Balance

[Lurker101]

So while posting in the "Most underplayed viable cards in vintage" topic RaleighNCTourneys came up with idea of using Ignorant Bliss with Balance. So starting with that I'm going to make a list. I have no way to test the decks I post so if anyone wants to test any of these for me I would appreciate it (I'm on a mac so no MWS and I live in small town Iowa where no one really plays). I have lots of vintage and legacy deck ideas that I plan on fine tuning and posting.

Vanishing Point

(second draft)
Creatures: 2
2 Psychatog
Card Draw/Tutors: 12
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Windfall
1 Memory Jar
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Tinker
4 Ignorant Bliss
1 Timetwister
Disruption:15
4 Thoughtseize
4 Force of Will
4 Mana Drain
1 Balance
2 Rebuild
Other Enchantments: 8
2 Parallax Tide
4 Leyline of the Void
Broken/Other: 4
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Regrowth
1 Time walk
1 Berserk
1 Replenish
2 Otherworldly Journey
Mana: 19
1 Black Lotus
5 Moxen
4 Forbidden Orchard
1 Flagstones of Trokair
4 Plateau
4 Tundra
Total card count: 60

How to play the deck: This is an update of old-school balance type decks combined with Psychatog and Replenish/Mana Drain (to get those costly Parallax Tides out).
How to play Ignorant Bliss: You should use the first couple of them to negate the hand discarding drawbacks from Wheel of Fortune, Windfall, and Memory Jar. Save one for when you go off.
Going Off: Play Hurkyl's Recall, remove as many of your lands from the game using Parallax Tide, Play Gush for free, make sure your Psychatog is already in play and your opponent has a few spirit tokens in play. Then play Balance and stack Ignorant Bliss on top of it. You're opponent loses their whole hand, all their artifacts, and most of their land. If LotV is in play those are all removed from the game. Next turn you should have enough cards in your hand and graveyard (plus hopefully a Berserk) to win by beating down with Tog.

Sideboard: The sideboard contains 2 more Replenish as backup in case you can't Drain out your heavier costing enchantments. Additionaly 4 Oblivion Rings and 2 Chain of Vapor for opposing leylines and other threats to your gameplan. 2 Pithing Needles to take out Bazaar. 2 Ensnaring Bridges for aggro decks (again use Ignorant Bliss to empty your hand before combat). 4 Extirpate to take out Drains, Slavers, FoW, etc (Obviously without Leyline out).

Sideboard:15
2 Pithing Needle
4 Oblivion Ring
2 Replenish
2 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Extirpate
2 Chain of Vapor

I'm really excited about this deck. If anyone could comment or post test results I would be very happy.

[LordHomerCat]

You might try actually reading the cards, as Balance only affects Lands, Cards in hand, and Creatures.  Your Psychatog is not coming back.

[Lurker101]

You might try actually reading the cards, as Balance only affects Lands, Cards in hand, and Creatures.  Your Psychatog is not coming back.

My bad, I'll fix that.

[bait_bludgeon]

is rector really that good? it just seems to me like as if it would be too slow without flash. this deck just seems to do too much and the combo seems to take too long. granted you have FOW and therapy but the deck just doesnt seem to get there. its very interesting to see llotv mb though, i like that. tog also seems like such a bad win condition right now too. iono.

[Lurker101]

is rector really that good? it just seems to me like as if it would be too slow without flash. this deck just seems to do too much and the combo seems to take too long. granted you have FOW and therapy but the deck just doesnt seem to get there. its very interesting to see llotv mb though, i like that. tog also seems like such a bad win condition right now too. iono.

Yeah I would like this to work faster but I don't have any ideas aside from rector. Should I add a singleton flash?

[bait_bludgeon]

iono you could and then add scroll, but even then it seems too weak. you only have one flash and 4 rectors. if flash gets countered or discarded, youre stuck with another 4 dead cards in the deck. i think rectors should be cut overall. honestly if youre trying to win via psychatog why not just play post b/r gat? iono. its up to you.

[Lurker101]

It won't work without a better sac outlet and/or faster way to get Parallax Tides into play. I think Psychatog works well as a finisher for this still because your opponent will be empty handed and have very few permanents and you will have a fairly large hand. Does anyone have ideas? Maybe Replenish? Sound viable?

[Lurker101]

Sorry to double post but the second draft is up and it looks alot better now. If anyone wants to test or comment please do.

[Lurker101]

I haven't tested it all, but I think it could rip some popular decks up. In theory this should beat Ichorid, Stax, Oath and Slaver, and has a chance to beat Goblins and r/g beats post board. I think grim long would roll all over this though.  I should be getting MWS soon but in the meantime I was wondering if someone could test and post results. I want to see how this matches up against popular vintage decks.

[Anusien]

Since you need to cast Balance to win, don't you want all the tutors possible?  So Vampiric Tutor, Mystical Tutor, Imperial Seal and Personal Tutor?  Plus, card disadvantage tutors are fine with Balance (so maybe Lim-Dul's Vault).  Heck, Lat-Nam's Legacy is probably fine with Balance since you get your cards back in the next.  There are also all the cantrip artifacts (Mishra's Bauble etc).

Also my hunch is that Darksteel Colossus is better than at least one Psychatog and possibly both.  You might want to look into Greater Gargadon, so you can suspend it, sacrifice all your lands and such, cast Balance to wreck the board and then bring him in on your next upkeep.

Jar doesn't play well with Balance; is it there just because it plays well with Ignorant Bliss?

You might want to also look at Restore Balance and Balancing Act.  There is even an Extended deck built around Balancing Act; it used the Invasion sac lands (Ancient Spring et al).

[Lurker101]

Since you need to cast Balance to win, don't you want all the tutors possible?  So Vampiric Tutor, Mystical Tutor, Imperial Seal and Personal Tutor?  Plus, card disadvantage tutors are fine with Balance (so maybe Lim-Dul's Vault).  Heck, Lat-Nam's Legacy is probably fine with Balance since you get your cards back in the next.  There are also all the cantrip artifacts (Mishra's Bauble etc).

Also my hunch is that Darksteel Colossus is better than at least one Psychatog and possibly both.  You might want to look into Greater Gargadon, so you can suspend it, sacrifice all your lands and such, cast Balance to wreck the board and then bring him in on your next upkeep.

Jar doesn't play well with Balance; is it there just because it plays well with Ignorant Bliss?

You might want to also look at Restore Balance and Balancing Act.  There is even an Extended deck built around Balancing Act; it used the Invasion sac lands (Ancient Spring et al).

Thanks for the suggestions, I'll test and put up reports to see how it does. Also the draw 7s are good with ignorant bliss.
I may be able to post results and if they're bad I'll take a few of your suggestions.

[Lurker101]

I'm still working on this but have made some changes. Also what would you cut for Seed Spark? or is it too weak.

[Lurker101]

Since you need to cast Balance to win, don't you want all the tutors possible?  So Vampiric Tutor, Mystical Tutor, Imperial Seal and Personal Tutor?  Plus, card disadvantage tutors are fine with Balance (so maybe Lim-Dul's Vault).  Heck, Lat-Nam's Legacy is probably fine with Balance since you get your cards back in the next.  There are also all the cantrip artifacts (Mishra's Bauble etc).

Also my hunch is that Darksteel Colossus is better than at least one Psychatog and possibly both.  You might want to look into Greater Gargadon, so you can suspend it, sacrifice all your lands and such, cast Balance to wreck the board and then bring him in on your next upkeep.

Jar doesn't play well with Balance; is it there just because it plays well with Ignorant Bliss?

You might want to also look at Restore Balance and Balancing Act.  There is even an Extended deck built around Balancing Act; it used the Invasion sac lands (Ancient Spring et al).

The draw 7's should find balance. If not I do run 1 Vampiric Tutor and 1 Demonic Tutor. I really still need testing. I can test both versions and see how they hold up.

[carl]

I have no way to test the decks I post so if anyone wants to test any of these for me I would appreciate it (I'm on a mac so no MWS and I live in small town Iowa where no one really plays).

OT, but I wanted you to know that you can play online with a Mac with Mindless Automaton, a software compatible with Apprentice and MWS. Check this thread for help on how to install it.

Enjoy.

[Lurker101]

Vanishing Point: Other options that could help this deck out.
Limited Resources: Take out your lands with Parallax tide and stack this and play balance to lock your opponent out of the game mana wise.
Urza's Legacy Man lands: Could help mana base and attack as creatures. As long as there are none activated when you go off you can bring them back next turn for some beatdown.
Genju's: also help you beatdown pre or post balance. This would require more basic lands though.
LED: another card that does cute tricks with vanishing point.
I'll test this deck first as soon as I figure out how to play other people in MWS and maybe throw some of those changes in to it.

[Lurker101]

Vanishing Point 2.0

Creatures: 2
1 DSC
1 Greater Gargadon
Card Draw/Tutors: 11
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Windfall
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Tinker
4 Ignorant Bliss
1 Timetwister
Disruption:11
4 Thoughtseize
4 Mana Drain
1 Balance
2 Rebuild
Other Enchantments: 13
1 Fastbond
2 Limited Resources
1 Genju of the Falls
1 Genju of the Spires
2 Parallax Tide
4 Leyline of the Void
Broken/Other: 5
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Regrowth
1 Time walk
1 Replenish
Mana: 20
1 LED
1 Black Lotus
5 Moxen
4 Forbidden Orchard
1 Flagstones of Trokair
4 Plateau
4 Tundra
Total card count: 60

Sideboard:15
2 Pithing Needle
1 Berserk
4 Oblivion Ring
2 Otherworldly Journey
2 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Replenish
2 Psychatog

Here's an alternate version of the deck that may also warrant testing. I need to fit Ghost Quarters in here somehow too, if I could get some help. I also realized that I've mistakenly had maindeck Repeal on the first draft. That was always supposed to be Rebuild so I changed that in both builds. I really just need something to take out for Ghost Quarter which needs to  be in here and can help set up a Limited Resources lock

[Lurker101]

So I took Vanishing Point out for a spin on MWS (I finally figured out how to use it). It eats up Worldgorger dragon. I had a nice lockdown going and hadn't gone off yet when opponent scooped. He beat me first game because I kept a bad starting hand. Second game I started with LotV in play, which got popped by Krosan Grip but I regrowthed it and played it again next turn. Opponent was playing Rhystic Caves for some reason and I always locked those down too. I'll post some more results when I get more testing done.  Also, you don't always have to save those parallax tides for when you go off. Alot of opponents scoop as soon as that hit the table and I was actually able to hard cast them pretty early on if need be. It's nice to get them back with replenish too when you do go off.

[Lurker101]

Having major problems testing. I need to see how this does against tier one decks. I've been piloting it pretty bad and have faith in the deck but less faith in my playskills.
I've played a few games right but I've been getting eaten up by my own spirit tokens and just some terrible terrible plays. If someone better could just test the updated version and post results I'd be very happy.