it's one more tool. He blocks an ichorid and lives. You can skip his upkeep to yank out bridges. And if he is your 2nd piece of disruption he can usually handle what is left.
D) shoving fetches and other useless cards back into your opponents deck.
E) Helping with random aggro decks which are a big weakness

The shop matchup is winnable. It can really go either way but after boarding I think I should have a slight advantage. Hiding stuff is good if they are running welders and even if they don't have welders its an answer. I have also found if I resolve goblin welder I am in a really good position. I think my deck does better versus an aggro list than it would against a more dedicated prison list. One of each basic helps regardless of what version I face.

I haven't had the luxury of playtesting versus ichorid but in tournament play I have won more than I have lost to ichorid. The match will almost always go to game 3 but it mulligans pretty reasonably and should be able to keep a hand with disruption and mana.

I don't have as much Oath hate as I would like to make that match go smoothly. Probably take the canonist out of the board for the 4th hide/seek and try to fit in a 3rd edict to the board for something.

The deck is designed to beat a blue deck first and foremost and I am willing to have dead cards game 1 vs some other stuff. If I can get a drain deck round 1 and get in the winners bracket then the odds of seeing blue decks keeps increasing with each round.



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Nether Void is absolutely terrible. I can't envision any game I've played with The Deck where I would have wanted everything to be mana leaked.
Guli
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« Reply #32 on: May 17, 2009, 12:34:20 pm »

Just wanted some feedback on a list I have been working on, that I am having a lot of fun with.
First, the list:

Mana (22)

1x Black Lotus
1x Mox Jet
1x Mox Emerald
1x Mox Pearl
4x Windswept Heath
2x Flooded Strand
2x Savannah
2x Scrubland
1x Bayou
2x Plains
4x Wasteland
1x Strip Mine

Creatures (22)

4x Ethersworn Canonist
4x Dark Confidant
4x Tarmogoyf
3x Gaddock Teeg
3x Aven Mindcensor
4x Elvish Spirit Guide

Spells (16)

3x Duress
3x Thoughtseize
4x Null Rod
4x Swords to Plowshares
1x Demonic Tutor
1x Demonic Consultation

SB
4x Seal of Cleansing
3x Extirpate
3x Pithing Needle
2x Umezawa's Jitte
2x Viridian Shaman
1x Duress


I got this list from the improvement section. It was posted a while ago but I think it is interesting to see the similarities of the ideas posted in this thread. The list lacks Edicts though but that is just an easy replace with STP. Also the tutors can be cut, i don't think tutors belong in these kinds of decks. Room can be made for Qasali Pridemage. This kind of builds is what I am talking about. Will the ROD+Strips, Duress effects, Answers to Tinker and combo/control, the tarms be enough? It seems all solid cards to me, and frankly if this kind of creature base and disruption package don't work what will work? These are relatively the best cards to go for in fish without blue.
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Miaou
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super_miaou@hotmail.com Miaou296
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« Reply #33 on: May 19, 2009, 01:24:21 pm »

I posted what I believe is a nice BGW list in the improvement forum, so I won't repeat it here. But looking at that list you are totally right about the tutors. Inkwell wasn'T printed yet, hence the STPs and the Canonists shouldn't be in these colors, I don't know what I was thinking Razz I see Canonist in a build using red, as Canonist + REB or Mindcensor is a very good out to Tinker Very Happy
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