Everlasting Suffering

[GerryMander]

Eternal Suffering
{B}{B}
Enchantment
Whenever a creature is dealt damage, prevent that damage and put the same number of pain counters on that creature instead.
Creatures get -1/-1 for each pain counter on them.


Rules Breaking cards have always been fun.  Here is another one!

We all know that creatures gain back all of their toughness at the beginning of each player's turn.  Now they don't.  Not really a practical card, and I doubt there will ever be an Eternal Suffering deck, except maybe an Eternal Suffering/Pestilence deck, but I think that this is a card that needed to be made.

Also, I think that this prevents regeneration, because the creature will be regenerated with pain counters on them, so they will still have the -1/-1 per pain counter.  Also helps a pinger eventually kill a Levaithan.  I know that killing Levaithans has always been a problem for me...


CURRENT WORDING:

Eternal Suffering
1BB
Enchantment
If a creature would be dealt damage instead prevent that damage and put the same number of pain counters on that creature.
Creatures get -0/-1 for each pain counter on them.

CHANGES:
-changed it from -1/-1 to -0/-1 *Jacob*
-lowered the mana cost *half Eph... eh... the "E" guy, half GerryMander, half Jacob (I know that it doesn't add up, so SHH)*

[Jacob Orlove]

Shouldn't creatures get -0/-1 for each pain counter? Or would that be too weak?

[GerryMander]

actually, that is what I meant to put on here.  Whoopsi-daisy!

changes made.

[Ephraim]

I like this card. It feels a lot like Upwelling, which is an unplayable but extremely cool card. This breaks the rules, sure, but it manages it in a very sensible way and really has a high cool factor for having never been done before. You could almost certainly get away with costing this at {B}, though. Look at Death Pits of Rath. It's quite a bit better than this, I think, and it only costs {B}. I might even suggest for parity with Upwelling, but this is an extremely black-flavoured effect.

[goober]

Instead of ugly -0/-1 counters could this just make you skip the damage removal part of the clean up phase?

"Damage don't get removed at the end of turn step."

Compared to Upwelling's "Mana pools don't empty at the end of phases or turns."

Would this work, or will Jebus strike me down?

[GerryMander]

I would rather not make this a rule nightmare, so I will keep the pain counters, but I will lower the mana cost.

[Jacob Orlove]

I think 1BB would be "blacker" than 2B, which fits with the card's flavor.

[GerryMander]

agreed.  ch-ch-changes made.

[Matt]

I definitely think you should go with Goober's suggestion.

[Jebus]

If Upwelling can be made, then I suppose a ban on "healing" is possible.  Although, I would put a lot of thought into how to word it.

Although, if you keep the current theme, why not just give the creatures -x/-x.  It's easier that way.

[goober]

-1/-1 counters actually make more sense than -0/-1.  If you have a large gash in your chest you probably won't be too effective at fighting.  Plus it is the most clean way to do it.

[GerryMander]

I honestly think that we shouldn't go with Goober's suggestion.  The way that m:tg works now, they try and make it as easy as possible to remember things.  If we worded it where we just skip the damage removal clause, then how would people remember how much damage a creature has taken?  You know that they would eventually errata this card to be like how it is now anyway.

They did it to culumitave upkeep.  They changed it from something that had to be remembered to age counters.

[Jebus]

If people can remember how much mana is in their pool with Upwelling, I don't see a problem.

[Bram]

This is really savage. It makes Magic's creatures more like Battletech's 'Mechs.

Obviously you need some kind of card in addition to this one that removes a pain counter from your creatures during your upkeep so that yours slowely 'recuperate' or something.

[Jacob Orlove]

Obviously you need some kind of card in addition to this one that removes a pain counter from your creatures during your upkeep so that yours slowely 'recuperate' or something.

We could add an additional ability to this:
Pay one life: remove a pain counter from target creature. Any player may play this ability.

I like how pro: black creatures can't be "healed" with this wording.

[Jebus]

I still think it's silly to use "pain" counters instead of just using actual counters that reduce the toughness.  Seems like extra work when it could be simplified.

Also, it should be "If a creature would be dealt damage..."

[Jacob Orlove]

Well, this way, we can effectively get -0/-1 counters, which would otherwise not be something we should be doing.

[dandan]

I got a credit fot changing this card without posting!!

I like the card and I think the you should be able to take the pain from your creatures by paying life (kind of like Vampire giving Blood). However this would make the card suck as a creature killer, which it is. Kick-bottom name BTW

[GerryMander]

whoops, I miss credited.  That should be Epharim or whatever his name is.

changes made.

I don't think that we are going to be able to get around using pain counters, because of today's state in magic.  I wish they didn't do away with every type of + and - counter. . .

[GerryMander]

24 hour clock

[GerryMander]

there was a lot of disscussion with this card, and I am not sure that it was resolved yet.  if it was, then I will have this closed/finalized.  If not, someone please give me a reason.

[Matt]

Because I don't have a stable internet connection yet, though I am SUPPOSED to get it tomorrow. When I do I'll add all the backlog of cards to the list.

[Matt]

Closed and added.[/color]