Entropic Serpent

[Ben Kossman]

Never seen anything similar but this concept seems fairly obvious but cool nonetheless...

BBBBBB
Summon Reflection

Children of the Void has power/toughness are equal to the number of cards removed from the game during this game. During your upkeep opponent may choose a card you own that's been removed from the game and put it into your graveyard.

*/*

Seems like a nifty concept. Since removing stuff the game is fairly easy I tried to add a resonable drawback but it's probably still too powerful. I don't think my wording is correct either.

[SpencerForHire]

For the sake of, well for the sake of in general perhaps you should remove a card in your hand from the game when it comes into play, then you have a slight drawback and he doesn't start as a 0/0.
Children of the Void
{B}{B}{B}{B}{B}
Summon Reflection
Children of the Void has power/toughness are equal to the number of cards removed from the game during this game.
When Children of the Void comes into play remove a card in your hand from the game.
*/*

I don't think the RFG card should have to be black since this card already demands 5 black, I still think this could be stronger, possibly trample or the reduction of it's casting cost by .

Edit: What is entropic serpent?

[The Atog Lord]

Wow, what a great name. If I'm not mistaken, Children of the Grave and Into the Void are both off the same album, Master of Reality. Is the name a reference to that? Or am I reading too much into this?

As for the mechanic, I think that it may prove to be difficult to remember. If someone casts a Wish, oftentimes that person will physically replace the sideboard card brought into the game, out of his deckbox, with the Wish itself. This is actually why the wishes remove themselves -- it keeps the sideboard at fifteen cards. If a wish gets cast, it may become very easy for the players to forget that a card had been removed.

And Wishes aren't the only thing that will make keeping track of how big this guy is difficult. Let's say I get a Flickerform on my Atog. Or an Anurid Brushhopper resolves. Or imagine if an Astral Slide hits play. If you get this guy out on turn eight against a deck with Astral Slide, you'll have quite a difficult time remembering exactly how big this guy is.

I can see this guy leading to a lot of warnings given out for "failure to agree on reality." Storm makes you remember a number too, but only for the single turn, which is often easy to recreate. This guy counts an otherwise difficult to count number throughout a game, and that number will often be impossible to reproduce.

Heck, do you really want to have to mark down any time either player madnesses out a Basking Rootwalla?

[Nibble]

What's the best way to resolve tricky memory issues?

Counters, of course!

"Whenever a card is removed from the game, put a +1/+1 counter on ~this~."

Yes, I'm aware this is functionally quite different, but for all the reasons mentioned above, I'm not sure the original wording could be plausible.

[SpencerForHire]

I was just thinking of counters, with counters this card has significantly more potential.

Children of the Void
{B}{B}{B}{B}{B}
Summon Reflection
Whenever a card is removed from the game put a +1/+1 counter on Children of the Void.
Whenever a card comes from outside the game and is put anywhere remove a +1/+1 counter from Chilrden of the Void.
1/1

[The Atog Lord]

It strikes me that it may be very easy to "miss" a card being removed from the game. Maddness removes cards from the game, for instance, and that may get missed a lot. That means that we should probably make this a "may" ability. If we do that, then if a player misses a counter, nothing happens. If it isn't a "may" ability, then a missed counter could create all sorts of rules problems when it is discovered later. Yes, of course this means removing the text to remove counters. But honestly, at that casting cost, I'm not at all concerned about a vanilla creature with no evasion ability getting too large.

[SpencerForHire]

I'm still up for giving it an evasion ability.  Fear, and Trample seem appropriate as a bunch of demonic children swarming could easily be scary or trample over smaller people to get to their target (the opponents head).

[Evenpence]

Fear is the most logical.  Good thought.  This is a great card, and should be an uncommon for sure.

It should probably be only 5 black mana to cast, as dark ritual and whatnot can really work to get this thing in play without much trouble. 

Planar Void to Glimpse the Unthinkable is this thing's best friend.

[lordmayhem]

Considering that its mana cost remained just as high, with the same abysmal dedication to black mana, along with having its ability completely diluted, I'd say that this looks like absolute crap.

My suggested solutions:

The Vinelasher Kudzu way:
Children of the Void
(2)
Creature Reflection
Whenever a card is removed from the game from anywhere, put a +1/+1 counter on ~this~
Whenever a card from outside the game changes zones, remove a +1/+1 counter from ~this~
1/1

The CITP way:
Children of the Void
(6)
Creature Reflection
Trample
When ~this~ comes into play, put a +1/+1 counter on it for each card you own removed from the game.
, Remove a +1/+1 counter from ~this~ : Return target card removed from the game to your hand.
1/1

This way, its either something you have to dedicate time and effort to grow, or it comes out as a big trampler with a cool ability.

[Jacob Orlove]

There is no way this would be anything but rare; there's also NO reason for it to cost a million black mana.

[dandan]

Fear is the most logical.  Good thought.  This is a great card, and should be an uncommon for sure.

It should probably be only 5 black mana to cast, as dark ritual and whatnot can really work to get this thing in play without much trouble. 

Planar Void to Glimpse the Unthinkable is this thing's best friend.

Demonoc Consultation is pretty good for B and Instant too!

[BurningIce]

The casting cost is really ugly.  Imagine what that would look like on the top of a real card, unglued/unhinged aside.  Nothing should have more than 3, or 4 if absolutely necessary mana of one color (like Phage for example, but even in her case I think that's extreme).

[Upinthe]

Is anyone else worried that this could be an instant kill with Demonic Consulation, Doomsday, and a slew of other cards?

[Jacob Orlove]

There needs to be a current wording post somewhere. Once there is, I can explain all the problems with whatever the current version of the card is.