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Author Topic: Erayo timing  (Read 1558 times)
Sextiger
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« on: August 11, 2006, 09:52:24 pm »

The following situation came up today in playing and I wasn't sure how to deal with it.
There has been 3 spells played, the person in control of Erayo, Soratami Ascendant has priority and casts an Ancestral Recall. 
I try to cast Echoing Truth in response, targeting Erayo, would the spell be countered since the 4th spell is played and he would be flipped??
Can you respond to the flipping of the card or is just an instant effect?
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« Reply #1 on: August 11, 2006, 10:35:43 pm »

The following situation came up today in playing and I wasn't sure how to deal with it.
There has been 3 spells played, the person in control of Erayo, Soratami Ascendant has priority and casts an Ancestral Recall. 
I try to cast Echoing Truth in response, targeting Erayo, would the spell be countered since the 4th spell is played and he would be flipped??
Can you respond to the flipping of the card or is just an instant effect?

Erayo flipping is a triggered ability, so when your opponent casts the 4th spell the Erayo's ability triggers and goes onto the stack, after which you may then respond by bouncing the erayo before it flips.
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« Reply #2 on: August 11, 2006, 10:39:00 pm »

Additionally, Erayo only triggers on the first spell that the opponent (i.e. you) played (that is, costs paid and card being put on the stack), so flipping it after the spell has been played means that Erayo won't see the spell being played, and so won't trigger.
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« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2006, 11:45:07 pm »

On a related note, if you play a bounce spell targetting Erayo, and he triggers before the bounce resolves, is the bounce spell countered because its target is gone?  Is an upside down card a different target?
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« Reply #4 on: August 21, 2006, 07:26:11 am »

On a related note, if you play a bounce spell targetting Erayo, and he triggers before the bounce resolves, is the bounce spell countered because its target is gone?  Is an upside down card a different target?

It depends on the bounce spell. An upside down card is the same permanent. As long as its not a 'target creature' bounce spell or a modal spell, you're fine.  Most bounce spells are 'target permanent' or 'target non-land permanent' so either you get the bounce.

My question is this:
Erayo is in play unflipped.
I cast a spell, my opponent responds with a spell, I respond to his spell, he responds back. The original spell is still on the stack.
Erayo flips. Since he does not have a triggered ability, does he counter my first spell?
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« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2006, 07:47:52 am »

No.  The reason is the same reason why you can't weld in a chalice of the void to counter a moxen that is already on the stack.  The even that triggers the counter effect is actually "playing" a spell.  So if she's not flipped when the spell is actually declared and cast then it will never get a chance to trigger.  So essentially once you declare that first spell if there is no flipped eryro in play, there is no way for your opponent to "repond" fast enough to get her to flip in time to counter that spell.  Also as said before, she doesn't forget the spell count for the turn when she flips.  So if you play brainstorm, then I play 3 more spells to flip my erayo, then later in the turn you play ancestral recall.  The game doesn't forget what the first spell you played this turn is.  It will always be that brainstorm you lead with. 
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« Reply #6 on: August 21, 2006, 10:14:15 am »

No.  The reason is the same reason why you can't weld in a chalice of the void to counter a moxen that is already on the stack.  The even that triggers the counter effect is actually "playing" a spell.  So if she's not flipped when the spell is actually declared and cast then it will never get a chance to trigger.  So essentially once you declare that first spell if there is no flipped eryro in play, there is no way for your opponent to "repond" fast enough to get her to flip in time to counter that spell.  Also as said before, she doesn't forget the spell count for the turn when she flips.  So if you play brainstorm, then I play 3 more spells to flip my erayo, then later in the turn you play ancestral recall.  The game doesn't forget what the first spell you played this turn is.  It will always be that brainstorm you lead with. 

Ahh, oracle text. I was looking at card text which gives [card]erayo's essence[/card] a static ability, not a triggered ability.
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