Circle of Life

[Pizzatog]

I obviously have no title or flavour text yet, the provisional title I think is actually already taken.

Thanks to Freelancer for giving me the idea for this in his reply to my green removal thread (I was thinking of something like it, but his idea of making an enchantment really worked for this card). This card makes a bit of a new ruling, so I will post two versions:

This is the version I like (with the change in the rules:)

Circle of Life
{G}{G}
Enchantment
Whenever a non-token creature is put into a graveyard from play, that creature's controller removes it from the game and puts a Forest token into play tapped.
"Something about circle of like or going back to roots or whatever"

In case the idea of Forest tokens makes you a bit uneasy, here is the other version:

Circle of Life
{G}{G}
Enchantment
Whenever a non-token creature is put into a graveyard from play, that creature's controller removes it from the game, searches his or her library for a basic land and puts it into play tapped.
Same flavour text as the other one


Ive been toying around with the idea of land tokens. If you think this could work into the aztec set (along with the green removal card Ive also posted), then Ill probably reword the other card to include forest tokens.

[Freelancer]

The problem I see with forest tokens is that they need to have some text explaining that they are not creatures and that they can tap for G...This may seem obvious to you, but I bet plenty off players will put into play a couple off forest tokens note that p/t isn't declared and put it right back into there graveyard (or make it a 1/1 or worse 11111/11111 w/e) in other words it needs to be a lot more obvious...This means more rules text on the card clogging it up, your second version doesn't have this problem...
I obviously like the second one more...


Oh and thanks for the credit...

[Ephraim]

As with creature tokens, it might be plausible to word this effect, "Put a Forest land token into play..." It's never been done before, so I can't say for certain whether or not it actually works. Presumably, any land of type Forest can tap for green mana. It might need to be clarified with reminder text of some sort.

[Pizzatog]

Yes

Forest, land token works a lot better. That way you have creature tokens and land tokens.

As in the case of the dual lands or blood moon, a land named forest taps for green mana, but an addition to the rules would have to be necessary. The second version is more practical, but the first version is way more flavourful and produces the coolest result.

[Jacob Orlove]

Edit

put a legendary 4/4 colorless Avatar creature token named Kaldra

So this should be "put a basic forest land token into play" (supertype subtype type token).

[Pizzatog]

I dont know, I would like to model land tokens according to the template for creature tokens.

Put a 1/1 green squirrel token. Makes a creature that would read like this:

Squirrel

Creature -- Squirrel
Squirrel is green.
1/1

So, put a Forest land token into play would make a land that reads like this:

Forest
(Token) Land -- Forest (Note that it does not say basic land)
: Add to your mana pool.


My point is that just templating it as put a land token into play, treat it as a forest doesnt tell you anything about the token being put into play, and makes it a bit more confusing to actually play with the thing. I still stand with my minimalist version of the wording, which people say causes too many memory issues:

This creature is a forest.
All creatures are forests.
When a creature is put into a graveyard from play, that creature becomes a forest instead.
etc.

Id rather go with my original wordings that mess with forest tokens, but it seems that general opinion in regards to my post was that it made for too many memory headaches.

[Freelancer]

I still think you should pick the second version, because a complete rules overhaul is a bit to much for 'just' a flavourful card...If you make it a cycle though it might warrant these kinda drastic chances...

[Pizzatog]

Im so tempted at just making the card read:

Whenever a non-token creature is put into a graveyard from play, that creature becomes a Forest instead.

I like the landmorph ability a lot, and am planning to make it a whole mechanic for green in my new set. This would include:

a) Some green removal in the form of Target creature, or all creatures become forest kind of thing.

b) A cycle of green creatures that instead of dying, become forests (as in "When this is put into a graveyard from play, it becomes a forest instead.")

c) Some kind of cool green elemental capable of turning stuff into play into forests.

d) The inevitable hoser in red in black. Lots and lots of land destruction with a twist, like the card I posted today "Plague of Locusts".

I just want to find a way to make the ability:

Creature becomes forest.

Actually work in an easy to understand way, even if it would need a new paragraph in the comp rules.

[Pizzatog]

Ok.

After checking the rules:


212.1b. When an object’s type changes, the new type(s) replaces any existing types. Counters, effects, and damage affecting the object remain with it, even if they are meaningless to the new type. Similarly, when the subtypes of one of an object’s types change, the new subtype(s) replaces any existing subtypes of that type. If an object’s type is removed, the subtypes of its old type don’t exist in any way under the new type. Those subtypes disappear completely for the entire time the object’s type is removed. Removing an object’s subtype doesn’t affect its types at all.

All subtypes of the creatures are removed by the subtype "Forest". All abilities are removed and replaced with "Tap: add G to your mana pool" and the creatures cease to be creatures, since you do not state the opposite.

Soul Sculptur BTW can change creature tokens into enchantment tokens

I have come to 2 conclusions about the landmorph mechanic:

1) If something is templated as "target x is a forest", then that something should be a permanent, so that it wont creature memory problems.

2) In the case of temporary effects, then the card should work with forest tokens. (or in the case of circle of life).

What do you think?

[Pizzatog]

Mods, please close this thread, I am putting all the landmorph cards into a single thread.