Bob Tendrils 2011

[voltron00x]

If Oath and Shops are more popular, its just more reason to play an anti-Shop build like the one I posted, above.  You just probably need to make sure you have a 2nd Hurks in the SB to beat that Colossus.

[Phele]

We only get Steel Sabotage to combat MUD, and that is only really good preemptively, i.e. Claim is better.

I personally think that Sabotage is a great new tool for any UB deck. Against Shops it usually functions the same way as Chain of Vapor AND it can also counter artifacts. It also generates Storm, even though not as good as Chain of Vapor. Because it is blue I would say in these kind of builds this is better against Shops then Natures Claim. And it solves all the new threats you mentioned (Colossus for example).

[brokenbacon]

Here' the list I've been testing the past little while. Feels more like TPS than Bob though.

4 Dark Confidant
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Tinker
1 BSC
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Yawgmoth’s Bargain
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Time Walk
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Timetwister
1 Necropotence
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
2 Preordain
4 Force of Will 
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Chain of Vapor
1 Nature's Claim
4 Dark Ritual
1 Cabal Ritual
1 Black Lotus
1 Lotus Petal
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Pearl
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Vault
1 Mana Crypt
1 Tolarian Academy
3 Polluted Delta
1 Verdant Catacombs
2 Misty Rainforest
3 Underground Sea
1 Tropical Island
1 Bayou
1 Island
1 Swamp
 
SB
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Relic of Progenitus
3 Duress
3 Trygon Predator
1 Nature's Claim
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Forest

[voltron00x]

BSC with Bob is pretty hardcore!

[brokenbacon]

Haha yeah right? I dunno though, like a lot of the time Bob just feels dead in my hand. Like I'll have Bob, Tinker, and Bargain in my hand and applicable mana for any of them and it feels like Bob is just total deadweight. To those concerned, maybe testing should be done without Bob and with more Preordains or Duresses. (Then again that would be out of the Bob Tendrils thread, your call people).

[ErtaiAdept]

Haha yeah right? I dunno though, like a lot of the time Bob just feels dead in my hand. Like I'll have Bob, Tinker, and Bargain in my hand and applicable mana for any of them and it feels like Bob is just total deadweight. To those concerned, maybe testing should be done without Bob and with more Preordains or Duresses. (Then again that would be out of the Bob Tendrils thread, your call people).

It's for this reason I personally only run 3 Bobs instead of 4.  I found that this was just enough to get them to me when I need them and not get them too often (since you really only need one on the field).

At the tournament this past weekend, I also found myself siding one of them out in certain match ups (ie: anything not workshop based) in exchange for some better control cards so I can definitely see what you're saying.  But I would not want to remove them completely as in the games where I was able to drop one turn 1 or turn 2 they were an amazing resource.

[Onslaught]

The Ritual are of the boards is pretty dead (sign of the time?) and this is an old thread, but my small question didn't seem worth starting a new thread. I'm a big weirdo so my favorite part of Confidant Tendrils from 2007 or so was the way it could board in Negators and become a pseudo suicide black. I know Workshops are making Ritual decks really unappealing right now, but I'd like to try something with four Negators and four Phylactery Lich in the board. I played against a GWSx style deck last that was definitely running more than 5 Duress/Thoughtseize, so when he boarded in Negators game two they were consistently coming down on turn two unimpeded. Lich is a lot harder to cast, but he can block Lodestones all day without dying.

Is there any room to pursue this idea or is it just wasted sideboard space in an archetype that is already a bad metagame call at the moment?

[Shax]

Well if you know there are not many Workshop decks in a metagame Rituals is a good way to KO the other blue decks. Honestly I would make a Ritual deck that drops the Workshop Matchup and goes straight for blues nuts.

[RichardD]

I honestly don't understand how you all can work around landdestruction with only 2-3 basics.
When I played StormCombo I always played 4-5 basic lands and sometimes still got screwed by Strip Mine.
Are you all meeting more powered decks and less hate decks? Or are your Workshop meta's without Wastelands and Crucibles?

[Lemnear]

Only fetch for lands if you need the mana. It's that simple. If you instantly fetch for a basic and got striped you reduce your chance for drawing Lands, too. Stripmine and wasteland are blanks vs. Fetches in play, remember that.

[Onslaught]

I've tried to do as much homework on this archetype as possible, and I see a lot of mentions of doing some mini-Tendrils. How often should this be coming up? A lot of the games I've played so far I've just held back for a lethal Tendrils unless I had to shoot off a mini-Tendrils to survive against an obvious attack for lethal damage. Are there other times that you want to be doing a smaller Tendrils instead of holding back?

It just seems like the concept of doing some smaller Tendrils is brought up a lot, but I'm not sure of when this should be applied.

[brokenbacon]

My major experience with the deck was when Tinker -> Sphinx of the Steel Wind was played out of the SB (against MUD and Fish exclusively), so 2 Tendrils were main. The best way to play that type of deck is turn 1 Bob, turn 2 beats + Duress + Time Walk, turn "2" beats and Tendrils for around 7 or 8. Most of the time games last till turn 3 or so with that type of deck, and mini Tendrils was mostly around 6 or 7 for the win (the opponent's life was naturally brought down from Forces, Fetches, Bob beats, etc.). A lot of the time you would just play a Hurks on yourself and Tendrils for 6 to win, but one goal of mine was to resolve A Call, D Tutor, Lotus, and Yawgmoth's Will. A win was pretty much guaranteed on the spot if you played Yawgmoth's Will with a yard of A Call, D Tutor and Lotus (with other crap like Rituals and Preordains).
Given today's meta of 1 Tendrils 1 Tinker BSC/Memory Jar, I would say a mini Tendrils is a possible plan for survival, but only if you have Tinker and Time Walk in your hand or nearby, or a Yawgmoth's Will ready. I would shy away from a mini Tendrils on instinct with this type of deck right now, because 1x Tendrils is meant to be a lethal sort of thing since you only get one shot at winning with it.
Honestly if you were to go for a plan of "Mini Tendrils to stay alive, then Tinker BSC win," I would recommend you play a control deck over Bob Tendrils because it has the much more efficient and sturdy plan of "Force, Drain, Thoughtseize, Tinker BSC win."

[Onslaught]

I have three Tendrils main and Tinker/Sphinx in the board for aggro, so maybe we're on different wavelengths here.

[brokenbacon]

3 Tendrils main with Tinker Sphinx board? Interesting. Could you show your list please?

[Onslaught]

This is just a very slightly modified version of Duncan's old build tuned to beat MUD. I feel it is the best of both worlds: resiliency against Shops while still maintaining a fair amount of explosiveness.

Even with all the life loss from Confidant/Thoughtseize, I still prefer Yawgmoth's Bargain over Mind's Desire. Since Academy isn't in the deck, getting UU to cast Mind's Desire is pretty troublesome. I can totally see myself cutting Bargain from this list, but for now I feel like the free wins from it outweigh the times where it isn't as good. Swapping out Badlands, Wheel of Fortune, and Bargain for Academy, Mind's Desire, and _____ (probably a basic land) might be the way to go.

5 Moxes
1 Lotus Petal
1 Black Lotus
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Sensei's Divining Top

4 Dark Ritual
2 Cabal Ritual

4 Dark Confidant

4 Thoughtseize
1 Duress
1 Chain of Vapor
1 Rebuild
3 Hurkyl's Recall

1 Mystical Tutor
1 Demonic Consultation
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor

1 Ancestral Recall
1 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
1 Time Walk
1 Timetwister
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Yawgmoth's Will

1 Necropotence
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain

3 Tendrils of Agony

3 Swamp
3 Underground Sea
2 Island
1 Badlands
5 Fetches

Sideboard:
4 Phyrexian Negator
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Yixlid Jailer
2 Sadistic Sacrament
1 Virtue's Ruin
1 Extirpate
1 Tinker
1 Sphinx of the Steel Wind

Negators come in against basically any Jace or Tezz deck. Sacraments are there for other Dark Ritual decks...but nobody is playing them right now, so they could probably be cut for more Yixlid Jailers. Virtue's Ruin is a lot better than Massacre against GW stuff since it kills Teeg and Mindcensor. Extirpate is probably too cute, but it's been useful. I used to have a Darkblast in here to kill opposing Bobs under the assumption that a somewhat slower Storm deck like this wouldn't want to let Bob stick around, but you're still fast enough to capitalize on their Bob life loss and blow them up before getting overwhelmed. I'd really love to find room in the side for two copies of Emissary of Despair, allowing you to become a full fledged beatdown deck when appropriate.

I used to feel like playing a Storm deck without counterspells was risky and would end up feeling extremely uninteractive, but beating with Bob and shooting off a medium sized Tendrils is really fun.  

[brokenbacon]

This is just a very slightly modified version of Duncan's old build tuned to beat MUD. I feel it is the best of both worlds: resiliency against Shops while still maintaining a fair amount of explosiveness.

Even with all the life loss from Confidant/Thoughtseize, I still prefer Yawgmoth's Bargain over Mind's Desire. Since Academy isn't in the deck, getting UU to cast Mind's Desire is pretty troublesome. I can totally see myself cutting Bargain from this list, but for now I feel like the free wins from it outweigh the times where it isn't as good. Swapping out Badlands, Wheel of Fortune, and Bargain for Academy, Mind's Desire, and _____ (probably a basic land) might be the way to go.

5 Moxes
1 Lotus Petal
1 Black Lotus
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Sensei's Divining Top

4 Dark Ritual
2 Cabal Ritual

4 Dark Confidant

4 Thoughtseize
1 Duress
1 Chain of Vapor
1 Rebuild
3 Hurkyl's Recall

1 Mystical Tutor
1 Demonic Consultation
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor

1 Ancestral Recall
1 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
1 Time Walk
1 Timetwister
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Yawgmoth's Will

1 Necropotence
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain

3 Tendrils of Agony

3 Swamp
3 Underground Sea
2 Island
1 Badlands
5 Fetches

Sideboard:
4 Phyrexian Negator
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Yixlid Jailer
2 Sadistic Sacrament
1 Virtue's Ruin
1 Extirpate
1 Tinker
1 Sphinx of the Steel Wind

Negators come in against basically any Jace or Tezz deck. Sacraments are there for other Dark Ritual decks...but nobody is playing them right now, so they could probably be cut for more Yixlid Jailers. Virtue's Ruin is a lot better than Massacre against GW stuff since it kills Teeg and Mindcensor. Extirpate is probably too cute, but it's been useful. I used to have a Darkblast in here to kill opposing Bobs under the assumption that a somewhat slower Storm deck like this wouldn't want to let Bob stick around, but you're still fast enough to capitalize on their Bob life loss and blow them up before getting overwhelmed. I'd really love to find room in the side for two copies of Emissary of Despair, allowing you to become a full fledged beatdown deck when appropriate.

I used to feel like playing a Storm deck without counterspells was risky and would end up feeling extremely uninteractive, but beating with Bob and shooting off a medium sized Tendrils is really fun.  

Looks like a good list. My only qualms: NO FORCE?????????
Sorry but I think you need to make room for Force.
I think swapping out Badlands, Wheel, and Bargain for Desire Academy and a Force is a good call. From your list, (and I really like the 3 Tendrils bit), here's a modification:

5 Moxes
1 Lotus Petal
1 Black Lotus
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault

4 Dark Ritual
1 Cabal Ritual

4 Dark Confidant

4 Force of Will
1 Thoughtseize

1 Chain of Vapor
1 Rebuild
3 Hurkyl's Recall

1 Mystical Tutor
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor

1 Ancestral Recall
1 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
2 Preordain
1 Time Walk
1 Timetwister
1 Yawgmoth's Will

1 Necropotence
1 Mind's Desire

3 Tendrils of Agony

1 Academy
3 Swamp
3 Underground Sea
2 Island
5 Fetches

In this case, the SB could look something like this:
4 Leyline
1 Jailer
1 Extirpate
4 Duress
1 Thoughtseize
1 Tinker
1 Sphinx
1 Virtue's Ruin
1 (Open slot)

I took out Top because in this type of deck, all you need to do is land a turn one Bob, beat, and win by turn 3. Life loss is inconsequential. I believe Force is an incredibly important card in Vintage, and to omit Force is to omit why you play Blue, IMO.
Seriously though I really like the 3 Hurks 3 Tendrils plan. You will be mini-Tendrilsing opponents all the time, really cool idea.

[RichardD]

Basically you traded the mainboard disruption for FoW.
When going fully combo, disruption is more important than counterspells (in my experience).

[brokenbacon]

Basically you traded the mainboard disruption for FoW.
When going fully combo, disruption is more important than counterspells (in my experience).

I can agree with this, but up to a certain point. There are cards that every blue deck must answer immediately, such as Trinisphere or Tinker for BSC. This is where Force is essential, even for combo decks. It stops the opponent's play that lets them win faster than you.
Here's my original build for reference, if anyone wants to see it.

Business (23)
2 Tendrils of Agony
1 Time Walk
1 Timetwister
1 Necropotence
1 Yawgmoth’s Will
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 Mind’s Desire
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Merchant Scroll
4 Dark Confidant
2 Jace, The Mind Sculptor
1 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
1 Ancestral Recall
3 Preordain

Disruption (10)
4 Force of Will
3 Duress
1 Rebuild
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Chain of Vapor

Mana Sources (27)
4 Dark Ritual 
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Lotus Petal
1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Emerald
1 Tolarian Academy
4 Polluted Delta
1 Misty Rainforest
3 Underground Sea
2 Island
2 Swamp

SB
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Yixlid Jailer
1 Duress
1 Thoughtseize
1 Island
1 Swamp
1 Tinker
1 Sphinx of the Steel Wind
1 Chain of Vapor
2 Hurkyl’s Recall

[Daenyth]

Last saturday I audibled to this list I made on the bus ride over to Pandemonium. I did OK, 2-2 in swiss and h4x0rd my way into the top 4.. I could have had a better record with some practice. I also flipped BSC with bob twice. The first time Tendrils was below it and I had lethal storm in hand, the second time my opponent was at 2 life with no blockers. Such things happen I guess. I also had to award myself with a game loss for failure to de-sideboard, so clearly I was not at the top of my game...

I was thinking to tilt the maindeck toward blue, but that ended up not being great because the event came up to something like 5/10 MUD 2/10 dredge. I feel I did pretty well considering that.

I'm interested in continuing to tweak this. I do not think it's optimal. I'd like some way to get it slightly more explosive. The MUD sideboard was good. I feel like I wanted some Yixlid Jailors. Mental Misstep would also be handy, maybe in exchange for a REB.

// Lands
1 Badlands
3 Bloodstained Mire
1 Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Swamp
3 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island

// Creatures
4 Dark Confidant

// Spells
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Black Lotus
1 Brainstorm
1 Chain of Vapor
4 Dark Ritual
1 Demonic Tutor
3 Duress
1 Fact or Fiction
1 Gifts Ungiven
2 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Lightning Bolt
1 Lotus Petal
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Necropotence
1 Noxious Revival
1 Ponder
1 Sol Ring
2 Spell Pierce
2 Tendrils of Agony
2 Thoughtseize
1 Time Walk
1 Timetwister
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
1 Yawgmoth's Will

// Sideboard
SB: 1 Blightsteel Colossus
SB: 1 Flusterstorm
SB: 2 Hurkyl's Recall
SB: 3 Ingot Chewer
SB: 1 Mountain
SB: 2 Nihil Spellbomb
SB: 1 Pithing Needle
SB: 2 Red Elemental Blast
SB: 1 Slaughter Pact
SB: 1 Tinker

[Duncan]

Basically you traded the mainboard disruption for FoW.
When going fully combo, disruption is more important than counterspells (in my experience).

I can agree with this, but up to a certain point. There are cards that every blue deck must answer immediately, such as Trinisphere or Tinker for BSC. This is where Force is essential, even for combo decks. It stops the opponent's play that lets them win faster than you.

You've got multiple lines of play to answer Tinker:
1. Combo them out
2. Use one of your three Hurkyl's to bounce their bot. Usually an early Tinker (which is the most scary) means they've used quite some resources, so you can safely sculpt a hand afterwards.

I haven't played a lot of magic lately (this is my first TMD post in like a year), but I do have a good amount of experience with the deck and I've been following all the metagame trends on my team board / morphling t8's / SCG & ChannelFireball articles.

FoW can be good in Bob Tendrils, but the deck can definately be built without it.

[Onslaught]

FoW can be good in Bob Tendrils, but the deck can definately be built without it.

Agreed, too bad my latest Tendrils deck eschewing FOW was deemed "Creative" and moved out of this forum.