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Author Topic: Wow, a Keeper question on this forum :)  (Read 1409 times)
Anonymous
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« on: January 07, 2003, 07:01:22 pm »

Hi everyone,

I'm a long time keeper player who sold his power a few months ago but, I have a friend whom I can borrow most of it from.

Anyways, I'm heading to a tourney in a couple of weeks and really like the looks of Azhrei's new Paragon Keeper deck so I plan on running something close to that.

The metagame should be a pretty random one, with not much power, no tnt or masknought. I'm guessing a lot of aggro with maybe a semi powered keeper or miracle grow thrown into the mix.

I have access to all of the power except mox ruby, so my question is...should I even run red? Fire/Ice would be great in this environment, but shaman and even REB would probably be pretty useless. I was thinking of just running w/b/u paragonish keeper using duress in the sideboard to shore up some of what will be missing with REB gone.

After thinking about this however..I'm not sure how good the cunning wishes would be, I wouldnt have access to shattering pulse or F/I and a lot of the spot answers wouldnt really be needed against so random of a metagame,  so maybe I could replace the two wishes with a dismantling blow and a vampiric tutor?

Thanks in advance for answers to these questions and any other helpful input you can give me!!
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Anonymous
Guest
« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2003, 07:05:35 pm »

A followup question which I forgot.

If I do drop red, I'll have 2 open spots to fill, would it be worth it to throw in the the power artifact/grim monolith combo or should I just shore up the deck against some of the randomness, perhaps a moat or other form of creature control?

Any and all suggestions welcome =)
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Schmakt
Guest
« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2003, 11:29:11 pm »

I'll stick my head in for a quick second.

Re: Power Monolith
I feel like I was reading a post earlier about the Vampiric Tutor slot in Keeper, and someone mentioned that the only Keeper players that really need Vampiric are thost that run the combo.  It sounded like pretty good logic to me, so I'd say that if you go with the combo, you'll also need to make space for the Vampiric. (perhaps in the missing Mox Ruby slot?  You may be safe with the -1 mana source since you're dropping to only three colors)

Also, you mentioned dropping the Wishes.  I think the COP: Red/Altar Reality combo is really great to pull on someone, but you may also be able to drop that if you drop the Wishes (assuming you were playing it), giving you another MD slot.  Have you thought about running Moat?  Especially if you plan on seeing lots of aggro.  And what about Powder Keg for the other slots?

k, that's all I have.  Get a second opinion. Wink
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spin13
Guest
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2003, 01:25:48 am »

Minor correction, but you don't have to worry about the Vamp slot if you lose the Ruby.  You replace the two Red cards with Vampiric Tutor and Power Artifact and replace the Ruby with the Grim Monolith.  It works out the same in the end, but the key is replacing a mana source with a mana source.  Its important to realize you can't just cut down on mana sources simply because you are missing a Mox or two.  

If you're playing Keeper or a variant, 28 mana sources is still important, no matter what your lack or lack of need of certain cards.  Cutting a Wasteland? Add a dual.  Missing a Mox? Add a dual.  Can't add more duals?  Add a City.  Have too many Cities? Add an Island.  Mana hungry decks are mana hungry whether you've got the utility or acceleration or not.

 -Eric
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Anonymous
Guest
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2003, 12:10:46 am »

One more question;

With the absence of red in my deck, what would best fill the spot of REB in sideboard, Duress or Gainsay?

Thanks in advance.
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leviat
Guest
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2003, 12:18:12 am »

I'm not sure what your sideboard looks like, but you could fill it with any of the following:

Moat
Allay
Aura Fracture
Another Sword to Plowshares
Powder Keg
Diabolic Edict
Ebony Charm
...
..
.
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Freddie
Guest
« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2003, 12:08:51 pm »

To this day, this is the MOST consistant version of the combo Keeper deck that I have played:

Although I think that you should play whatever you feel the most conformitible with.

This is what I have played in the last 5 tournaments in a similar metagame that you have described, undefeated thus far:

Blue: (22)
Morphling: 1
Power Artifact: 1

Mana Drain: 4
Force Of Will: 4
Counter Spell / Future Sight: 1
Misdirection: 1

Impulse: 4
Ancestral Recall: R
Time Walk: R
Mystical Tutor: R
Fact Or Fiction: R
Stroke Of Genius: R
Brain Geyser: R

Black: (4)
Demonic Tutor: R
Vampiric Tutor: R
Mind Twist: R
Yawgmoth's Will: R

White: (4)
Balance: R
Swords To Plowshares: 2
Dismanteling Blow: 1

Red: (1)
Fireball: 1

Artifact: (1)
Zuran Orb: 1

Mana: (28)
Black Lotus: R
Sol Ring: R
Mox Sapphire: R
Mox Jet: R
Mox Pearl: R
Mox Ruby: R
Mox Emerald: R
Grim Monolith: R
Library Of Alexandria: R
Tolarian Academy: R
Stripmine: R
Wasteland: 1
Dust Bowl: 1
City Of Brass: 2
Polluted Delta: 4
Underground Sea: 3
Tundra: 3
Volcanic Island: 3

Sideboard: (15)
Red Elemental Blast: 4
Blue Elemental Blast: 1
Misdirection: 3
Chainer's Edict: 1
Timetwister: R
Wheel of Fortune: R
Enlightened Tutor: R
Circle or Protection Red: 1
Aura Fracture: 1
Tormod's Crypt: 1

This build looks a little unconventional, but it works quite well (for me).

It gold fishes after SB against just about anything with out counterspells.

In my aggro heavy enviornment, I will combo probibly 60% - 70% of the time before SB, and 100% of the time after SB.

Against Control (non oath) I will combo very little, but I always keep it in the back of my head. I SB the combo out after the 1st game, and just go into sheer control mode, with a crazy number of counterspells.

This strategy is not without Cpntroversy, but I really put alot of faith in it.

Against Oath control strategies, if they leave their oath engines then I will go for the full on combo, with a bunch of counterspells for backup.

Thus far all has ended well with this deck for me, I hope (that if you decide to use it) that it will for you as well.

Either way, good luck.

-Freddie
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