[SCD] Reverence

[BlackVise]

Reverence
 
Enchantment
Creatures with power 2 or less can't attack you.

I've run this in various casual decks over the years and have quite enjoyed it. With Vintage shifting towards creatures I'm wondering if it could prove to be useful, even if only as a sideboard slot.

Pros:
- Stops most creatures played in Vintage (Dark Confidant, Goblin Welder, Snapcaster Mage etc).
- Stops a lone Mishra's Factory.

Cons:
- Doesn't stop Tinker bots or Oath creatures.
- Costs 4 mana, putting it in competition with cards like JTMS.
- Useless against decks with no creatures or very few small creatures.

So, with those points in mind, could this card see some Vintage play, even if only a sideboard card in creature heavy metas?

[bluemage55]

The problem isn't the 4cc, it's the   .

You might as well use Moat, considering that it stops all of the creatures in your pro list anyway.

[evouga]

I'm skeptical about a 4cc card that doesn't stop Delver or Goyf. Meekstone might be more interesting as tech.

[Wagner]

Why not just run Moat at the same CC? It stops all the creatures you listed. What deck are you seeing this in?

[serracollector]

Humility and any recurrable critter, such as blood ghast or mishra's factory with a crucible is 100X better than moat or this in the current meta.

[BlackVise]

Why not just run Moat at the same CC? It stops all the creatures you listed. What deck are you seeing this in?

The reason I've been looking at it over Moat is mostly Trygon Predator, but with Talrand recently being printed it also deals with the tokens he creates (if he ever gets played ). I'm thinking of trying it in a Keeper build I've been working on for a while.

I'm skeptical about a 4cc card that doesn't stop Delver or Goyf. Meekstone might be more interesting as tech.

I'm running a small Trinket Mage toolbox, so Meekstone's a very interesting idea and one I might consider trying.

[Delha]

Humility and any recurrable critter, such as blood ghast or mishra's factory with a crucible is 100X better than moat or this in the current meta.

Sure, Humility + Ghast is much more of a hard answer than Moat or Rev, but a 1-card solution is generally going to be superior to a stronger 2-card solution in Vintage. You often get just one turn to answer a threat, and trying to grab two pieces is just too hard to reliably achieve. I realize getting your face pushed in by hatebears is generally not a 1-turn clock, but I'm still not convinced that Humility + Ghast is better in the grand scheme of things. This also doesn't start going into the number of slots that package is probably eating.

All that said, if one was dead set on running Humility/Moat/Rev for some reason, I would quite possibly take Humility. It protects itself from things like Trygon and Pridemage while also taking the teeth out of utility dudes Bob, Welder, Delver, Revoker, etc.

[serracollector]

Yes the ghast was just an example sorry not really and idea.  But I have seen Keeper lists with crucible and 1-2 factories before.  And yes the fact it turns off all creatures is amazing in itself.

[gkraigher]

you could run it out of the board.  the fact that you can still attack is pretty good

[Delha]

you could run it out of the board.  the fact that you can still attack is pretty good

The fact that THEY can still attack (Trygon, Delver, Griselbrand, Emrakul, off the top of my head) is pretty bad. The fact that running this over Humility means you are deliberately leaving the door open for Confidant/Welder/etc to go nuts is REALLY bad.

[gkraigher]

well trygon cannot attack you.  but you are right, it really doesn't stop most of the things you need to stop.  However, it is good vs the green/white and the red/green creature based decks out there.  where it stops everything in their decks but goyf. 

[Delha]

well trygon cannot attack you.  but you are right, it really doesn't stop most of the things you need to stop.  However, it is good vs the green/white and the red/green creature based decks out there.  where it stops everything in their decks but goyf.

I was referring to Moat, rather than Reverence. It's been argued above that Moat is superior in the vast majority of cases, and my point from there was that Humility is probably stronger than Moat in Vintage as well.

Against GW, Moat and Rev are probably about equal in value (not very). Between mana denial keeping this off the board, and mainboard Pridemages to clean up when it actually lands...

[serracollector]

Wouldn't Humility and Reverence be the lockout?  1 of each?  And if your running white, you also get balance and STP and enlightened tutor.

[Delha]

Wouldn't Humility and Reverence be the lockout?  1 of each?  And if your running white, you also get balance and STP and enlightened tutor.

Running any one of these cards is already sketchy. I think "running two of these is terrible" is about as close to a consensus as you'll find on these boards.