Aspertame* The not so sweet side of the "sweetener"

[BruiZar]

Dehla
Red meat and pork in particular are unhealthy. Eating meat is uneccesary. I do eat chicken and I also eat fish. I just don´t eat it as regularly as other people, and I think the world would be a better place if people would consume a little less meat. I think the term is 'part time vegetarians'.

BC
I completely agree with you.

[BC]

...I think the world would be a better place if people would consume a little less meat.

I agree with you pretty much.  I don't know if the world would be a better place, but people would certainly be a lot healthier.  Evolutionarily, we are meant to eat meat.  We naturally crave fat, salt, and sugar, because we need small amounts of each of those, but in nature they are relatively hard to find.  The fact that we can now drive to the store and buy as much bacon as we want kinda ruins that concept.  Meat isn't poison, but copious amounts of meat (which is what far too many people eat) can make you very unhealthy.

[policehq]

Getting back on topic, since most people have wildly switched gears...

I don't drink diet cokes and things often because I know that water is better for me and likely more satisfying in the end, but this link is good:

http://www.snopes.com/medical/toxins/aspartame.asp
 Possibly my favorite quote is this:

Just because something is beyond your comprehension doesn't mean it is scientific.

In fact, I have found too many people buy into others as long as the latter are talking over the formers' heads.

Health is so simple. Include fruits and vegetables in your diet. Include water with what you drink (but who cares about what else... coffee, tea, juice, milk...). Stay active while sugar is in your blood, and eat and rest to recover from exercise.

EDIT: And don't eat/drink things that have ingredients resembling chemistry sets.

[Delha]

Dehla
Red meat and pork in particular are unhealthy. Eating meat is uneccesary. I do eat chicken and I also eat fish. I just don´t eat it as regularly as other people, and I think the world would be a better place if people would consume a little less meat. I think the term is 'part time vegetarians'.

To call red meat unhealthy is one thing, to call it poison carries a very different connotation. A finger of whiskey is bad for your liver. A similar amount of cyanide is clearly lethal.

I agree that the world would be a better place if people ate less meat, but for very different reasons that you, I suspect.

[zeus-online]

An noone has considered that there actually exists underweight people?...

[Delha]

An noone has considered that there actually exists underweight people?...

I suspect that the vast majority of underweight people in the US have reached that point due to eating disorders, not as a result of regular eating habits. If someone else with hard info could confirm or deny, I'd be quite interested to hear actual numbers.

[policehq]

An noone has considered that there actually exists underweight people?...

I suspect that the vast majority of underweight people in the US have reached that point due to eating disorders, not as a result of regular eating habits. If someone else with hard info could confirm or deny, I'd be quite interested to hear actual numbers.

I'd be interested, too. You're catch-phrase "in the US" makes me more interested. Obviously malnutrition, drug use, sickness, and poverty lead to underweight, and having an eating disorder does not always lead to successful weight loss as well as, say, chemotherapy, aids, and heroin.

[zeus-online]

Why do people always assume that underweight people are sick or have chosen to be underweight?

I have been underweight my entire life, and it's getting rather annoying that everyone assumes that you can just "eat more". For us that are underweight it is actually a serious problem.

[Delha]

I'd be interested, too. You're catch-phrase "in the US" makes me more interested. Obviously malnutrition, drug use, sickness, and poverty lead to underweight, and having an eating disorder does not always lead to successful weight loss as well as, say, chemotherapy, aids, and heroin.

I'm not comfortable making blanket statement about other countries, I just don't know them well enough. I certainly wouldn't apply that expectation to third world countries with known food supply issues.

Why do people always assume that underweight people are sick or have chosen to be underweight?

I have been underweight my entire life, and it's getting rather annoying that everyone assumes that you can just "eat more". For us that are underweight it is actually a serious problem.

First, if your body is not functioning within normal parameters, that's pretty much the definition of sick. You appear to be using the word "sick" as some sort of condemnation or the like, which was never my intended meaning.

Second, I specifically said that I expect that most underweight people have NOT reached that point through regular eating habits. I included that statement to make it clear that I don't believe people are simply "choosing to be underweight".

Third, I deliberately said "the vast majority" instead of "everyone". I'm not saying that your problem is invalid or irrelevant. The vast majority of terminally ill people in the US are probably not skin cancer patients. That doesn't make it unimportant.

I've known people who had eating disorders, but can't offhand recall anyone (until you) who was specifically underweight and trying unsuccessfully to gain.

[Bill Copes]

I've known people who had eating disorders, but can't offhand recall anyone (until you) who was specifically underweight and trying unsuccessfully to gain.

I know a couple.  No matter what they do, it just won't happen.  Genetics is crazy, yo.

[Delha]

I've known people who had eating disorders, but can't offhand recall anyone (until you) who was specifically underweight and trying unsuccessfully to gain.

I know a couple.  No matter what they do, it just won't happen.  Genetics is crazy, yo.

I never doubted that they exist, and totally agree that genes are nuts. I'm just saying that my perception has been that among people who are unhealthily slim, eating disorders are more often at the root than say, a hyperactive metabolism. It's admittedly anecdotal, but that's why I mentioned that I was curious to see hard numbers.

[zeus-online]

Why do you think it's different with overweight people?

[Delha]

Why do you think it's different with overweight people?

Because I don't know of any inverse equivalent to anorexia nervosa. I'd expect most peopel here know what is, at least on a very basic level. I've never heard of an condition where a severely overweight person believes they are underweight, and keeps eating in an attempt to gain further.

It wouldn't surprise me if it exists, but I've never heard of a case to date.

[zeus-online]

Why do you think it's different with overweight people?

Because I don't know of any inverse equivalent to anorexia nervosa. I'd expect most peopel here know what is, at least on a very basic level. I've never heard of an condition where a severely overweight person believes they are underweight, and keeps eating in an attempt to gain further.

It wouldn't surprise me if it exists, but I've never heard of a case to date.

While i do believe that there are eating disorders that causes you to become overweight that is not really my point. (I doubt that there are exact mirrors of the eating disorders that plague some underweight people though)

I was merely attempting to make people aware that there are underweight people who are actually struggling to gain weight without suffering from some psychological condition. This notion is something most people never really consider which is honestly quite annoying for us who are underweight.

[policehq]

That seems unfair to be annoyed for someone not knowing what every person in the world is going through.

[zeus-online]

That seems unfair to be annoyed for someone not knowing what every person in the world is going through.

No, the thing is that people pass judgment upon you by assuming that you being underweight is the cause of a disease (mostly mental diseases). That is what annoys me.

[Marske]

Ok, what started off as a discussion on "sweetener" ended up going into a discussion on weight problems and sickness, this is way off track and not something fitting for TMD even if it's in Community.

It seems like there's nothing left to say about the subject, I'll let it linger a bit and if people still feel they have more to say about the original topic it's fine, if not I'm going to lock the thread.

Marske.

[policehq]

Ok, what started off as a discussion on "sweetener" ended up going into a discussion on weight problems and sickness, this is way off track and not something fitting for TMD even if it's in Community.

It seems like there's nothing left to say about the subject, I'll let it linger a bit and if people still feel they have more to say about the original topic it's fine, if not I'm going to lock the thread.

Marske.

That seems like counterintuitive moderation. Do you really want three threads on health and food discussions gumming up the community forum? Are you aware of some of the reasons people say aspartame can be unhealthy, and if so, don't you realize that weight problems and sickness are, in fact, relevant?

[Norm4eva]

Yeah, it's sort of like starting a Single Card Discussion thread and then not talking about the format or metagame it exists in.

"Lion's Eye Diamond... yay or nay?"
"Wull I dunno what deck are you putting it into"
"lol u got off topic, locked."

At any rate, when aspartame breaks down in the body a portion of it turns into wood alcohol.  4 oz. of wood alcohol will kill you.  10mL (2/5 an oz I think?  lunch break math) of it can cause blindness.  And it's in your Diet Coke.  Mmmmmm.

[Marske]

@policehq, Norm4eva,
I'm perfectly fine with discussion going on about the original topic, I'm however not fine with it turning into a debate about Anorexia or other eating disorders. This is a forum dedicated mostly to gaming and off course this is community and people can talk about whatever, but there are some topics and directions that should not be pursued. There are other forums out on the net to discuss these things.

[Diakonov]

I suggest reading Michael Pollan's In Defense of Food.  He discusses a variety of interesting topics, but as the title suggests, the main idea of the book is that we should try to eat whole, unprocessed foods.  It requires more effort since you have to cook frequently and your ingredients have a short shelf life, but evidence has always shown that eating lots of fruits and vegetables and smaller portions of meat leads to better health.  Worrying about chemical ingredients is largely unnecessary, and often confuses the issue.

Red meat and pork in particular are unhealthy. Eating meat is uneccesary. I do eat chicken and I also eat fish. I just don´t eat it as regularly as other people, and I think the world would be a better place if people would consume a little less meat. I think the term is 'part time vegetarians'.

I've heard the term, "flexitarian."

[hvndr3d y34r h3x]

@ marske
I really don't see any reason why talking about eating disorders in the context of dietary health (considering an individual's unique health factors as a reason to not jump to absolutes in a discussion about dietary health) should not be pursued. Especially because nothing offensive has really been said yet. Eating disorders exist, it's a cold hard fact of reality, and there is no real reason not to talk about it in a dietary context as long as it remains non offensive. End.

As far as the aspartame thing goes, I was pretty sure it was a widely known fact that it's awful for people and probably causes cancer. I'm also aware that US food regulations allow different amount of different types of "filth" or other pathogens in foods. Dosing is important (and granted, thresholds are debatable), maybe that has something to do with why it's still around.

As for food consumption in general, I'm a big fan of "all things in moderation."

The meat consumption in humanity, is a topic that usually comes up were I live. I've lived with a number of vegans, and straight edge vegans. They'll come right out and tell you a lot of classic hippie foods are not  really that great for you. Some one previously mention soy not being particularly great in large quantities, a lot of vegetarians and vegans will echo this. The same is said about the fungal protein meat substitutes. Again, everything in moderation.