Adapting Control Titan to your Metagame

[Negator13]

I've been playing TurboTitan since Hi-Val placed with it in the first SCG power tourney. In these months I have done a ton of testing and tweaking with it, and I consider it to be the strongest deck in the format.

However, a gripe I've always had with this particular offshoot of "Goth Slaver" is that it really doesnt fit my style of play. I tend to play a very controlling, reactive game, often just trying to Slave my opponent for as long as possible instead of just welding in Titan and beating, and sometimes going for AK's with Intuition even if I have a Welder out. Meanwhile I read all these articles and threads about TurboTitan telling me to bust out a Titan turn 2, ASAP, and go all-out aggro.

Added to this 'conflict of interests', if you will, is the fact that Sundering Titan's value has much decreased in the NE meta, with Welders, Oaths, and shops everywhere. Thus I must question whether it is correct to switch out the Titans in TurboTitan for the Pentavus/Slaver lock. Correct for me, that is. The point of this thread is to determine what you guys would run if you were to/are playing an Intuition based Welder deck. There are usually four slots for artifact fat, with 2 orthodox configurations. They are:

2 Sundering Titan
1 Duplicant
1 Mindslaver

or

1 Pentavus
1 Platinum Angel
2 Mindslaver

Also I would like to mention how in all my testing with Titan I have always had a virtually 58 card deck, filling the last two slots with all sorts of different choices. These 'metagame slots' have been, at some point or another:

1 Yawgmoth's Will, 1 Demonic Tutor
2 Fire Ice
2 Blood Moon
1 Crucible of Worlds, 1 Strip Mine
1 Fact or Fiction, 1 Mystical Tutor

So I ask you, which combination of artifact fat, and metagame slots, would you fill out your deck with? Base this decision on your metagame, playstyle, and personal preference, and explain your choice.

Here's a basic list to help:

24 Mana Sources
4 Goblin Welder
4 Brainstorm
3 Intuition
4 Accumulated Knowledge
4 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk
1 Tinker
4 Mana Drain
4 Force of Will
*4 Artifact Fat*
*2 Metagame Slots*

Remember, I'm really looking at Titan, Dupes, Plats, Pents, and Slaver for the Artifact slots. The metagame slots can be whatever suits you best, be it a black splash, a Crucible lock like in Toad's list, or Blood Moon etc. for MD hate.

I thank you for your participation and opinions!

[Hi-Val]

The Panty Bus is useful in an aggro-heavy meta, but in situations where the game is more control-oriented and you're interested in slaving more, Crucible can be a strong bet, especially because of the strip lock you can achieve.

I think it's a mistake to run FOF in this deck because it just takes up too much mana to use, even though it's a sweet card to resolve in this deck. I also think it's a mistake to not have access to an infinite slaver lock.

For me, Titans have been getting progressively weaker due to the fall of 4cc and Hulk. The resiliency that decks pack in the face of Crucible splashes hate  onto Titan. The deck can produce Titans quickly, but they don't tend to do as much as they used to.

You might also want to give Cerebral Assassin a try if you like Titans. It looks like a perfectly good deck and I've been meaning to play around with it for a while.

[Mixing Mike]

Duplicant took care of just about everything that Titan had trouble with.  I'd suggest one MD if you're expecting a lot of Oath in your meta.  I fell that Plats is poor in anything but the sideboard.  The all-aggro style of Titan takes care of most of the problems that Angel would be used for, sans a few combo decks.

You said you were having trouble against Shops, correct?  Just make sure you keep a hand with a mox or two in it and you'll propbably be fine.  This is risky if they have turn 1 Trinisphere though, so be careful.

I actually run my FoF in the board.  I play a lone Wish in the maindeck to clean up some random thing game 1.  FoF is a great spell to resolve, but most of the time it's overkill.  I usually get FoF when I havn't been able to force through their answers by the midgame.

[Negator13]

I've been playing 2 Titan, 1 Duplicant, 1 Mindslaver for 3 months. Lately however I've been leaning towards switching to a 1 Pentavus 2 Mindslaver 1 Open Slot configuration.

I love the Titan/Dupes config. but as Hi-Val said Titan is getting worse and worse, and I think Bus/Slaver suits my slower, reactive play style better than TurboTitan.

So I'm just asking people to state which four fat artifacts they'd use and why.

[Mixing Mike]

If you're going to run that, then Crucible, Pentavus, 2 Slavers, and Angel is pretty good.  Though, when I was using that configuration, Pentavus was only good against Stax and the Welder mirror.  My metagame needs me the keep Pentavus, so I moved Angel out of the maindeck.

[Eddie]

Currently I'm testing a 2 Sundering Titan, 1 Mindslaver, 1 Crucible configuration. I'm often able to get a heavy artifact in grave and weld it in 2nd turn. The problem with mindslaver is that most of the time you can only activate it a turn later in that situation, whereas the Titan has a result right there. Although with diminished effect, I still think the Titan is strong enough in the current meta. I prefer the aggro route here. You still need an infinite slaver lock though, and crucible is better than the bus cause you can use strip for more mana denial, and you can replay your own destroyed land. It is a tight fit, and I really want to fit one more bomb main (Duplicant or Platinum Angel).

Also, to make the mana denial theme complete, I've been playing with Karn. It's not bad, but Duplicant or Angel is probably a better pick.

On a sidenote: I'm still playing black in the deck. Removing it will make room for a bomb. But I tested against Oath, 4CC and TPS and I feel the 2 black cards do make a difference.

[Negator13]

I really dont like Crucible, and I find it worse and worse the more I play with it. For the Slave lock, a Pentavus does pretty much the same thing, because even if you only have one Welder, Pentavus ensures you can slave for 5+ turns, giving you plenty of time to find the 2nd for the lock.

As for the 2nd turn play of Intuition for Citadel, Stripmine, Crucible, this isn't very strong at all. Look:

Turn 1: Land, Welder
Turn 2: Land, Mox, Intuition. Opponent puts CoW in your hand.
Turn 3: Cast CoW, replay Strip Mine, destroy a land...

Since you had to play a land Turn 2 in order to cast Intution, you can't start stripping until turn 3, which is far too late, IMO.

I'd rather just go Turn 2 Intuition for Pentavus, Slaver, Slaver. That 's why I play 2 Mindslaver, 1 Pentavus, 1 Sundering Titan/Platinum Angel at the moment.

[Toad]

Sundering Titan is rather weak in the current metagame. The Workshop decks are immune to the Titan (and you still lose a land), Oath relies on a spell that costs 2 and run Orchards and lots of fetchlands, Combo does not care, etc etc etc... Decks have all shifted away from multicolor dual-based mana bases towards bi-color dual-based or penta-color non-dual based ones.

As for the 2nd turn play of Intuition for Citadel, Stripmine, Crucible, this isn't very strong at all. Look:

Turn 1: Land, Welder
Turn 2: Land, Mox, Intuition. Opponent puts CoW in your hand.
Turn 3: Cast CoW, replay Strip Mine, destroy a land...

That is just because you have the wrong Intuition set up. Just Intuition for Mindslaver, Crucible of Worlds and Strip Mine instead. If they give you Mindslaver, you Weld the Crucible of Worlds and start the Strip Mine lock. If they give you Crucible of Worlds, you have a Mindslaver up by turn 3, do shit with their hand, untap, hardcast Crucible of Worlds and start Striping lands while doing some periodics Mindslavers. This set up is obviously used for Control matchups, where you want the Strip Mine lock early. Against Aggro, you don't care about Strip Mine.

And a turn 3 Crucible lock is *not* too late when facing Control, especially if you can have periodic Mindslavers meanwhile.

[Negator13]

So you think 2 Slaver, 1 Angel, 1 CoW is the way to go?

If your plan is to Intuition for 1 Slaver, why are you running two? And don't you think only 1 Angel for win is weak/risky against opposing Welders and STP's?

Basically I'm asking why you wouldn't run Pentavus. He's amazing vs. opposing Welders and Smokestacks, he gives you the Slaver lock better/as well as CoW, and he does the same thing as Plats game 1 vs. Oath, blocking their flyers every turn.

[Whatever Works]

If its almost unanimous that titan is a weak card in the NE metagame... would you just be better off playing control slaver?

[Negator13]

I'm not playing Titan anymore, I'm playing a version of Goth Slaver, which is basically the same thing without Titans, and with more Slavers and Pentavus. The Intuition engine makes the deck much faster and consistent in getting a Slave lock or just complete control than regular Control Slaver can.

I want to find the best configuration of Artifact bombs and other slots to optimally round out my deck, while creating a discussion of what is best for any individual's metagame.

[Whatever Works]

If that is the case I would probably do this for a NE metagame:
I find that Duplicant is almost a must have vs. Oath...
2 Mindslaver
1 Petavus
1 Titan
OR
1 Mindslaver
1 Pentavus
1 Duplicant
1 Collosus (You love it or hate it)

[breseboy]

In the Ne tournments, control decks appear often so:
2 Sundering Titan
1 Duplicant
1 Mindslaver

Would be a good choice seeing how sundering titan is an awesome card against control decks with multiple colours.  Maybe another mindslaver would be good too.  Duplicant is good against Exalted Angel.  

Your two slots are a tough decision but, I narrowed it down to two:
2 Blood Moon
1 Crucible of Worlds, 1 Strip Mine

Both of these slots are good against control, and therefore should be included.  I like blood moon's synergy with harmful lands to yourself, and being able to lock your opponent.  I think the crucibles are good against control and are good against decks that have crucible in them.  (cancels out)

[Mixing Mike]

I'd rather slave my opponnent than destroy their one basic Island.  It's far more game swinging.

[Whatever Works]

In the Ne tournments, control decks appear often so:
2 Sundering Titan
1 Duplicant
1 Mindslaver

This is true, but I would like you to find me a top 8 NE control deck that doesnt run 4+ basic Islands... and Duplicant usually hits a target like a juggernaught vs 5/3... or a collossus or whatever Oath card your playing vs... Duplicant cant also be welded which is advantagous in most scenario's...

Titan isnt what it used to be in NE metagames... Me/Kowal, and most of the other players who ran 4cc changed decks a LONG time ago... and sinse GenCon its been very hard to find a deck that doesnt either run basics or crucible to protect themselves from Crucible and B2B... Unfortunetly this form of protection screws over Titan though not directly imposed because of it.