New TimeTwister (M11 Spoiler)

[Troy_Costisick]

They Finally Did It!

Time Reversal  
Sorcery  
Each player shuffles his or her hand and graveyard into his or her library, then draws seven cards. Exile Time Reversal.
Illus. Howard Lyon #75/249

What do you guys think?  Playable in TPS/Storm Combo?

[meadbert]

My guess is this is worse than Time Spiral which only costs 1 more, but has the bonus of untapping lands.

Getting that extra 1 mana to play is tough though.  Maybe this is like a Jar that cannot be Tinkered.

[Delha]

My guess is this is worse than Time Spiral which only costs 1 more, but has the bonus of untapping lands.

And is legal in Standard. I honestly didn't expect to see another Twister printed, ever.

[i_set_fire]

Twister is good in TPS because of the low cost.  the value of the card is limited if you have to wait a couple turns and then devote all your mana to using it.  twister's value is at its highest turn 1 so you can give your opponent a new hand, be very hard to get a turn one "new twister" off. 

my experience with twister beyond turn 3-4 is pitch to FoW or a hail mary.

[Lemnear]

Playing 5 Twister TPS sounds funny ... chome moxen are auto included

[DubDub]

My guess is this is worse than Time Spiral which only costs 1 more, but has the bonus of untapping lands.

And is legal in Standard. I honestly didn't expect to see another Twister printed, ever.

Three months of Lorescale Coatl + Jace TMS + Time Reversal before Shards block rotates out.

That's attacking for 6 on turn four, and attacking for 17 on turn five.  Accelerate by a turn and add two damage with T1 Noble Hierarch.  If only there were some way to make sure it connects, like giving it flying (Elspeth), or tapping all their dudes (Sleep/Gideon).

As far as Vintage goes, I think 1-of Windfall alongside sets of Diminishing Returns and Time Spiral already fill the niche this card is looking for.  I love seeing this card though, perfect for an EDH Twister.  Better than the last all-draw: Incendiary Command.

[MaximumCDawg]

Is this better or worse than Diminishing Returns?

I'm thinking worse; I'd rather lose 10 random cards from my deck than wait an extra turn to Twister.

[Delha]

Is this better or worse than Diminishing Returns?

I'm thinking worse; I'd rather lose 10 random cards from my deck than wait an extra turn to Twister.

I'm leaning towards better. DR means eating slots with extra copies of Tendrils.

[zeus-online]

I don't see this as playable in vintage...And my bet is that it's not really playable in any other formats either. I could see a Type2 G/U mana ramp deck just casting elves, explores etc. and then reloading with this.

[MaximumCDawg]

I don't see this as playable in vintage...And my bet is that it's not really playable in any other formats either. I could see a Type2 G/U mana ramp deck just casting elves, explores etc. and then reloading with this.

It says "Draw Seven Cards."  It will be playable, somewhere.

[Delha]

I don't see this as playable in vintage...And my bet is that it's not really playable in any other formats either. I could see a Type2 G/U mana ramp deck just casting elves, explores etc. and then reloading with this.

It says "Draw Seven Cards."  It will be playable, somewhere.

How many cards on this list saw play in a format other than "Kitchen Table"? I'd bet it's less than a third.

Edit: Looks like I forgot to include the link originally. Doh.

[Troy_Costisick]

It's up to $25 on SCG already.  That's just ridiculous.  It's not THAT good.  There's just not enough combo and fast artifact mana to make that card work in any format except Vintage and maybe Legacy.  It is way over hyped now.

[vassago]

It's up to $25 on SCG already.  That's just ridiculous.  It's not THAT good.  There's just not enough combo and fast artifact mana to make that card work in any format except Vintage and maybe Legacy.  It is way over hyped now.

You say this like this card wont be the shit in standard. This card will give the control decks infinite gas. Nothing better than buying time while constantly getting lands out of your deck. I am failing to see why this card wouldnt be absolutely bonkers.

As far as I see things, this says draw 7 on turn seven, so you have counter magic up. Or, it could just be the nuts in the blue green ramp decks. I think this cad will be good in standard, but thats baout it.

[Ten-Ten]

Even though this might not show up in type 1, I am still getting a playset. What can I say, I am a fan of "Twister" like cards. Imagine a gifts pile with: Diminishing returns,Time reversal, Timespiral, Temporal Cascade! (Maybe not).
I can't wait to get one of these in my type4 stack!!

[zeus-online]

I don't see this as playable in vintage...And my bet is that it's not really playable in any other formats either. I could see a Type2 G/U mana ramp deck just casting elves, explores etc. and then reloading with this.

It says "Draw Seven Cards."  It will be playable, somewhere.

Yeah 'cause sway of the stars is nutz right?.... Seriously...It's not "effect" it's "cost-effect", and the deck needs to take advantage of it aswell...That is why i mentioned  / Mana ramp.

I'm pretty sure that 5 mana for this effect is too much in Vintage, legacy and extended....While in Type2 i wonder if there is/will be a deck that can take full advantage of it.

[vassago]

I don't see this as playable in vintage...And my bet is that it's not really playable in any other formats either. I could see a Type2 G/U mana ramp deck just casting elves, explores etc. and then reloading with this.

It says "Draw Seven Cards."  It will be playable, somewhere.

Yeah 'cause sway of the stars is nutz right?.... Seriously...It's not "effect" it's "cost-effect", and the deck needs to take advantage of it aswell...That is why i mentioned  / Mana ramp.

isnt sway of the stars banned in edh?

[AmbivalentDuck]

This seems nutty in legacy only because they have Lion's Eye Diamond. 

This would be that format's first and only playable draw 7, no?  Diminishing Returns messes up a deck too much by threatening to RFG wincons.  The remaining draw 7s are all prohibitively expensive (Sway of the Stars, Temporal Cascade are both above 7 mana) or require waiting (a turn for Magus of the Jar and Dragon Mage, 4 turns for Wheel of Fate, dying for Lich's Mirror).

[MaximumCDawg]

I don't see this as playable in vintage...And my bet is that it's not really playable in any other formats either. I could see a Type2 G/U mana ramp deck just casting elves, explores etc. and then reloading with this.

It says "Draw Seven Cards."  It will be playable, somewhere.

Yeah 'cause sway of the stars is nutz right?.... Seriously...It's not "effect" it's "cost-effect", and the deck needs to take advantage of it aswell...That is why i mentioned  / Mana ramp.

I'm pretty sure that 5 mana for this effect is too much in Vintage, legacy and extended....While in Type2 i wonder if there is/will be a deck that can take full advantage of it.

Standard is this card's home, no doubt about it.  But, five mana is not absurd for Vintage.  It's absurd to expect to always hard cast it, sure, but I suspect there might be some High Tide or Mind's Desire applications waiting to be found.  Any deck that liked Time Twister now can play with four more cards with identical function.  Those four cards will be hard-castable a non-trival amount of the time.  They won't accidentally remove your win condition like Diminishing Returns.  There's gotta be an application for this.

[DubDub]

I don't see this as playable in vintage...And my bet is that it's not really playable in any other formats either. I could see a Type2 G/U mana ramp deck just casting elves, explores etc. and then reloading with this.

It says "Draw Seven Cards."  It will be playable, somewhere.

Yeah 'cause sway of the stars is nutz right?.... Seriously...It's not "effect" it's "cost-effect", and the deck needs to take advantage of it aswell...That is why i mentioned  / Mana ramp.

I'm pretty sure that 5 mana for this effect is too much in Vintage, legacy and extended....While in Type2 i wonder if there is/will be a deck that can take full advantage of it.

Standard is this card's home, no doubt about it.  But, five mana is not absurd for Vintage.  It's absurd to expect to always hard cast it, sure, but I suspect there might be some High Tide or Mind's Desire applications waiting to be found.  Any deck that liked Time Twister now can play with four more cards with identical function.  Those four cards will be hard-castable a non-trival amount of the time.  They won't accidentally remove your win condition like Diminishing Returns.  There's gotta be an application for this.

Time Spiral is just about strictly better than Time Reversal in either a High Tide or Mind's Desire context.  It's a powerful effect, and I'm glad to see it again... for EDH, but I sincerely doubt it will crack Vintage (unless people start playing 1x Twister, 1x Jar, and 4x Spiral and are looking for a seventh such effect (and it would still then have to compete with Windfall)).  Now, if it were an instant all bets would be off.

[nineisnoone]

I want to say unplayable... but Ad Nauseum is playable at 5 mana.  Of course, Ad Nauseum is easier to cast of off rituals.  Mind's Desire is 6 and playable, but is stronger overall.   And of course, if you're already at 5 you probably just want to cast Tezzeret. 

I could see some places where this might be worth messing around with, maybe Drain Tendrils or something.  I'm not really good at making Storm decks though, but I think it is functional as a deck idea.  How good it would be is questionable though.

[AmbivalentDuck]

I strongly suspect that if Lion's Eye Diamond ever comes of the restricted list, this card will become a major offender.  That said, this isn't legacy and we already have 3 mana draw 7's that don't get played.  I'm going to call it now: this card will never see serious vintage play unless Burning Wish, LED, or both are unrestricted.

[Troy_Costisick]

I strongly suspect that if Lion's Eye Diamond ever comes of the restricted list, this card will become a major offender.  That said, this isn't legacy and we already have 3 mana draw 7's that don't get played.  I'm going to call it now: this card will never see serious vintage play unless Burning Wish, LED, or both are unrestricted.

Interesting point.  Does that mean you suspect that this card could be strong in Legacy, perhaps even strong enough to end up banned?

[serracollector]

In vintage, 5 mana sorcery's should win the game.  Period.  There are so many WC that are a lot less and a lot more effective.

On a 2nd note, a deck in Legacy with:

8 x rits
4 x diamonds
4 x Underworld dreams
8 x Draw 7's? (returns, and this)

could be.....interesting?

[Delha]

I strongly suspect that if Lion's Eye Diamond ever comes of the restricted list, this card will become a major offender.  That said, this isn't legacy and we already have 3 mana draw 7's that don't get played.  I'm going to call it now: this card will never see serious vintage play unless Burning Wish, LED, or both are unrestricted.

This sounds about right to me.

FWIW, I could see this being run in Turbofog, or maybe Turboland for Standard. Not saying it'll earn a lasting spot, but I figure it might be "good enough".

[AmbivalentDuck]

I strongly suspect that if Lion's Eye Diamond ever comes of the restricted list, this card will become a major offender.  That said, this isn't legacy and we already have 3 mana draw 7's that don't get played.  I'm going to call it now: this card will never see serious vintage play unless Burning Wish, LED, or both are unrestricted.

Interesting point.  Does that mean you suspect that this card could be strong in Legacy, perhaps even strong enough to end up banned?

Legacy has never had access to real draw7 combo before so it's hard to say.  I suspect this will get another card banned.

[Demonic Attorney]

If we're talking about the card's application in other formats, then there's really nothing relevant left to say when it comes to Vintage.  Closed.