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Author Topic: Adjusting my build for a better match up  (Read 866 times)
Anonymous
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« on: March 05, 2003, 05:58:25 am »

Green Red Tubbies Build:
This build takes off the traditional G/R tubbies and uses some of the cards that you lose when you play G/R vs. playing
Stacker. The G/R build loses 65% of the time to Grow/Atog due to the Psychatog and Dryads just getting to big to fast not to mention Grow/Atogs abillity to go off turn 1 or 2 and kill using Beserk and Fastbond, or the rare occation of them just counterspelling all of your threats. What G/R Tubbies needed was some form of disrupption that would really hurt
Grow/Atog, and guess where the answer came from of course Germany. But anyway on to what the answer actually is:
Main Deck 3 Tangle Wires and 3 Sphere of Resistance. Both cards cripple Grow/Atog. Grow/Atog just can't handle having
it's spells cost 1 more to play and having to tap its lands/artifacts/creatures (the few they have to begin with) every turn as you recure the Tangle Wire's. What do you lose by adding these cards? So far I have found that it has improved some of my worst match up's:
Grow/Atog #1, B/G Void #2. Both of those decks are heavally played in my area and have proven themselves to be dominate force's. No matter how fast your TNT (Tubbies) build is it hates a turn 1,2, or 3 Pernicous Deed or Nether Void not to mention Swamp Ritual Duress Hymn. Yes I know that Sui Black gets recked by TNT but you have to agree that Void and Sui are completly different. Void can afford to drop a first turn Nether Void and be able to recover within the next few turns and while recovering throw land kill at you. TNT hates land kill as is let alone under a Void. So as long as they don't drop that turn one and you get a decent draw you should be able to get a Tangle Wire into play and hope it holds them off long enough to get a fattie through for the win.
 Combo seems to be moving into my area now days as well making TNT harder to win with. With the likes of PandeBurst and Dragon.dec around. I don't see Dragon.dec staying around do to the new B&R list or I should say I don't see it staying in my area after the B&R takes effect. Academy has shown up once or twice also. All of these decks love to sit down against TNT. You hope for a great draw and
for their combo to shit out on them. Or for a first turn Blood Moon to resolve but that is after boarding with the Tangle Wire's and Sphere's if they don't go off on turn one a 1st turn Sphere 2nd turn Tangle Wire should give you some breathing room and hopefully time enough to kill them.
 So moving on to the actual deck list that I will be playing this Wed. 3/5/03 at the local tournament in Detroit, MI and plan on reporting on:

28 Mana Sources
1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Sol Ring
1 Grim Monolith
4 Mishra's Workshop
4 Taiga
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Windswept Heath
2 Forest
1 Strip Mine
3 Wasteland

20 Creature's
1 Anger
1 Druid Lyrist
4 Goblin Welder
4 Juggernaut
1 Karn, Silver Golem
2 Masticore
1 Squee, Goblin Nabob
4 Su-Chi
2 Triskelion

13 Goodies
1 Memory Jar
3 Sphere of Resistance
3 Tangle Wire
1 Regrowth (think it needs to be Genesis or 2nd Sylvan Library in this slot)
4 Survival of the Fittest
1 Sylvan Library

Side Board
2 Bottle Gnomes
3 Compost (I play in a heavy black field of Discard Rack, Void, and Sui)
1 Elvish Lyrist
1 Genesis (think needs to be main and with the empty slot on the board either Red Elemental Blast or Blood Moon)
2 Naturalize
1 Uktabi Orangutan
3 Blood Moon
2 Red Elemental Blast

Any critisism/suggestion's are welcome and thanks for your time.
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Anonymous
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« Reply #1 on: March 05, 2003, 08:07:52 am »

I don't think you really need Masticore #2 in order to beat aggro. A single Masticore and the couple of Triskelions you keep recurring using the Welder will do the job. You should run the hudge Phyrexian Colossus instead of Masticore #2. It's really great against Control, and at worse can be a good blocker against a growing Dryad.

I don't like 3 maindeck Sphere of Resistance because It will mainly be only usefull against Tog, if not countered or else. Furthermore, the aditionnal cost can't be paid with mana from Mishra's Workshop even if you are casting an artifact. That's just a rule point. TNT *can* overwhelm Gro-A-Tog just going into beatdown mode so I don't think it's a really good idea to play Sphere of Resistance. Tangle Wire can be a good solution because Gro-A-Tog plays with a few permanents on the board. But you still don't have tutors for it and a creature solution to Tog can be a better thing.

I'm playing a GRu TNT version with a maindeck Waterfront Bouncer and this is good for me if it hits the table. If it is countered, I can recur it with Genesis. Green has no equivalent bouncer, so what do you think of this :

Dawnstrider
{1}{G}
Creature -- Spellshaper
1/1
{G}, {T}, Discard a card from your hand: Prevent all combat damage that would be dealt this turn.

Green is your main color so you won't have any problems to pay the mana cost. The discard cost is not really a problem once you have survivaled for Squee. Nevertheless, the problem is that Dryads remain on the board and they will eat your Juggys.  

Playing Sylvan Library #2 over Regrowth has always been good for me, because you can protect your key cards against Duress and hymn to Tourach by discarding them on the top of your library. It has an incredibly good synergy with all the shuffle effects you have in the deck (fetchlands and Survival), and is another must counter for control decks. This will also allow you to run less Compost in your sideboard. Compost is great against Sui, but you should really own this deck, as a first turn Duress won't remove Mishra's Workshop or Juggys from your hand. Sideboarding a Flametongue Kavu can be useful then to fight Hypnotic Specters or to wreck bad Sui players that keep their Negators maindeck in game #2 and #3 against TNT.

I personnaly prefer Visahino Heretic over the Sex Monkey. Even if it is mana intensive to abuse, it has a lower CC, can be used each turn and is red, which can be useful when playing under a first turn Blood Moon...

I used to play with 3 Wastelands but I found that I really hate drawing them unless my opponent has dropped LoA or Maze of Ith. Maybe cutting 2 for basic Forests can be a good thing. I play 2 maindeck Squee because I face strong Keeper player with Ebony Charms as good Cunning Wish targets, and lots of Sligh or Weenies, and this allow me to keep using Survival with Masticore on the board.
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Anonymous
Guest
« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2003, 08:13:02 am »

No edit feature on the Unregistered forum

I just forgot to mention that if you fear Nether Void's land destruction, you should run a maindeck Quirion Ranger. It will protect your Forests and Taigas, and as a great synergy with the Welders. Don't forget that when you have Welder on the table, you don't need to pay the 3 additional manas to cast your tubbies if you can't afford to. Just pay their cc, have them countered by Void, and use Welder to get them back. I personnaly don't lose to black based decks, and I have to face Sui, Nether Void or variants (Pernicious Deed Void or Void with red for blasts and mox monkey) very often.
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Anonymous
Guest
« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2003, 03:58:02 am »

As I said I would I am reporting on the tourney I just played in. I made top 4 and split the 3rd place price. Changes to the deck before the tourney -1 Regrowth +1 Genesis to the Main Deck and +1 Red Elemental Blast in the board.
Round 1
Paul one of my friends playing a fast stompy sligh with Ball Lightings and the old build with Fetchlands and Grim Lavamacer. He got game one with a very fast burn/Ball Lightning. I didn't have a great hand and none of my creatures stayed on the board not to mention no Survival. Game 2 I board in Bottle Gnomes and take out Druid Lyrist. I get a quick Survival and start recuring Bottle Gnomes with Genesis untill I can build up and kill him. Game 3 is a repeat of game 2 - survival I just had a good hand and rolled him.

Matches 1-0-0 Games 2-1

Round 2
Charlie never seen what his deck really was. I seen a Werebear and Call of the Herd and burn and I seen blue mana sources but no control and no creature's. But anyway game 1 and 2 went like this turn 1 fattie turn 2 Tangle Wire thanks for playing.

Matches 2-0-0 Games 4-1

Round 3
I get paired down against my worst match up Matt Pember playing Academy "WHAT FUN". Game 1 I go first and drop a Sphere of Risistance and Tangle Wire I then proceed to draw no more land. Game takes forever he finally combo's me out. Game 2 I board in 3 Red Blast and 3 Blood Moon's. I go first and get a first turn Su-chi and say go. He drops a Helm of Awakening and says go, I proceed to drop my hand into play and kill on turn 2 or 3 with a Survival and Anger in the graveyard and a bunch of Fatties.
Game 3 If I could have predicted my top deck and not have been a bad player I would have gotten a Blood Moon into play on turn 3 and more than likely won but instead I decided that durring his endstep I would Red Blast his Mind Over Mater just because I could. Playing things durring end steps are not allways the ringht play is what I learned. I lost a turn or 2 later due to the combo.

Matches 2-1-0 Games 5-3

Round 4

Jason he is a regular in the area and known for playing off the wall decks. This week he was playing a Survival of the Fittest/Sliver Deck. Game 1 and 2 went quick by me going first turn Juggernaut 2nd turn Tangle Wire. My MVP of the night for sure Tangle Wire.

Matches 3-1-0 Games 7-3

Top 4 consist of Matt Pember playing Academy he plays Matt Pety playing B/G Void all I know is that Void won the match.

I play against Ken playing Grow/Atog. Game one he starts to go off but doesn't have a creature to kill with and doesn't hit one. I win on turn 5 or 6 After my first 3 turns are force of willed turn 1 Masticore(forced), Turn 2 Tangle Wire(forced) Turn 3 Sphere of Resistance(force) WHATEVER! turn 4 I got a fattie and then proceed to win with a few. Game 2 I board in Blood moons and Red Blast. He goes off on turn 3 or 4 and Beserking a Tog wins him the game. Game 3 I get a 2nd or 3rd turn Blood Moon on top of a Tangle Wire. He is locked down. I proceed for the next 7 or 8 turns to draw nothing but manasources and Sphere of Resistance. I finally get a Su-Chi and Juggernaut and active welder but he got a dryad up to 5 with his one basic island and Mox Emerald. I never seen a Survival and Lost due to the Great abillity to draw manasources out the ass.

I split the 3rd place with Matt playing Academy and Matt (Void) and Ken (Grow/Atog) split the 1st and 2nd prize.

Over all I was happy with the deck just wish I would have seen Survival of the Fittest when I really needed it. Ohwell theres this Saturday in Chicago if I get to go.
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