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Author Topic: RG Beats w/ Future Sight  (Read 1968 times)
keys
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« on: May 09, 2007, 06:29:44 pm »

RG Beats post Future Sight:

Creatures:
4 Kird Ape
4 Hidden Gibbons
4 Grim Lavamancer
4 Magus of the Moon
3 Gorilla Shaman

Instants:
4 Pyroblast
3 Dead//Gone
3 Artifact Mutation

Enchantments/Artifacts:
4 Root Maze
3 Null Rod

Mana:
4 Simian Spirit Guide
1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Emerald
1 Strip Mine
4 Wasteland
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Taiga
3 Mountain
3 Forest

Sideboard:
4 Pyrostatic Pillar
3 Tormod's Crypt
1 Seal of Primordium
1 Artifact Mutation
3 Bloodfire Dwarf
3 Umezawa's Jitte

The decklist is pretty standard except for the addition of Magus of the Moon, which I think adds a lot to the threat base.  Anything else from Future Sight that I'm missing?

It's designed to take down Fish, while putting up a good fight against Stax, Slaver, and other control.  The strategy is mana denial using Magus, Gorilla Shaman, Root Maze, Null Rod, and Wastelands, and slowly doing lethal with critters.  Pyroblast, D//G, and Mutation add that needed utility against Collosi and other broken plays.

In the sideboard, I couldn't decide between Spray, S&D, and Simoon vs. EtW based decks.  All three have their uses, only Simoon is better against other aggro, which might not be necessary.

The best opening hand is still Pyroblast + Simian Spirit Guide.

Input is appreciated!  Thanks
« Last Edit: May 13, 2007, 03:43:53 pm by keys » Logged
wethepeople
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« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2007, 09:02:43 pm »

You seem to completey ignore the Ichorid matchup, which is something you are very likely to face once Future Sight is released.  Umezawa's Jitte really isn't enough anymore, because killing their Ichorids, Shadows, etc. will just give them multtiple 2/2 Zombie tokens. I would re-consider running some form of graveyard-removal, like Crypt, Leyline, and the like.
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keys
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« Reply #2 on: May 10, 2007, 03:28:00 pm »

What cards would you suggest replacing with Crypt?  Perhaps the sideboard REBs and Naturalize?  At least I have 5 strips, 4 Magus, and to some extent Root Maze to slow down Bazaar.
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arik124
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« Reply #3 on: May 10, 2007, 04:18:02 pm »

you can lavamancer your own creatures to remove the bridges from the game!!!
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I don't remember anyone ever scooping to a Null Rod...
The same cannot be said of Yawgmoth's Will.
Kieranwolf
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« Reply #4 on: May 11, 2007, 05:46:23 pm »

Many of the choices here are metagame dependent. I would go with Pillar in the main, since most non-workshop decks can't afford to leave it in play if they want to win. Dead//Gone and Artifact Mutation likewise may not be best in the MB in some metas. Actually, Ancient Grudge might be a better choice for artifact destruction as long as you have five strips and aren't facing Stax too often.

I would test Bloodfire Dwarf as an ETW solution. It's apparently had success in TMWA, and it also takes care of pesky Confidants against the other aggros.

Is there a case for Seal of Primordium over Naturalize? Minor differences, but when was the last time anyone saw Disenchant in a list over Seal of Cleansing? Depending on what enchantments you end up facing, there are other choices as well. Reverent Silence against Oath is one possible example.

Magus is nice for a lot of reasons. It also dodges Chalice in any sane matchup. I would almost always use him over Blood Moon because he beats.

I think that in a lot of metas, you might want 4-5 MB answers to ETW in the main, not the SB. Dwarf is one. Cards like Tremor and Pyroclasm are also feasible, but are perhaps less versatile.

I think my biggest concern is the lack of draw engine. You usually need one to stay in the game in case your opening flurry doesn't end things early. Wheel of Fortune, perhaps? Keen Sense?
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keys
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« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2007, 12:50:53 pm »

I don't like to play Pillar main just because it makes the good matchups somewhat shaky.  I don't want to see it versus Fish, Ichorid, or Stax.  I agree with Seal of Primordium instead of Naturalize, I forgot that card was printed.  But I still enjoy Artifact Mutation, since it can actually win games in more matchups than you'd think.

Dwarf is cute, but he has flaws.  Slice and Dice, and too an extent, Lava Spray, are uncounterable.  None of these cards are perfect, they all kill your own Lavamancers and Gorilla Shamans.  Still, you're right that the deck needs to respond to EtW somehow, and that's when I don't want it countered.  About how many are necessary in the maindeck?  I'm not sure, but I think Dead // Gone is far more versatile.  Artifact Mutation could sub out to open up 3 spots, but I'm hesitant.

As far as a draw engine, I could see Sylvan Library as a possible inclusion.  I wouldn't use Wheel because the deck is consistent enough, and giving your opponent another hand only brings them closer to going off or dropping that bomb.  I don't have much experience with Keen Sense, I dismissed it rightaway as being too slow.  I have no idea where that would fit in.
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Kieranwolf
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« Reply #6 on: May 13, 2007, 02:31:17 pm »

Keen Sense and Library could occupy the same slot, whichever one you choose. Sense could cost you cards at inopportune times, but Library costs you life and punishes you for long games.

Without tutors, I'd probably test three Dwarf. The idea with him is to drop him early, just like you would in other formats with Seal of Fire. You basically use it to ward off ETW and stall your opponent into trying for a lethal Tendrils instead. Slice and Dice is very nice, but it's only good if you can get three mana before your opponent beats you up. I'd do tests with either card and see which works better based on your mana. Against aggro, you'd do well to hold off on dropping your hand with him out in the interest of card advantage.

You're right about Pyro Pillar. That's why it's a metagame call. It was gold against Gifts and CS, but horrible against Stax in particular. You basically need Artifact Mutation to survive against Stax because of its locks and artifact creatures.

Dead//Gone is best in matchups like Fish, I think. You kill weenies, and bounce biguns like Old Man of the Sea. You can also clear the way of 2/4's and Trinkey Mages with it. Otherwise, though, it ends up being a bad Artifact Mutation against artifact fatties.

Is Dead//Gone too narrow? Seems like Lightning Bolt could be at least as good sometimes.
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policehq
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« Reply #7 on: May 13, 2007, 02:51:18 pm »

Post-Future Sight, Bloodfire Dwarf may be superior to his counterparts because of Bridge From Below. Remember that sacrificing him will kill 1/1's as well as prevent Ichorid from making 2/2's.

-hq
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urweak
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« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2007, 09:46:18 pm »

What cards would you suggest replacing with Crypt?  Perhaps the sideboard REBs and Naturalize?  At least I have 5 strips, 4 Magus, and to some extent Root Maze to slow down Bazaar.

oh wow, i just joined this site, and posted my deck list, and it is like the same deck as yours. Kinda scary i guess. lol

Anyways, this is my list
http://www.themanadrain.com/index.php?topic=33249.msg474051#msg474051

But I like Leyline of the Void for that matchup, I just mull till I have one in hand and then usally the game is over. Minus the few times they would bounce it back to my hand or something.
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