[deck discussion] Combo Mill in T1

[xrobx]

Hello everyone,
some of you may remember me from awhile back, others/newer members may not; I used to have an account here and was an active user of TMD and spent many hours reading, discussing, and ultimately helping evolve TMD and it's excellent archive of information.  Needless to say, I'm back for the time being and will try to participate actively in discussions throughout these forums  

Since I've started up on here again, I want to talk about something that may/may not have been overlooked on the broad scale of Tier 1/2/3 decks, hence any that could potentially pose a threat in a T1 tourny environment.  I want to discuss the possibility of making a viable T1 mill deck, with the win condition utilizing the storm mechanic of....who guessed it...brainfreeze.

I'm not sure of the best way to fuel this deck yet, as I have only begun limited playtesting, but from my results I've had a fairly steady 3-4th turn win with this deck, milling the opponent between 80-240 cards.  Before anyone starts up and says "oh, but dragon/charbelcher are faster!" please, retain from these statements!!  The purpose is to discuss this deck and it's relevence in a T1 tier 1/2/3 environment, possible additions/efficiencies to the deck, if we can make it better, and ultimately is it a viable deck for T1 tourny play.

Enough talk, my idea below begins with a brief decklist.

Mana (21):
4 Polluted Delta
4 Island
1 Tolarian Academy
3 Underground Sea
2 Tropical Island
1 Volcanic Island

1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Ruby
1 Black Lotus
1 Sol Ring

Creatures:
3 Myr Retriever
1 Platinum Angel

Spells:
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Mystical Tutor
4 Duress
1 Memory Jar
1 Future Sight
1 Mind Twist
4 Brain Freeze
1 Tinker
1 Panoptic Mirror
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Time Walk
1 Fastbond
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Copy Artifact
1 Skullclamp
1 Timetwister
3 Fabricate
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Feldon's Cane
1 Crop Rotation
1 Regrowth
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Time Spiral

Mana critiquing is quite allowed, and very encouraged!! Without much play, I've yet to come up with the most efficient land count, so please state your opinions.  As for the rest of the deck...

Creatures:
3 Myr Retriever - great recursion with the numerous artifacts in this deck, also used as blocker to grab artifacts I need.  Great synergy/draw engine with skullclamp as well (ie. 1 in hand, 1 in grave, skullclamp on table    )
1 Platinum Angel - Can serve as a win condition if need be, but is there to keep me from going under 0 life from pain lands/fastbond recursion with will.  Also allows me to stay alive due to lack of cards.  Easily searched for with artifact search.

Spells:
1 Merchant Scroll - fetches recall, mystical, and brainfreeze.
1 Mystical Tutor - fetches pretty much anything I need.
4 Duress - against combo/control = ownage.
1 Memory Jar - a good draw 7, also type artifact, easily searched for.
1 Future Sight - too broken not to play, if this hits the board it's usually game.
1 Mind Twist - easily searched for card that causes HUGE disruption.
4 Brain Freeze - win condition.
1 Tinker - the best artifact search card printed! Easy choice.
1 Panoptic Mirror - I couldn't pass this up; I was also considering running 2, but 1 is working out fine so far.  Mirror with walk under it is game, with tinker it works like a charm, also with duress/time spiral/twister/recall/regrowth/tutor also give me a HUGE advantage.
1 Vampiric Tutor - I've always been skeptical when using this tutor, but again it's almost too good not to use.  2 life doesn't bother me so much, it's just waiting a turn to grab my card - as I do not run brainstorm.
1 Time Walk - needs no explaination.
1 Fastbond - great synergy with future sight/will, and I don't care about the damage cuz of the angel.
1 Ancestral Recall - this card is just terrible.
1 Wheel of Fortune - another draw 7, yet hasn't proved to be the most beneficial choice yet; if this is cut I would also not need red mana/lands.  Don't overlook: this CAN be a win condition under mirror!!
1 Copy Artifact - with all of the artifacts in todays metagame, this proves to be a great choice; whether it's to copy another deadly artifact on the field, or make a copy of your mirror/angel.  It's a great card for 2 mana. I think it deserves the spot...?
1 Skullclamp - excellent synergy with the myr retriever, easily found, low cc, draw engine.
1 Timetwister - slightly better than the wheel in the sense that it's blue, it's only 3 mana, and under mirror it's a great way for me to go off without paying any costs - also costs only 3 under mirror.  Pretty happy with the twister in this deck.
3 Fabricate - artifact search.
1 Yawgmoth's Will - who needs this?
1 Feldon's Cane - if I empty my library I can use it again. Simple.
1 Crop Rotation - gets that desperately needed land.
1 Regrowth - this is also up in the air right now.  It's a great card, and does have relevence here (i.e. brainfreeze, then get it back and cast it again - very seldom is regrowth countered - then brainfreeze for more), also helps me grab my countered card/grab duress and try a second time.  Still, I'm not positive it deserves the spot...?
1 Demonic Tutor - I get card.  2 mana.
1 Time Spiral - High casting cost, yes.  Hard to imprint, yes.  Broken and restricted, yes.  Although it is hard to resolve this card, if it IS resolved it's often gamebreaking.  Under mirror it's broken. (can also produce ridiculous amounts of mana - could be used with card that didn't make cut - ambassador laquatis.)

Ambassador Laquatis didn't make it, as he requires me to pump mana through him (3) when for 2 mana, I can brainfreeze and mill many, many more cards.  The number ratios just don't compare to that of brainfreeze - say a brainfreeze for a meezly 9 cards is equivalent to spending 3 (to cast) + 9 = 12 mana for the same number of cards under a creature.  Also, laquatis is more susceptable to counters, whereas brainfreeze is only hurt by stifle.

The other creature choices were originally scalplexis and raven guild master, but scalplexis proved to high cc and raven, a mire 1/1, to easy of a target.

Please comment with feedback, suggestions, and anything else that you can.  Thanks for your time.

[Fastbond]

The main problem is that the cards lack synergy.  There's too many combos and they're not focused enough.  The second problem, is that many spells are too high casting cost and it's easy for another deck to choke those spells off to prevent the deck from doing anything.  The deck needs to be more focused on one goal casting a lethal brain freeze rather than all those other mini combos.

[goober]

I think the best way to deck someone is to use Brainfreeze over Tendrils in Smmenen's Draw7.  It is very fast, and has FoW backup.  Any other method is too slow, unless you are running a control deck.  This doesn't have FoW which is icreadibly important nowadays.  Charbelcher/Dragon will be able to just win before you can deck them.  Hulk will be able to counter the important spells then zerk over before you can kill them.

If you don't wantto try to go for pure speed by using a Draw7 like deck, then you should really add Mana Drain and Force of Will.  They Drain will let you set up into easier expensive things like Memory Jar and fun Skullclamp turns.

Hpwever, I don't think I can see decking ad a viable way to win because killing someone is always easier.  If you are going the Draw7 route then you should just use tendrils so that you win after 9 spells not 17.  And if you are going control Slaver Lock, Zerking over, or Exalted Angel beats backed with Scrying's massive draw are more effective.

[Kowal]

New decks are good.  New decks when old decks are strictly better are not so good.  Don't lose hope though.  I'm moving this to newbie.

Moved.[/color]

[riggy]

First, I've always loved the idea of Brain Freeze and keep trying decks based around it since it came out.

The problems I see with your list are this:
First, you have no Force of Wills or Mana Drains. This means that it'll be difficult to stop other combo decks from going off faster than yours. Also, it'll be difficult to stop a player from disrupting you.

Second, small brain freezes potentially fuel any deck wtih Welder, reanimation spells, or Yawg Will. My answer to that problem was to play Planar Void. It worked well, and stopped several other decks from going off quite as quickly.

Third, Panoptic Mirror is not a good card. It has been discussed many times, and the verdict is always the same.

Fourth, The only way to create a really big storm count is to recycle the My Retrievers. There's only 3 of them with minimal methods to do the recycling.

Fifth, you'll have problems with Gaea's Blessings. A lot of decks already use it against Dragon.

My suggestion is that if you wish to play this style of deck, to make it more of a control oriented deck in B/U. I used Isochron Scepters for the Brain Freezes  and at one point had actually used Raven Guild Masters also. In my casual deck, the Brain Freezes came out entirely and I played the Guild Masters with Fireshriekers.

The end conclusion that you'll find is the deck isn't powerful enough to compete in most of the powered metas that you'll find.

Hope it helps and good luck with the deck.

[johnstown713]

I saw an interesting version with a bunch of cheap artifacts and then it played retract.  Amazingly enough it was pretty consistent but it ran force of will and mana drains.  They seem almost essential.  Im not sure how competetive this could be but good luck with it.  Aslo what about the new card from fifth dawn called grinding station.  I know the mods wont want me posting ideas with cards that arent't tournament legal yet but here it is:  And it just helps with the win condition although it is slow.
Grinding Station -
Artifact
T, Sacrifice an artifact: Target player puts the top three cards of his or her library into his or her graveyard.
Whenever an artifact comes into play, you may untap Grinding Station.

Johnstown713

[xrobx]

Thanks everyone for the excellent suggestions.

First and foremost, the reason I didn't run counterspell was because the way the deck runs, it's usually not keeping UU open to do shit with, and I ran duress in it's place against combo.  I'm thinking extract for SB...?

Great suggestions though guys, and sorry this got moved to newbee forum; I guess it's not a tier 1 deck which is okay

More suggestions are welcome and encouraged! Thanks again.