[Deck Discussion] - 4C-C - December 2004's Update

Hi all,

I’m here to show you the results of my works and tests with 4C-C.
Because Zherbus’ (the more prodigal mentor of this deck) lack of time or interest for this archetype at now, me and my team-mates lead a “study” around it to try to “upgrade” it enough to “resist” again to the time.

K-eeper and his evolution – 4C-C are my pet decks, so I’m perfectly conscious of both the difficulties of playing them well and the difficulties of doing well with them even if you are playing them well.
There are some reasons to play this deck and there are a lot of hints that I could gave to you in order to focus on “how to win enough” with a common 4C-C build. On the other hand, it isn’t the place or the time to talk about these arguments, because what I’m going to show to you, isn’t only “another 4C-C” but it can be considered at least “worth of some consideration” by itself if not “revolutionary”.

Hypotesis.

In the past ( one month ago ), I could state this theorem in order to justify my choice of playing 4C-C as it is was proposed by Zherbus.

My opponents are strong and they play strong decks
My skills are fine enough to survive enough to lot of them playing their strong decks.

At now, I can’t iterate that theorem anymore. I transmuted it in:

My opponents are strong and, any passing day, they play decks that are far more stronger than before.
Too many among my common opponents or team-mates playing one of the well established Tier1, can simply overwhelm me.
Too many among my common opponents of team-mates playing their strong decks can win without using too many skills, simply because their strong plays are far more stronger and frequents than mine.
My skills aren’t enough to survive to row power.

First Proposed Thesis

It is time to sell myself to my own enemy and play C-Slavery or Atog or Oath or anything else with a better ( or more focused on some particular match-up ) winning rate against the rest of the field?

Answer to the First Thesis

Nein!!!
And again…
NEIN!!!!!!!

Multiple Answers and Thoughts about any other possible Thesis

I tried to focus a lot the cards that usually can gave to my opponents a quick win or a strong advantage towards my deck.
I made a list of deadly cards and situations that a possibly new configuration of the deck should have avoided in order to gave me an edge over my opponents.

1) Trinispheres and the “…going second against any deck that pack 5 Strips and/or Smokestaks…” are some of the scenarios in which I lose more frequently.
2) Welders and my inability of dealing with them because of point 1) is the second far more frequent losing scenario
3) If an Intuition for something usually resolve, I’m usually unable to consistently deal with anyone of the subsequent opponent’s spells
4) Any deck that pack a lot of Intuitions, is usually far more stronger than you on countering things and being able to protect permanents because of a better draw engine
5) Any actual good combo deck can be able to get rid and win against decks that can successfully resolve a sequence of spells as the following one: Duress --> Drain --> FoW --> "Something else". You aren’t able to Duress away anything so, by definition, you are in a worst position if compared with those decks.
6) Chalice of the Void is your worst enemy especially if used in a deck that pack more than 4 counterspells. It is a card that set at 1 and/or 2 can completely shut up too many of your resources. Being unable to protect your bombs and/or your solutions to it as well as your opponents is deadly especially post side during the control mirrors, when you can’t use additional artifact removals and all your best solutions usually die to cotv for 1.
7) Opponent’s basic lands and fetchlands prevents you from consistently use one of your best way to slow down the game: Wastelands. A lot among the opponent’s deck are going to use and capitalize Moxen and any other form of mana acceleration one-shot, being able to gain mini-TimeWalks despite your outgoing denial plan and usually trying to win in a single big turn.
Relying only on the infrequent Stripmine to always being able to apply you denial plan and being unable to stop an Atog.dec or a Tendrils.dec from winning with your Gorilla Shamans, let me think about the lowered impact of a denial strategy in a modern approach to the game.
8) Ug-Oath.dec with his shitty new land can be able to deal with all your removals and counters because of his extraordinary draw engine without any problems. If you focus on beating post side an Oath.dec, you are going to lose game 2 too. You would pack in your strong Ray of Revelations and you would lose to Morphlings and CotVs.
9) Any one of those previous decks are characterized by more efficient draw engine with an always cheaper casting cost. While you are clunked with your overcosted spells in hand, they can freely win the “tempo-oriented-game” by starting winning faster than you.

Imho as it is now, there are some matchups that are nearly unwinnable with 4C-C, if not for some unpredictable reasons:

1)   2C-Oath
2)   3C-Atog
3)   2C-TPS
4) 2C-Control-Slavery

The main reasons are:

1)   They have a better mana base.
2)   They have a better draw engine.
3)   They have better win conditions.
4)   They have a more synergic way to protect their bombs
5)   They don’t lose time and games continually topdecking lands during their respective mid-game.

Searching for a better mana base

The number of 26 mana fonts seemed written in stones and Imho, it is the good amount of lands and artifacts to pack in a deck that must have a lot of colorless mana sources too.
I lowered the total number of Strips and I consequently lowered a bit the total number of land.
I felt the need of being able to have more basic lands but without losing any one of my 4 colors. Infact, any one of them seemed to perfectly cover a role in my deck and I couldn’t cut anyone of them without losing power or transmuting the deck into something else.

I tried this “conservative” mana base in my primarily tests.

4 Fetchlands
4 CoB
5 Duals
2 Island
6 SoLoMoxen
4 Strips
1 LoA

This mana base perfectly covered my need of being able to support any secondarily colour without changing a single maindeck card. I was usually able to fetch “solid basic lands” in almost anyone of my games relying on fetchlands and cobs to support the other colours.
The number of damages done to me by all my spells and mana fonts was terrific, but the goal of being more stable was reached.
On the other hand, while I obtained a decent mana base, I didn’t acquire anyone of the things that I tried to correct:

1)   Speed – Needed to search for answers
2)   Solidity – Needed to survive enough for winning
3)   No Dead Draws

The high number of 5C-manafonts and the lowering impact on the game of my denial plan forced me to try Engineered Explosives in the Shamans’ spot.
It was love! They were perfect! I swapped them in for my red creatures and I don’t miss Shamans a single time. They provided to be a good Removal, a better way to deal with Chalices and a reset button for almost anything that the opponent could resolve. For anyone of the other things I have my Wishes.
The addition of a so “hungry of colour” card and my need of being able to accelerate the mana base development as much as I can to compete with the other Tier1, forced me to try to add to the deck all the possible “good” 0cc accelerations.
Reading the JP’s article and his extreme experiment on coloured mana base was a fulguration!
Now I have a better idea on how move and how try to develop my future mana base.

This was the next step.

3 Strips
5 Fetchlands
3 Duals
3 CoB
6 SoLoMoxen
1 LoA
2 Islands
1 Plain
1 Swamp

I was not completely sure about the total number of the lands ( 25 instead of 26 ), the Plain and the respective rate of some lands’ quantity.
On the other hand the whole deck, ( with the only maindeck change -2 Gorilla Shaman +2 E.E. ), seemed to perfectly fit one of my goal:
”Resist as well as I could to color screw and artifact.dec, without changing a lot the maindeck asset”
These changes at the mana base let me to survive to a first turn Trinisphere relying only on my good old basic lands and a true faith on Statistic Science; My opponent CAN’T always hold a Strip after his CoW or Trinisfere.

My experiment are now going to different directions with some other minor changes. I noticed that while CoBs are fanstastic as “secondary colours enhancer”, it leave me with 3 more “Wastable and not Fetchalble” lands in my deck. I cannot have access to them and I ALWAYS have a bad mid-game topdecking thanks to their presence. While I fetch a lot through my deck, the TOTAL number of lands INTO my deck didn’t lower enough to prevent me to draw them EVEN during my late game. It was always deadly. In every match-up. On the other hand, not having any necessity to fetch for anything different from Blue ( or at worst Black ) during my initial turns, I realized how useless would be having more than 2 or 3 multi-colored mana fonts contemporarily in play. My game plan would be completely ractive and I could have waited to search for the right coloured dual ONLY when needed and rising the number of Fetchlands and the number of Fetchable lands, I would have been able to have all the needed mana options as well.

At this moment the mana base would become:

6 Fetchlands
3 Duals
7 SoLoMoxen
1 LoA
3 Strips
3 Islands
1 Swamp
1 Plain

I opted to use 25 mana fonts again, because I cut the 4th Strip effect and I didn’t mulligan more than before because of it.

A full set of Moxen, a lot of Artifacts in the maindeck and a large spread of high casting cost spells suggested me about adding Tolarian Academy to my maindeck too. I tried it and it was really game breaking any time it was laid soon during the game. If it remain into the deck until the mid-game it can be considered another “dead draw” when in topdecking-mode. It took the place of the Plain, because I didn’t feel really convinced about Exalted Angels as finishers and the Plain was here only to let me consistently flip them face up.
My plan of being able to abuse and reuse anyone of my lands with my own Crucibles of the World convinced me that a single dual for each blue-based type would be enough to have access to any colour of the deck during all the match. I leave the Swamp because it would be sure of being able to resolve ANY one of my black bombs at any time during the game.
The basic lands would be almost untouched for all the game and the only Wastable target would have reused when needed.

Searching for a better draw/tutors engine

I would like to improve anyone of the other bad control matchups as well as my mana base, but I had no real new ideas on how to beat Tog or Oath or C-S or TPS if not changing my deck into a bad Tog-Clone, Oath-Clone or C-S-Clone.

I noticed that their biggest advantage is to have a strong path to victory while my hugest handicap was ALWAYS the high number of conditional cards in my hand that need the right time to be abused.as I could. A good first approach on rising the winning rate against them would have been lowering the count of “dead cards” for each match-up.
I tried to progressively adapt the total number of my spot removals only to realize that, in the end, only winning conditions and conditional cards as spot removals were the only cards that I could have cut or changed.
StPs are really strong against aggro and aggro-control decks but they are useless against Combo decks and anyone of the other fearing Control decks. Tog and Oath usually overwhelm you with drawers and counters, leaving you with those useless removals in hand, until they are able to protect their own bombs with ease. C-S usually kick your ass with too many equally threatening spells leaving you without being able to block them all.

Coupling these thought with my old game evidence that Cunning Wishes with a “slow” mana base development aren’t so hot while your opponents can resolve a first turn Oath or Intuition or Welder or a lot of those damn things, I tried to “speed up” the mana base for a better use of my Wishes.
My good game results with the new configuration forced me to think that I was on the right way: I should have been able to search for answers in a more effective way. Because only Cunning Wishes really satisfied me I tried to add a full set of them. To speed up the mana base, I didn’t add only my Mox Emerald, but I added the Mana Crypt too.
4 Wishes and 2 E.E. started to perfectly cover the “removal’s role”; while E.E. was far more than a simple removal, Wishes are always able to fetch Solutions or Drawers or Counters to me. I didn’t feel to have dead cards in my maindeck anymore and I tried to augment the sinergies with the rest of the deck.

I kept a full set of Skeletals as skeleton of my draw engine because of their inner sinergies with Wishes, Brainstorms and Fetchlands. I was always able to resolve a Skeletal for 1 or for 2 during my own first turn and it was a really good sensation from my own gaming perspective. The deck seemed to develop any days better.

There are a lot of inner strategies and options that a full set of Wishes could gave to me.
I could leave more than one drawer in my sideboard and I decided to add both Gush and Skeletal Scrying number four to my side, lowering the total number of maindeck Skeletals by 1.
It is really strong to be able to “use” a first turn Wish to search for a removal or a counter ( thanks to my accelerated mana base ) and to be able to use a second and even a third one of them without regrets soon after for different things. I could always optimize some key plays thanks to Cunning Wishes. I always considered them my 4 Vampiric Tutors and I was ecstatic to be able to search for anything in my maindeck faster than before.
Having 4 Wishes forced me to play in a more aggressive way, being able to resolve and protect my bombs faster and better.

For a Better Protection

I watched at my deck and my only complaint was to be unable to resolve a lot of my bombs, especially because I lack the right amount of counters or bombs to face deck with 12 counters and bombs.

I tried to add Duresses and Misdirections to my maindeck, rising the number of proactive and reactive protections of the deck and retrospectively rising the number of blue cards

I tried this configuration.

4 Drain
4 FoW
2 Mis-D
2 Duress
1 Mindtwist

While on chart a good mix of Duresses and counters is the right way to win in a modern Magic’s game, my deck seemed to engulf itself by playing them AND the new mana base. The need of usually fetch the black basic mana source prevented me of being ALWAYS able to Drain something on turn two, relying only on my FoW AND THEN on my third turn Mana Drain. Mis-Ds revealed to be one of the best choices done until now because they helped me to win counter wars, redirect removals and random burn on my opponent and redirect to me a lot of Drawers. While, I was searching for some solution about the Duresses’ issue, I realized of having at least 60-61 cards in my deck and no space to abuse of my best mirror’s cards: Decrees of Justice and Crucibles of the World.

Even if Duresses were really strong, I decided to cut them for all the previous problems with my mana base and I decided to add a couple of CoWs in their spot. OMG! I reached my well balanced maindeck configuration in this moment! Soon I noticed that I could interpret any game played in a more synergic and more elegant way. All my old and tricky game plans were enhanced by the new addition and a lot of my troubles about some control mirrors fade away.

I have more counters
I have more bombs
I have a good draw engine and an uncounterable finesher
I have a faster and more synergic way to grab anything I need without losing too much time.
I have a faster and more solid mana base development that avoid by itself anyone of the problems of the common non basic hate that usually curse Keeper.
I have some “reset buttons” that could let me survive to almost anything commonly played and that are an additional way to escape to some nasty locks.
I have added sinergies and all the cards in the decks aren’t chained to other cards in a strictly and limitative way. They are ALL useful by themselves and they are imho, some of the best choices available at the moment to be able to face a large spread of threats

At last but not the least, I have better game results against:

1)   Oath.dec
2)   TPS.dec
3)   Atog.dec
4)   C-S.dec
5)   MW.dec
6)   Fish.dec

I don’t want to add numbers at my victories because only by playing the deck more and more, you could be able and realize how much it is consistent and strong to play.

My sideboard is one of the things that I mumbled more an more because 15 cards are too few to be well balanced, especially if you have 4 Wishes to optimize with them and the need of a solid sideboard strategy

My maindeck, at now leave out some Aggro and Aggro-Control matchups that could be more easily won with some more spot removals and some Combo Matchups as Dragon.dec or TPS.dec. While anyone of these decks isn’t easily hateable, there are a lot of additions that could be found.

I tried to adapt quantities and strategies while sideboarding and I finished using only Fire/Ices, Rack and Ruins, Red Elemental Blasts, Disenchants and a good mix of Spot removals and Drawers.

Here is the proposed sideboard for a Mixed-Metagame.

( Removals and Solutions )
4 Red Elemental Blast
2 Fire/Ice
2 Disenchant
2 Rack and Ruin
1 Sword to Plowshares
1 Diabolic Edict

( Drawers and Tutors )
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Skeletal Scrying
1 Gush

I felt very proud of the large spread of opponent’s decks and strategies that this sideboard can cover. It isn’t dedicated to any particular match-up, but it don’t leave any possible situations without AT LEAST a single possible solution. The Diabolic Edict is here to try to get rid of some of the un-targetable Oath’s beast. My test results and my experience leaded me to think that it is better to shift the game on winning Counter Wars on Drawers despite of adding solutions to Oath itself, in order to try to win that game. A similar argument can be done for matchups as C_Slavery and Atog. Any one of those decks are heavily touched and kicked by a massive use of ReBs and Wishes. For removals ONLY when needed. I usually pack 3 ReBs against TPSs too and they are ( in the hand ) my only added solution to his extraordinary bombs. Of course, they are not usually enough against it.

Here is the list of my current test.dec.
I hope you’ll enjoy it!

Maindeck

(10/11)
4 Mana Drain
4 Force of Will
1/2 Misdirection
1 Mindtwist

(2/3)
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Mystical Tutor
0/1 Tinker

(6)
4 Cunning Wishes
2 Engineered Explosives

(1/2)
1/2 Decree of Justice
0/1 Goblin Charbleacher / 0/1 Platinum Angel

(5)
2 Crucible of the World
1 Time Walk
1 Yawgmoth’s Will
1 Balance

(9)
4 Brainstorm
3 Skeletal Scrying
1 Fact or Fiction
1 Ancestral Recall

(25/26)
6 Fetchland
1 Tolarian Academy / 1 Plain
1 Tundra
1 Volcanic Island
1 Underground Sea
2/3 Island
1 Swamp
2 Wasteland
1 Stripmine
1 Library of Alexandria
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Emerald
1 Black Lotus
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt

Sideboard

( Removals and Solutions )
4 Red Elemental Blast
2 Fire/Ice
2 Disenchant
2 Rack and Ruin
1 Sword to Plowshares
1 Diabolic Edict

( Drawers and Tutors )
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Skeletal Scrying
1 Gush

Italic Names --> Most Relevant Changes to the Deck
Edit --> List Edited according the last new Changes
Last Edit --> Bad Typing Errors Fixed

Regards,
MaxxMatt

ADDENDUM

I would like those last few lines about some things that I found interesting during my last tests.
I tried to cut a Decree of Justice for another kind of finisher. I have to face a lot of Cranial Extractions and other similar cards, so having different finishers would be great. I decided to add an artifact as secondarily finisher because of the possible addition of Tinker ( in one of the Mis-Ds’ spots ).

With this choice I have:

1)   My usual number of blue cards
2)   An additional way to search for a solution to CotV for zero ( E.E. )
3)   An additional way to search for a good finsher if I need to end the game soon in the early or midgame
4)   An additional way to search for Crucible of the World that is every day passing the best “game stabilizer” of this deck
5)   Another bomb for the early game that is really synergic with my mana base
6)   Another way ( the third ) to get rid of my own Mana Crypt.

I tried to find among all the possible targets for my Tinker different from the most common ones.

I thought about Darksteel Colossus but I want a far more elegant way of winning.

I thought about Platinum Angel to have a way to survive enough to win during long game against aggro and combo decks. It revealed to be really strong, especially because I can try to resolve it with my own mana and not being forced to pass through Tinker to resolve it. On the other hand, my test underline that any opponent had a lot of ways to kill it if needed, during his slow winning clock.

I thought about an additional drawer, such as Mind’s Eye or some other huge drawer but they are all mana intensive and they are too much overcosted.

I thought about using a single Jester’s Cap to slow down some games and win them with ease during the late game, with the single Decree.This strategy is too risky and I didn’ resolve the Cranial Extraction’s issue. In addition to this argument, it isn’t always game breaking and a first turn Tinker for Jester’s Cap, usually leave your opponents with at least a full turn to draw/search/tutor for some winners or some solutions to it.

I thought about Goblin Charbleacher because of his dual role of additional removal and possible finisher. I tried it a lot during these days and it seemed to cover the Decree #2’s role quite efficiently, especially because the deck tend to draw almost any lands of the deck ( if we exclude a little mix of LoA, Strips and Fetchs ) really consistently thanks to the continuous use of CoWs. It deled to me a mean of 6-8 damages for round equalizing the mean number of Soldiers produced by a cycled Decree during turn 10+.

The only other last change that I made to the deck that satisfied me a lot, consisted on swapping the Red Elemental Blast #4 for the Misdirection #2. In this way I have a larger possibility of being able to use Mis-D to counter something, thanks to my full set of Wish and paying for it only cost three mana.

At now, I’m using 61 cards and 26 mana fonts, as reported in the deck list above.
If the “Tinker-Plan” would be strong enough to need a better support, I recommend you to add the Mis-D #2 in the 26° mana spot, leaving the total number of artifacts and spells untouched.