Ankh Sligh Discussion

[Legend]

By now most of you are aware that Ankh Sligh has rapidly become one of the most discussed archetypes on the manadrain.com boards in recent weeks.


When I came back to the boards a little while back, my first post was a rather general Sligh discussion that quickly went off in several different directions, since there was no intention to the contrary on my part.


However, I would now like to start a discussion with the expressed purpose of focusing on ANKH SLIGH. This archetype needs its own thread, and I might as well start it since I have been the most vocal proponent of the deck recently.


Two ground rules:


1. This will be the official place to discuss Ankh Sligh, so keep the discussion on topic: talking about building the deck, what to do in specific matchups, and so on and so forth.  While I appreciate a good tangential rant as much as anybody, I want to maintain a high degree of focus here.


2. There are those who discourage the posting of decklists in other people's threads. I am not one of these people. However, if you are going to post your own Ankh decklist, make it readable. I am interested in seeing other people's decklists. It would also be good if you could offer some explanation of your card choices and what you expect to be facing in your metagame.



I'll start off by posting my own Ankh Sligh decklist, followed by some brief comments. From there, I leave it up to you to get the discussion going. Below is the list that I am currently taking to Neutral Ground:


LEGEND ANKH SLIGH (LAS)


4 Gorilla Shaman
4 Jackal Pup
4 Goblin Cadets

4 Lightning Bolt
4 Chain Lightning
4 Incinerate
4 Price of Progress
1 Fork

4 Cursed Scroll
4 Ankh of Mishra
1 Black Vise
1 Mox Ruby

16 Mountain
4 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine

SB:

4 Pyrokinesis
4 Scald
4 Mogg Fanatic
3 Rack and Ruin

RESERVE SB:

4 Tormod's Crypt
4 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Rack and Ruin


Comments:



1. No Wheel of Fortune? Without Fireblast, the utility of the Wheel decreases. Even more of a consideration is the danger of giving some decks a new seven. There are a lot of decks with the potential to do something totally outrageous with a new seven before I can take advantage of mine.



2.  Ankh of Mishra: Many are aware of the Ankh's purpose(s), but I want to review the main reasons why it is a good choice for those not familiar with its use.


A. The widespread use of fetchlands.


B. A two mana threat that smooths things out against Powder Keg. Also gives Sligh some semblance of a mana curve for the first time in a great while.


C. Colorless damage to compliment Cursed Scroll and Black Vise. Additionally, the brutality of the Ankh/Vise combo is well-known by now.


D. Great against the blue-based control decks, such as Keeper and XLU. Beating these decks at a reasonable clip is an important part of doing well in Type I.


E. Also solid against TNT and Gro, clearly two very important decks right now.




3. The Manabase: The only nonbasic lands I use are Wastelands and Strip Mine. I want complete immunity to Price of Progress (especially since I am using it) and opposing Wastelands. I prefer not to have less than sixteen or seventeen Mountains, despite the low mana cost of all the cards in Ankh Sligh. Playing this amount of mana is important to insure the rarity of mulligans, ability to operate Cursed Scroll, and ability to use more expensive sideboard cards such as Ensnaring Bridge or Rack and Ruin.



4. EDIT: Mox Ruby acquired, this change now reflected in
            decklist.\n\n

[Monotone]

What about a mox ruby?  Is it lack of ownership or an intentional tatical decision?
If mox ruby would be good, than why not lotus petal to increase the chance of a 1st turn ankh?

[Rico Suave]

Adding things like Lotus Petal increase the chance of first turn Ankhs, but they decrease the chance for Cursed Scroll activation.

Considering a permanent mana source is better than a one-shot deal, I wouldn't want to screw up the mana base too much for it.

[BigChuck]

About the Mox ruby: Ed said that that was the version he brought to tournies at NG, and he said in another post that he sold all his moxes recently.

On a different note: Have you considered mox diamond? I know its generally dismissed for everythingn except for combo decks, but it has good synergy with the Ankh, and you don't run fireblasts anymore, so you don't need to worry about not having the mountain count. I would run it over lotus petal, anyway. Thoughts?

[ScaldMonger]

I'm going to create a version of this deck for my own side use, but I wanted to know if there was a replacement for the scroll. In my experience with scroll in sligh I found it to be a bad move. Just wanted to know opinions and possible replacements....just seemed that your not gonna want to have that much mana open every turn, even with your versions heavy manabase. I guess if you cut the fireblasts I see where that extra mana is comin from. Just wanna know if there are any other options out there, like something that will mess with their lands even more.

[Legend]

@BigChuck: Correct, I sold my cards, all I have for IRL Type I is my Sligh deck. As for Mox Diamond, I don't like it at all. You throw away a land, and for what? Everything is two mana or less in this deck. I see no need for a mana accelerator with such a punishing drawback.  Hey, a first turn Ankh is great - but do that with a Mox Ruby, not some Stronghold impostor that tosses a precious resource into the graveyard.

@ScaldMonger: You should really use Cursed Scroll. Yes, you hate to draw them in the early game, but other than that, what's not to like? Scroll is a Sligh staple because it provides a colorless, reusable source of damage that wins games for you. Without Scroll, Sligh would be markedly weaker because it would lose that midgame finishing push that Scroll provides. For a super-fast version of Sligh like Red Stompy that abandons all disruptive considerations in an attempt to kill as fast as possible, Scroll gets cut. But in Ankh Sligh, the games are going to last a little longer, which is why Scroll is so useful.\n\n

[Os-Vegeta]

Legend:  Have you tested the UR Phidian matchup?  In my testing, I've found that Ankh really helps and can even save you from a Morphling beatdown by forcing the UR Phid player to keep his land in hand, yet making him play enough to get out removal and counters.  If you've tested / played this matchup, were your results similar?

[Legend]

@Os-Vegeta: I can tell you that the UR Phid matchup is even slightly better than the Keeper matchup because they still have some nonbasic lands to take advantage of, but without the access to the white hosers from the sideboard that Keeper would have. Keeper's ability to pull a hoser on you is what makes that matchup such a fight. UR Phid is a very strong deck that I have a lot of respect for, but it has some of Keeper's weaknesses without having something really scary like a COP Red or a Celestial Dawn to spring on you. However, UR Phid does tend to run Fire/Ice, an excellent card in my opinion, and one that the Sligh player must be aware of. At least you still get to use your non-basic hate to some degree against UR Phid, as opposed to the XLU matchup, in which some of your best weapons are not at all effective. UR Phid is not a walk in the park by any means, just a little more desirable than the Keeper matchup, which I consider to be pretty even. The Ankh is of course great against UR Phid just as it would be against any blue-based control deck.\n\n

[obithrawn]

Has anyone tested the direct differences between playing perminant mana sources vs playing all the ways to throw out a turn 1 ankh?  People keep chosing one side or the other in their builds but no one seems to have done any real testing to find out if its worth it.

Also, you don't mention Barbarian Ring, which sometimes shows up.  I imagine these would really only be good in a version designed to get early threshold (perhaps one that uses lotus petal and such, and obviously builds that play fetchlands) but your lack of fireblasts makes them look playable again.  They don't fit your particular build since they would only be wasteland targets most of the time (and you mention wanting immunity to PoP) but its another idea to consider.

[Os-Vegeta]

Obithrawn: Ankh Sligh is a mana-light deck to begin with, running only 17 red sources (I play the same build Legend does) and 5 strips (which can be tapped for colorless mana but in most cases would be better used to kill nonbasics).  Running Mox Diamond is too much of a loss - you may be giving up a land in hand for an extra mana in play right away, but an opposing Gorilla Shaman can easily take the Diamond, setting you back two mana sources (Diamond eaten and the land sacced to put the Diamond in play) instead of only one if you would be running Mox Ruby.  It's just to risky in my opinion - something like that could ruin the game for you if you can't recover in time.  I decided to give this a quick try just to see what I can draw in a solitare game (I ran this on Magic Workstation because it has the better shuffler) running Lotus Petal and Mox Diamond, and I didn't like the hands I drew into with Mox Diamond or Lotus Petal one bit.  One hand consisted of an Ankh, Scroll, Pup, Incinerate, Mountain, Mox Diamond, and Chain Lightning - definitely not to my liking.  Later, I drew into Mountain, Mountain, Mox Diamond, Gorilla Shaman, Ankh, Incinerate.  the next turn I drew a Pup, and after that a Chain Lightning.  I didn't see mana for a while, and I know that if I was playing against UR Phidian, Keeper, or other decks that ran enough artifact acceleration and Shamans that the Diamond would have been in the graveyard rather quickly.  This made me very uncomfortable with a manabase like this, and I doubt I will ever run such a manabase.  However, I haven't tested MolotDET's Ankh build yet, and his may be able to handle the Lotus Petal and Mox Diamond better, but I would still feel uncomfortable with that because I could still run into the same situation I ran into with the Solitare game I did.

Barbarian Ring is a land I would not run in Ankh Sligh.  Barbarian Ring will be nothing but a pain-mountain in Ankh Sligh because you will not reach threshold.  Ankh is a permanent threat, not a burn spell like Fireblast.  Barbarian Ring works better with Fireblast because it helps reach threshold quicker, and Barbarian Ring works well in Goblin Sligh because of spells like Goblin Grenade and creatures like Mogg Fanatic.  Therefore, in Ankh Sligh (at least Legend's build) Barbarian Ring is not an optimal choice.  Looking at MolotDET's build, Barbarian Ring could be viable since he still runs Fireblast, graveyard filling artifact mana, Wheel of Fortune, and Mogg Fanatics.

[MolotDET]

@obithrawn -

Quote Has anyone tested the direct differences between playing perminant mana sources vs playing all the ways to throw out a turn 1 ankh?

I can say that I have tested them all.  I have been running Lotus, petal, ruby and diamond in my AnkhSligh build since just after I first came up with it in August.  They have done a great.  This should give you a castable turn1 Ankh in 1 of every 3 games and on the very rare occasion, 2 castable turn1 Ankhs.  Also it will deversify your casting costs even further against Powder Kegs.  And yes, no Fireblasts would pretty much give way to the fact that you nolonger need 17 mountains in your maindeck.
     Artifact mana of this sort will also give rise to the Barbarian Ring question again.  The truth is that playing all the artifacts must be joined by Mogg Fanatics to produce the speed needed to use Rings proficiently.  As for them being wasteland targets, under Ankh people tend to play less extrainious colorless lands, concentraiting on securing their mana base first.  Also they tend to hold onto whatever land they have in play until it is too late to stop the ring.

Legend - a few things...

Quote No Wheel of Fortune

    In your build there should be almost no denighing that Fork should be more valuble then Wheel of Fortune.  But as others have pointed out, in a version using mana Artifacts, Wheel would be the better card because it would be possible to draw into at least a few mana, if not three or four.  Also this is where I would argue for the inclusion of 2 Fireblast.

     I also think that somewhere you have lost some of the best reasons for playing Ankh (outside of Fetchlands)...

    Ankh lends amazing synergy to a deck that formerly had none.  Ankh and PoP work together to make playing land/non-basic land dangerous.  Also, once you realized the Ankh/Vise combo, this showed that another card had gained synergy.  Ankh makes Wastelands, Stripmine and Gorilla Shaman more powerful as well.  So add a few more cards to the "new synergy' list.  It obviously complements all the Burn spells in the deck, so more Synergy.  And gives you varied cc to your permanents.  Not to mention cheap cc, colorless damage that is untargeted and requires no upkeep mana.  In my book all of this shows that it not only belongs, but it spells power.
     When I have said before that Ankh only shines in Sligh this is what I meant.  Only in Sligh does Ankh lend that much to the existing deck without other changes.  But Sligh needs a few more changes than that.
     I am not going to clutter my other thoughs in here because, our approches to the deck are too vaired.  Though your deck looks alot like mine did four months ago.

[ScaldMonger]

Would you mind posting a current decklist, you seem to have grasped what I was getting at in my post about dropping the scrolls for some other card that would mess with their lands a bit adding to the overall synergy of the deck. I completely agree with every point you made on the deck, and I'd love to see some crazy tech that combos up with the ankhs's.

[MolotDET]

@ScaldMonger - though you agree with me I must say that dropping Scrolls in not really an option.  Scroll + burn allows you to handle creatures that are bigger than a bolt.
     Ankh is not greater than Scroll.  Scroll is a staple for a reason.  More renewable colorless damage.  I don't think Sligh can ever get enough of this (though I am down to 3 maindeck Scrolls because I really don't want one on turn one.

     Unfortunatly I am not going to post my decklist here right now, because it might detract form the vein of this thread.  Though I am paying close attention to it.

[bebe]

Does anyone remember the old Rainbow Vale/PoP combo? Somer of the old sligh decks used it for a lot of extra damage.
Not saying to use it now but it is interesting old time tech.

[Milton]

In what situations would you sideboard in Ensnaring Bridge?  It would seem that you would be then forced to sideboard out the Anhks.  You could find yourself with two Anhks on the table along with an Ensnaring Bridge and you would be reluctant to lay land, filling up your hand and allowing your opponent to attack.  

So, if the Bridges go in, it seems that the Ankhs must come out.  Is there a better choice here?

Since you are so heavily geared toward beating control what do you side out and in for the mirror match?  Clearly the Price of Progresses come out and the Pyro's come in, but is there anything else?

[Legend]

@Milton:

Correct, the Ensnaring Bridges don't have good synergy with Ankh. Ensnaring Bridge is not there to deal with TNT. The main purpose of Ensnaring Bridge is to beat Suicide Black. Right now, Suicide is in a down period, so I won't play Ensnaring Bridge very often. Ensnaring Bridge has a very specific role to play, and at that it is very good. From TNT, I would expect artifact removal (Artifact Mutation, Naturalize, Uktabi Orangutan) for the Ankhs and Scrolls, so the Bridges could be dealt with as a by-product of the TNT player's desire to destroy my maindeck artifacts. Therefore, the Bridges would likely not be sided in against TNT as long as I had Rack and Ruins instead. Yes, with that many artifacts in my deck, the Bridges might stay in play for a while if an Ankh is destroyed first. But I prefer to side Rack and Ruin against TNT if given the choice, as siding in both Bridge and R & R is upping the mana-curve a bit too much for my liking in a deck with only twenty-two mana sources, five of which you want to use on your opponent's land.

Now, for the purposes of this discussion, here is a sideboarding scenario, including a sample sideboard and examples of what I might do against other aggro decks with this particular sideboard:


SAMPLE SB:

4 Rack and Ruin
4 Pyrokinesis
4 Dwarven Miner
3 Ensnaring Bridge.


SBing EXAMPLES:

TNT:

-4 Goblin Cadets or Jackal Pup
+4 Rack and Ruin

I want to keep all the bolt spells in to complement the POP and Ankh damage, and to make sure Goblin Welder dies. So I suppose its a toss up between Cadets or Pup as to which is sided out, because I'd like to leave Shaman in to eat Moxes.


SUICIDE:  

-4 Ankh of Mishra, -3 Price of Progress
+4 Pyrokinesis, +3 Ensnaring Bridge

Nothing special here, the Ankh's interaction with Bridge has been mentioned, and Price of Progress is worthless against Suicide.


SLIGH: (If they do use fetchlands)

-4 Price of Progress
+4 Pyrokinesis


SLIGH: (If they don't use fetchlands)

-4 Price of Progress, -4 Ankh of Mishra  
+4 Pyrokinesis, +4 Dwarven Miner (for lack of a better choice)


The Ankhs stay in if the Sligh opponent is using fetchlands. Otherwise, they have to go. Price of Progress is generally terrible against other Sligh decks even if they run Barbarian Rings or Mishra's Factories, because I'll want to Wasteland those threats before they can harm me, not sit there hoping to POP the opponent. So Price of Progress is out. Now, here is the tricky part: Jackal Pup. This is a card that has always intrigued me when thinking of how to sideboard against another Sligh deck, especially when the sideboard options are very limited. Like Price of Progress, Jackal Pup is also horrible against other Sligh decks. It will generally just suck up a bolt, allowing the opponent to kill it and damage you. But Jackal Pup costs one mana less than Price of Progress, which will allow me to empty my hand faster to get a Cursed Scroll operational. This is the most important aspect of the Sligh vs. Sligh matchup - who can gain control of the game with a Cursed Scroll. There is also a small chance that Jackal Pup might get to attack once or twice since the other creatures will be sucking up bolts. This is exactly what happened when I faced another Sligh deck at Neutral Ground two weeks ago.

Jackal Pup is better than Price of Progress against another Sligh deck because Price of Progress is more likely to clog my hand and delay the Scrolling, and because Price of Progress has even less of a chance of dealing damage than Jackal Pup does. Another important consideration is that you do not have to put the Jackal Pups into play. If you are pretty sure that they are going to get burned, then they can of course be held onto. But when you want to drop them, they are a little easier to relieve yourself of than is Price of Progress. Just accept the fact that in this unpleasant scenario, you are going to be stuck with four extremely marginal cards no matter what you do. With all that said, you can be sure that Jackal Pup will be the first choice when I toss a card to Pyrokinesis. Keep in mind that this painful choice between Price of Progress and Jackal Pup doesn't always have to come up. Sometimes there will be anti-Sligh options in the sideboard besides Pyrokinesis, possibly Mogg Fanatic. This is a metagame call beyond the scope of the worst-case scenario that I have just presented, which I find to be more useful than a best-case example since it forces you to get a little imaginative with the sideboarding procedure.\n\n

[Grand Inquisitor]

@legend, i know the deck is tight already, but is dropping wheel of fortune really the answer?  with black vise in the deck this adds even more synergy, and the list of decks that abuse wheel more than sligh is short.

what i really mean by this is that sligh takes advantage of the benefits of wheel faster than other decks. most likely, the earliest you will cast the wheel is turn 3, but it will probably be later (like turn 4 or 5).  by now you should have your opponent in the single digits; if you don't, you've probably already lost.  this means that you should probably win on your next turn after casting wheel.  the only decks that can win turn after are tnt (fat beats with anger) combo, and decks running mind twist (its not that they win, but...).  the mana base is already built to take it, why not?

@bebe, the rainbow vale is some nostalgic tech, however, now is not the time to bring it back.  remember this is ankh sligh.  this means (if ankh is in play) that you take 2 damage, and give your opponent much needed mana (and temporary card advantage) to do 2 damage to him.  not worth it.

[Legend]

@Grand Inquisitor

You bring up a fair point about Wheel of Fortune, since it is still a strong card that I had actually included in the version I first posted here a couple of weeks ago. However, it scares me. I am not saying that Wheel should by no means see play in Ankh Sligh, but I am given pause when I think of Keeper with a new seven or TNT with a new seven, situations which you alluded to. I can't help but think of a Mind Twisting or an outrageous beating from some artifact creatures before I get another turn. The synergy with Black Vise is good, but being that Vise is restricted, this is not enough to entice me to add Wheel. I also think that the absence of Fireblast takes a little bit of the edge off Wheel.\n\n

[Dave Kaplan]

I think it might be a good idea to alter the deck likewise:
+3 Fireblast, +1 Wheel of Fortune
-4 Ankh

and board the ankhs
So far the ankhs have been miserable to decent in every matchup save Keeper and Enchantress, where they shine. Yet it's so easy for each of those decks to get rid of the Ankh, I think it might be better left in the board, at least for now.

[Legend]

@Dave:

When I decided to play Sligh, I was going to do something more in line with what you are suggesting, or play Mogg Fanatics maindeck instead of Ankhs, possibilities we discussed at that PTQ. But I ultimately maindecked the Ankhs because of the Keeper metagame at Neutral Ground. Ankhs are worth it at NG.\n\n

[FeverDog]

I  have to say that in my testing vs MolotDet, the Ankhs have been extrememly annoying. The only way Keeper has to deal with Ankhs is to counter them, or Wish for Pulse which can be tough to manage early. Obviously they arent stellar in some matchups, but they make perfect sense at NG. I still run Fanatics in their place, but only because i never know what to expect and Fanatics are always a threat, even late-game.

[Mith]

I'm also boarding the ankhs (they're not as good maindeck in my area). At the moment, I'm trying out 3 fireblasts and a wheel as Dave suggested...and that seems to be working out better than the fanatics I was running originally. If sligh starts to regain popularity, I might go back to the fanatics though.

I'm still trying out blastminer in the board over the regular dwarven miner...doesn't anyone else like the option of playing him as a 2/2 colorless? Seems a better trade off vs. and aditional one toughness. If anyone would care to explain why blastminer is not better, I'd be interested in hearing their opinion.

[Gabethebabe]

Quote (Mith @ Jan. 03 2003,05:06)If anyone would care to explain why blastminer is not better, I'd be interested in hearing their opinion.

Miner vs. Blastminer: if you play them maindeck you should probably play Blastminer, because a 2/2 for 3 is better than a 1/2 for 2 in a matchup with few mining targets.

SB: Miner is better because you will play Blastminer unmorphed and the extra toughness of Miner will help in a lot of situations (Fire/Ice loves Blastminers)

[Milton]

Well, I played Ankh Sligh this weekend in a small tournament and I won.  I haven't done well in tournaments latley, shedding about 150 ratings points since my high of 1858 at Gen Con.  

But, that all ended when I switched to Sligh.  Keeper and Control have nothing on this deck.  

For reference, here is what I played:

4 Jakal Pup
4 Gorilla Shaman
3 Goblin Cadet

4 Lightning Bolt
4 Chain Lightning
4 Incinterate
4 Price of Progress

4 Ankh of Mishra
4 Cursed Scroll

1 Black Vise
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Fork

4 Wastelands
1 Stripmine
17 Mountains

Board:  (Heavily metagamed)
4 Pyrokenisis
3 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Anarchy (total metagame call)
2 Fire/Ice (again, megagame call to kill aggro janky randomness)
3 Cursed Totem

It was a small, 10 man tournament.  Two fully powered Keeper decks, both with good players, three Suicide Black decks, me with Sligh, White Weenie and three rougish aggro decks were present.  I went 3-1 in the prelims, losing to WW. I then beat WW in the semi's and crushed Keeper in the finals to win $50 in store credit.  

My thoughts so far on Ankh Sligh:

1) I didn't like the Goblin Cadets.  I want a two casting cost two toughness creature that can block in this slot.  Is there a 2/2 for 2 in red with a minimal drawback that can block?  If so, I need one.  Otherwise, next time I replace the Cadets with Fanatics or Dwarven Miners.  Miners block Ophidians all day long.  Fanatics are pretty cool too.  But, I need something else here.

2) I loved Black Vise and Fork.  I Forked a Braingeyser for three.  I Forked Fact or Fiction a couple of times.  Fork brings a really neat element to this deck.  And, it is always unexpected.  I drew Vise all day long.  The Vise won me a few games.  Out of the board, Ensnaring Bridge was awesome, holding off armies while I burned my helpless opponents.  Pyrokenesis and Ensnaring Bridge and Cursed Scroll all have such good synergy.

3) I didn't like Wheel of Fortune.  The only time I cast it I was doing so to draw a coutner from my opponent.  It could just have been another creature.  It will be replaced.

4) Mana ratio is awesome.  I didn't even have any problem casting Anarchy when I needed it.

5) With Ankh, Vise and Scroll providing colorless damage along with Price of Progress and a fair creature threat, Misdirection isn't that much of a concern.  I could always get around it if I needed to with non targeting spells.  Can't Misdirect a Scroll.  Can't Misdirect a Price.

Again, this deck controls the flow of the game much more so than does typical Sligh.  It's slower and doesn't topdeck as well, but it is much more versatile.  In fact, Scrolls, Vise and now Ankh have made Anarchy and Red Blast obsolete.  Colorless damage gets through all the time.  Even if your opponent plays an early COP Red, if you cast Ankh you control how much mana he can play, essentially controling how many times your opponent can activate COP Red during your turn.  Without the mana to opperate the COP, the game is quickly over as your side grows with threats and his hand fills-up with land!

[Legend]

@ Milton

Good job. Christ that is precipitous drop in rating, but you WILL be back if you keep playing this deck. I've said all along that this deck is a buzz saw.

The Ankhs are just amazing, adding a whole new dimension to the deck. I am glad that someone else has seen that it is time for Wheel of Fortune to go. It is too dangerous to play it.

However, I strongly urge you to reconsider Goblin Cadets. They are great attackers and the path can be cleared for them. They are great against Keeper or anything controlling. Try the Cadets again, they are great.

On an unrelated note for general consideration, I have noticed that it is worth it to side in Rack and Ruin against Mask as well as TNT, because you can kill the Mask and the Dreadnought, or a Mox and the Mask.

EDIT: Thanks to Dave for the rules clarification on this.\n\n

[Milton]

I have never played against Mask.  I have no opinions on the match-up what so ever.  I think that Mask, as good as it is, is still somewhat rare, at least in my metagame.  If I played against it, I would side in the 4 Ensnaring Bridges and hope I can get one into play before he can cast Mask - Naught.  But, I'll cross that bridge when I have to.  Right now, I am not at all worried about it.

But, as to the Cadets, is there a two casting cost 2/2 in red that can block?  I want something that can survive a Keg for 1 and can block an Ophidian and live.  If you can think of something, let me know.

I don't think I'll play this in the big tournament this weekend, I'm not that good with it yet.  I'll probabally go U/R Phid.

Anyway, my board for a wide open metagame would be 4 Bridges, 4 Pyro's, 4 Scald and 3 Crypts.  I like Crypt, Pyro and Bridge together against TnT.  Good synergy.  Rack and Ruin along with Bridge seems too slow.

[Freddie]

Milton, the Naught will still get in one attack, unless you bolt the naught or something to make it turn over.

The naught will typicly be a 0/1 creature when it is declared as an attacker, but then after the legal attack is declared: BLAM!!! that is when its 12/12 stupidity becomes evident.

So it will keep single naughts from attacking you 2 times for the kill, but all it will take is 8 more points to seal the deal.

-Freddie

[Matt The Great]

Quote (Milton @ Jan. 06 2003,17:23)But, as to the Cadets, is there a two casting cost 2/2 in red that can block?  I want something that can survive a Keg for 1 and can block an Ophidian and live.  If you can think of something, let me know.

IRONCLAW ORCS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

In fact, he can ONLY block if he'll live.

[Milton]

Freddie, I know the Naught still gets the attack.  But, if you cast a Pyro or a Bolt or something on it before attack is declared, with the Bridge out, you save yourself 12 points.  It's worth it.

Also, I thought about Ironclaw Orc, but there has to be something better.  Countless expansions and Ironclaw Orcs is the best we can do?  There just has to be something better.

[ump]

Quote But, as to the Cadets, is there a two casting cost 2/2 in red that can block?  I want something that can survive a Keg for 1 and can block an Ophidian and live.  If you can think of something, let me know.

Goblin War Buggy - Haste. ; Echo

Mogg Jailer - ~this~ can't attack if defending player controls an untapped creature with power 2 or less

Mogg Toady - ~this~ can't attack unless you control more creatures than defending player. ; ~this~ can't block unless you control more creatures than attacking player.