jCoKn
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« on: August 18, 2004, 11:19:44 pm » |
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2:30 AM, Sunday Aug 15th…
The lack of sleep begins to affect my judgment as we lie awake playing Gamecube and assembling random Type 1 decks that could pass off as “playable�. A stroke of genius tells me to play 4 color control simply because I’ve seen it win, though I’ve never actually played it. Cool, huh?
The next morning, we depart from Ryan’s house with the following crew:
Me – Jon – Topdecker extraordinaire and star of today’s show Ryan – He who is nearly fully powered and who has just enough to lend us all for 5 proxy. Dan – Has never actually played Type 1 before, but feels confident. Eric – Goes to play block. Block?
Actually, we had all attended Saturday’s Block event in Grand Prix: New Jersey and for some strange reason we all scrubbed out (God hated me for commiting such a sin). Having never attended a DCI event before in my life, let alone play with a “limited card pool�… What’s the point in that? So after being tempted to buy a piece of power or two we head over to the table and sign up and scribble down our decklists, which took me nearly a half hour since the build was a little… uhh… unorthodox shall we say. See for yourself:
“Freakin’ Sheep� 4CC 4 Exalted Angel 1 Decree of Justice 2 Swords to Plowshares 1 Balance -Ryan snatched a DCI judge one after I play… go figure. 2 Skeletal Scrying 1 Demonic Tutor 1 Mind Twist 1 Yawgmoth’s Will 2 Gorilla Shaman 4 Force Of Will 4 Mana Drain 4 Brainstorm 1 Ancestral Recall - The pimpest proxy you’ll ever see in your life. 1 Time Walk - Nearly as pimp, but not quite. 1 Fact or Fiction 1 Mystical Tutor 2 Cunning Wish 4 U/B/W/R Moxen 1 Black Lotus 1 Sol Ring 1 Crucible of Worlds - So, so, so, so good. 3 Wasteland 1 Strip Mine 4 Flooded Strand 1 Island 3 Tundra 3 Underground Sea 2 Volcanic Island 2 City of Brass 1 Library of Alexandria -Ridiculously broken card.
And the most potent sideboard in the world:
1 Swords to Plowshares 1 Crucible of Worlds 2 Rack and Ruin 3 Red Elemental Blast 1 Blue Elemental Blast 1 Disenchant 2 Fire/Ice 1 Coffin Purge 1 Vampiric Tutor 1 Energy Flux 1 Skeletal Scrying
Before the tourney I saw some big names of the type 1 world present, Jeff Anand (Samite Healer) and Ashok Chitturi among others, praying by my gods that my death would be quick and painless to all these fully powered vintage monsters (versus me and my Emerald… which does me loads of good in 4cc). So I head in to Round 1 nervous and freezing cold – the tournament was held right under a massive A/C vent which had me shivering for hours to come.
ROUND 1 vs. Mark w/ T1 Ravager
…Pregame he tells me he got a Lotus yesterday from a vendor here at the GP for $600. The same Lotus Ryan was gonna get like 30 mins after he saw it. Grrr. Mark seemed really cool, he also said that he essentially threw in his Lotus and 5 proxies into his deck from yesterday… So either Ravager or Type 1 Tooth and Nail. Gotcha!
He opens up with an explosive start, leaving him with 2 cards in hand, and many many summoning sick artifact fatties. My hand of 2 Moxes, waste, Balance, Angel, and more sealed that game fairly quick.
In: Flux, StoP, 2x R&R Out: 2x Scrying, 2x Wish
Game two was somewhat less of a hassle, as turn 3 infinite wasting seales the deal along with a little R&R.
ROUND 2 vs. Raymond w/ Reanimator-ish Dragon
I saw a mana-base of Scrubland and Badlands and Gemstone mine, so I was thinking Rector? Then I drained a Buried Alive and said uhoh and followed with a Mind Twist for 3. Of course, he loses a WGDargon and some reanimate spells etc. I played a long waste game on him in which LoA won the first of many games that day. I also Wished for a StoP in hopes of him casting a reanimate.
In: BEB, Purge Out: 2x Scrying
Game 2 I kept a hand of 5 land, Library, and Coffin Purge. Needless to say, Library wins the game hands-down. This was the kick-off on my streak of insane luck that day, as Library rode me into many counters and eventually a Decree for 12 soldiers. I had 10 land, some moxen and a Lotus or something… it was pretty cool that after like 25 turns I found a kill condition… like 5 + tutors isn’t enough!
ROUND 3 vs. Ray Clavette w/ 4CC
Ryan had actually spoken of Ray the night before, and said he was the CT state champ like 2 years ago? He warned me that Ray was an excellent player and I’d need to watch my moves.
Game 1 was the first time all weekend, in any match I played, where I won a die roll. I was positively giddy. I saw a hand with Crucible and Strip Mine, with force backup. No questions asked I went for the lock and it won me the game. Highlights in this one included me draining a Mox and FoWing a Sol Ring. Crucible is the tech in the mirror.
In: Crucible!!!, 2x REB, 1x Scrying Out: Mystical, 1x Angel, 1x Wish, Balance
Game 2 I essentially kept a hand I should not have and was punished brutally for it. A lone unmorphed Angel pwns me as I search for StoP. My first game loss of the day L.
In: Balance Out: 1x Scrying
Game 3 was a long game and looking bleek for our story’s hero as he casts his black lotus off a massive Main Phase scrying, which gets eaten by the Mox Monkey opposite the field from it. With loss seeming inevitable, Lady Luck thanks Jon for last night and gives him a Recall on the top of his library which runs into Yawgmoth’s Will, Balance, and Crucible! Needless to say, the game turned around rather quickly as Ray shook his head in disgust at my n00bishness and LAUCKYNASS! I reflected afterwards on how poorly I played, yet I am simply the god of topdecks and in Magic, sometimes Luck > Skill.
ROUND 4 vs. Turboman w/ Turboland
I watched this guy annihilate Stax in game 2/2 in Round 1 and he played with an enthusiasm and raw energy I’ve never seen before piloting such a rogue deck. For some reason I was paired down with him but it didn’t bother me. It turns out he thought I was playing Dragon, which he claims is his worst matchup, so I play along and he thinks its cool to just ID this round with me and win the next. Fine by me, I’m 3-0 and in a 36(?) man tourney, 3-0-2 will make it. When we play a game for fun, and he realizes I’m 4CC he is stunned temporarily, then proceeds to go bayou, exploration, exploration, crucible, waste, waste, waste, etc, etc, death to me. I’m like “Whoa� and he’s like “yeah�. Sorry I didn’t remember your name by the way…
ROUND 5 vs. Jeff Anand w/ the Pimpest 4CC EvAr!
During round 2, when to my right I saw a Darksteel Colossus sitting atop his Beta Moxen and Lotus, I nearly crapped my pants. Needless to say I didn’t want to play this game out so we ID’d.
HOORAY for n00bz in the T8!
And since I was such a Lucky Bastard that day, I got paired against my best matchup…
TOP 8 vs. ??He who savagely beastified Ryan?? w/ TriniStax
Oh boy.
In Pittsfield, MA at a Mox tourney last month, I saw Ryan (piloting 4CC) lose to Stax with 2 active unmorphed Angels, many many land, and 30+ life. The deck is possibly the most dominant in the format right now so I pretty much was getting my stuff ready to go. But wait… could Jon pull another one out of his sleeve again? Hmm…
Game 1 he kept a somewhat subpar hand which met my hand of 2x FoW, 1x Drain, 2x Moxen 1x Waste, 1x Ancestral. I force his early Trinisphere and Crucible joins the team to eradicate his hopes of victory. I was topdecking like mad, needless to say. At one point, I poured my soul into the top card of my library, saying “Wasteland! Come to me!� and it’s there. (and StoP on the draw after he lands a welder… not bad!)
In: Flux, 2x R&R, Disenchant, BEB Out: 2x Scrying, 1x Wish, 1x FoF
Game 2 he parised to 5, indicating my luck at maximum level once again. He opened a strong Workshop > Crucible which met my Force. I lay lands and eventually hit ENERGY FLUX! (I win the game now). For a n00b, my play of the day was allowing a metalworker to resolve under flux, knowing he’d have to keep him tapped during upkeep just to provide for himself (no moxen in play) when he tried to play a second, he met StoP. I was so proud of myself. I conquered the giant.
Onto the Semis where Ashok Chitturi (The M.E.T.H.O.D.) is hurrying me into a match, though I desperately want to go downstairs to the skatepark and warm up with all the sweaty, smelly, yet warm air. Whatever, we play.
SEMIS vs. Ashok w/ Meandeck Titan? -correct me if I’m wrong here please, anyone?
I keep a ballsy yet ridiculously powerful hand of Lotus, Mox, Mox, Land, Angel, Scrying, Cunning Wish. He plays first, dropping island (the pimpest DCI beta foil island ive ever seen), Jet, go. I draw, of course it’s a Force… would you expect anything less of the topdeck king? I no my thang, drop the 1st turn angel, and no counters meet its glory. “My ass really hurts now� was my valiant opponent’s reply. I’m home free, or so I think. I beat him down to 4 whilst I have Balance, StoP in hand and no white source. He has an active welder. In desperation, he topdecks into… Thirst for Knowledge! Which proceeds to drop a Slaver in the yard and takes my turn the greedy guy! It’s not like he doesn’t get a fair share now he wants mine just as I’m about to win? Just to make it more unfair, I topdeck into a strand, which he searches up a tundra, and StoPs my Angel on her path to victory. Now at 3 life, he gets out a titan, eats most of my lands, and then something very very peculiar happened. Keep in mind that I’m a lucksack. I draw a Cunning Wish, which from his hand he drains, so I assume he’s gonna get thirsty next main, but instead swings for the win with his titan (I was at 4). I point out the drain mana floating, he attempts to rewind, but the DCI judge watching our game rules that he loses.
And I’ll be honest, I can’t remember a thing about the next 2 moatches, other than the fact that I was in a state of shock and awe, and I won the third with soldier tokens, I believe.
So I’m like WTF I get to the finals with on random streak of luck and decide not to push it any further. The prize for tops was a sealed box of Italian Legends or a EX Mox Ruby… Hmm decisions decisions… I split in the finals with a guy I knew not, only that he played Workshop Slaver and was of oriental descent. A nice guy, to say the least, he let us buy out his share of the sealed box and take it as our precious. So I am the winnar of the whole shebang and now have a sealed box of Legends up for sale… Any takers?
Not bad considering we were originally going to play in the Team Sealed Deck event that same day.
Peace >O
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Remember: Winners go home and fuck the prom queen and the losers sit at home whining about it.  -Jazzykat
The Quad Entente - Yeah, we're all terrible               - Yeah, 3/4 members t16 at Waterbury V
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Klep
OMG I'M KLEP!
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« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2004, 11:43:05 pm » |
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Honestly, this build is ridiculous, as is your habit of boarding out your draw engine. You won by getting lucky repeatedly. Please read my primer before playing with 4CC again.
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So I suppose I should take The Fringe back out of my sig now...
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Zherbus
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« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2004, 11:47:41 pm » |
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Congratulations and all that, but with the mistakes in both play (from what's conveyed in the report) and building... you owe Lady Luck a beer.
I'd post something a little more helpful, like fixing your manabase to make 4 Angels work better (cutting a Sea since you cut a Scrying and adding a Tundra), but you did win a box and who am I to argue. Cheers to the stud then... sloncha!
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Founder, Admin of TheManaDrain.com
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Sawse
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« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2004, 11:57:11 pm » |
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During round 2, when to my right I saw a Darksteel Colossus sitting atop his Beta Moxen and Lotus, I nearly crapped my pants. Needless to say I didn’t want to play this game out so we ID’d. I too crapped my pants when i look across the table at a Colossus that just walks right over my boas. Trust me, it sucked more for me than it did for you to watch it.
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Moxlotus
Teh Absolut Ballz
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Where the fuck are my pants?
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« Reply #4 on: August 19, 2004, 10:06:07 am » |
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1. You only have 2 Scryings in the deck. 2. You repeatedly board out your draw engine?!?! Why?
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jCoKn
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« Reply #5 on: August 20, 2004, 04:06:56 pm » |
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I will flat out agree that much luck won me the box, no questions asked. But really I guess I somewhat overexaggerated my suckyness. I made a few blatant play errors, but I'm not the only one who does. I managed to stay afloat in this tourney because I managed to recover from my mistakes by careful play. Also, I had actually playtested the deck a few times, so I knew how to get things done.
Also, as per subbing scrying out... I really only boarded it out in situations where answers to their threats was imperative to my staying alive. Against Stax, I don't want to see scrying, I want to see R&R or Disenchant. Plus, scrying works real well against tangle wires. And in the case of Ravager affinity, first game he dropeed his whole hand first turn, I was thinking more along the lines of balance than drawing cards (and losing more life).
The build was pleasantly awkward, for those who ask. Ryan had played the deck extensively and decided to play a fourth angel + decree, and I'm quite glad he did. I'm a very aggressive player... once I see an opportunity I go straight for the kill; maybe this is unorthodox, but hey it worked for me this time. And Zherbus, I wouldn't cut a sea, the mana base as it stands is probably the most stable it can get without completely disrupting the gameplan (even at that it's quite vulnerable). Plus, if anything I'd like another basic Island in there, not duals. Anyway thanks all for the constructive criticism.
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Remember: Winners go home and fuck the prom queen and the losers sit at home whining about it.  -Jazzykat
The Quad Entente - Yeah, we're all terrible               - Yeah, 3/4 members t16 at Waterbury V
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johnstown713
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« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2004, 11:28:00 pm » |
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Actually Jon wrote the decklist wrong and that is not what was in the deck. My build was different but he decided to change it before the event. Only God knows why since my build was actually playable. Oh and he is the luckiest person i have ever seen. Jon is not a bad person but it is just that he decided to change the deck. And you can't keep bashing Jon about the list since he made his own choices according to his play style and preference. You can't say someone is bad since they don'tlay the same list that everyone agrees on. We hate netrdecking and try to change stuff around. I even played maindeck Moat to be funny. On a side note Jon stole my deck so I had to play Ravager. And he even took my sweet deckname. Also props to Ashok for being cool about what happened. Honestly he had that game and match, Jon is just to lucky. Congrats on the finish and thatnks for winning the box for our team. Johnstown713
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wuaffiliate
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« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2004, 11:37:34 pm » |
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And you can't keep bashing Jon about the list since he made his own choices according to his play style and preference. You can't say someone is bad since they don'tlay the same list that everyone agrees on. Hmm. What would his playstyle be? "Bad"? 1) He makes terrible card choices when building the deck. Such as 4 angels and 3 tundras, only 2 scryings with 4 angels! 4 U/B/W/R Moxen < you run 4 angels, yet dont run a full set of moxen... 1 Crucible of Worlds < an angel should have been removed for this 3 Wasteland < 3 wasteland? you run cow you need 4 2) He can't sideboard correctly. Who in god's name sideboards out scrying and fof? /death @ that. Example of terrible sideboarding( bold=mistake): ROUND 1 vs. Mark w/ T1 Ravager In: Flux, StoP, 2x R&R Out: 2x Scrying, 2x Wish
ROUND 2 vs. Raymond w/ Reanimator-ish Dragon In: BEB, Purge Out: 2x Scrying
ROUND 3 vs. Ray Clavette w/ 4CC In: Crucible!!!, 2x REB, 1x Scrying Out: Mystical, 1x Angel, 1x Wish, Balance In: Balance Out: 1x Scrying
TOP 8 vs. ??He who savagely beastified Ryan?? w/ TriniStax In: Flux, 2x R&R, Disenchant, BEB Out: 2x Scrying, 1x Wish, 1x FoF Now tell me again why he cannot be bashed? Oh and congrats on the win.
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johnstown713
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« Reply #8 on: August 20, 2004, 11:42:35 pm » |
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No there were actually 4 Tundras in the build that was just a typo. So unless he did change that then there are definetly 4 Tundra and I don't think even he is that dumb. It was my deck so I'm positive there were 4 and only 2 Seas.
Johnstown713
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Klep
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« Reply #9 on: August 21, 2004, 12:25:31 am » |
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Also, I had actually playtested the deck a few times, so I knew how to get things done. No, you didn't know how to get things done. You lucked your way through the tourney. Your list and sideboarding strategies show an astounding lack of knowledge about the function of the deck. Also, as per subbing scrying out... I really only boarded it out in situations where answers to their threats was imperative to my staying alive.
You sided it out in EVERY MATCH. How the hell do you expect to find those answers if you take out the cards that let you? Against Stax, I don't want to see scrying, I want to see R&R or Disenchant.
Wrong. You want to see both. Again, your answers won't do shit for you if you can't find them. Plus, scrying works real well against tangle wires.
Yes it does. Instants don't give a shit about Tangle Wire. And in the case of Ravager affinity, first game he dropeed his whole hand first turn, I was thinking more along the lines of balance than drawing cards (and losing more life).
Clearly if this was a problem for you, you didn't mulligan properly. Mistakes on your part don't mean you compound them by removing your ability to outdraw your opponent. The build was pleasantly awkward, for those who ask. Ryan had played the deck extensively and decided to play a fourth angel + decree, and I'm quite glad he did. I'm a very aggressive player... once I see an opportunity I go straight for the kill; maybe this is unorthodox, but hey it worked for me this time.
If this is the case, you are playing the wrong deck. 4CC is control or aggro-control, depending on your hand and the matchup, nothing else. You do not get to decide that you will play it aggro-control all of the time. That will make you lose. And if you try to play it like an aggro deck, then you are beyond hope. And Zherbus, I wouldn't cut a sea, the mana base as it stands is probably the most stable it can get without completely disrupting the gameplan (even at that it's quite vulnerable). Plus, if anything I'd like another basic Island in there, not duals. Anyway thanks all for the constructive criticism.
If you're going to run 4 Angels and board your meager 2 Scryings out every match, then at least adjust your manabase to try to make up for your incompetance with the rest of the deck. You put an even heavier emphasis on white while decreasing your reliance on black, and that doesn't suggest to you that your manabase might want to be tweaked? We aren't here to discuss "good enough." We are here to discuss optimal.
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So I suppose I should take The Fringe back out of my sig now...
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jCoKn
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« Reply #10 on: August 22, 2004, 09:55:58 pm » |
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Well I suppose this is the part where I go cripple and bow down to the gods of Type 1 and beg for forgiveness and mercy of the paragons. Actually, I'd rather not, considering TMD is a community for greater learning and sharing ideas. For Wu and Klep, please take an example from Zherbus... Congratulations and all that, but with the mistakes in both play (from what's conveyed in the report) and building... you owe Lady Luck a beer.
I'd post something a little more helpful, like fixing your manabase to make 4 Angels work better (cutting a Sea since you cut a Scrying and adding a Tundra), but you did win a box and who am I to argue.
Notice the constructive criticism approach as opposed to: Hmm. What would his playstyle be? "Bad"?
or If this is the case, you are playing the wrong deck. 4CC is control or aggro-control, depending on your hand and the matchup, nothing else. You do not get to decide that you will play it aggro-control all of the time. That will make you lose. And if you try to play it like an aggro deck, then you are beyond hope. I'm glad you were there watching me play every game, Klep. Maybe you could have told me then how bad of a player I am, and I would have simply pointed to my X-0 standing on the pairing list. How do you know I played it aggro every time? More games than most, I did play control, but they're not really the ones that stick out in my mind from the tourney... I don't write a tournament report stating every boring land drop, every spell cast, and every point of damage taken. If you saw a hand that looked like this: Black Lotus Mox Pearl Mox Ruby Underground Sea Wasteland Exalted Angel Force of Will Would you keep it? Would you play a la controle?I posted this report in the first place because I was asked to, second because TMD gives me the right to share my ideas freely so long as it doesn't step on anyone's toes. Sorry if I offended anyone by posting...? Klep says: That will make you loseIt sure did, huh?
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Remember: Winners go home and fuck the prom queen and the losers sit at home whining about it.  -Jazzykat
The Quad Entente - Yeah, we're all terrible               - Yeah, 3/4 members t16 at Waterbury V
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johnstown713
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« Reply #11 on: August 22, 2004, 10:02:50 pm » |
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*Trying to keep the flaming to a minimum*
Jon is totally correct here. From when I was watching he played well and knew how to adapt to certain matches. A tournament report gives you a recap of what happened but unless you are actually there then it is hard to say what was played well and what wasn't. Hey, we are all Type 1 players. We have fun and sometimes do stupid things. Hell I would have kept to first turn angel hand even if I knew my opponent had a force just cause that is so damn cool. When you win your worst matchups then it is not totally luck.
Oh and keep in mind it was his first freeking time with the deck in a tournament. How many others can say the first time they played a certain deck in a tournament they won. I bet its not as many as you think.
Johnstown713
P.S. It was 2:30 in the morning when all this building was done. Followed by 5 hours of sleep and intense gaming.
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wuaffiliate
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« Reply #12 on: August 22, 2004, 10:08:05 pm » |
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Example of terrible sideboarding(bold=mistake): ROUND 1 vs. Mark w/ T1 Ravager In: Flux, StoP, 2x R&R Out: 2x Scrying, 2x Wish
ROUND 2 vs. Raymond w/ Reanimator-ish Dragon In: BEB, Purge Out: 2x Scrying
ROUND 3 vs. Ray Clavette w/ 4CC In: Crucible!!!, 2x REB, 1x Scrying Out: Mystical, 1x Angel, 1x Wish, Balance In: Balance Out: 1x Scrying
TOP 8 vs. ??He who savagely beastified Ryan?? w/ TriniStax In: Flux, 2x R&R, Disenchant, BEB Out: 2x Scrying, 1x Wish, 1x FoF
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johnstown713
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« Reply #13 on: August 22, 2004, 10:14:33 pm » |
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Example of terrible sideboarding(bold=mistake): ROUND 1 vs. Mark w/ T1 Ravager In: Flux, StoP, 2x R&R Out: 2x Scrying, 2x Wish
ROUND 2 vs. Raymond w/ Reanimator-ish Dragon In: BEB, Purge Out: 2x Scrying
ROUND 3 vs. Ray Clavette w/ 4CC In: Crucible!!!, 2x REB, 1x Scrying Out: Mystical, 1x Angel, 1x Wish, Balance In: Balance Out: 1x Scrying
TOP 8 vs. ??He who savagely beastified Ryan?? w/ TriniStax In: Flux, 2x R&R, Disenchant, BEB Out: 2x Scrying, 1x Wish, 1x FoF Wow, how about instead of insulting the sideboard choices you discuss how they should have been done. The idea is supposed to be to help each other not just tell them something stupid they did and leave it at that. Johnstown713
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jCoKn
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« Reply #14 on: August 22, 2004, 10:16:19 pm » |
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http://www.themanadrain.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=299969#299969Chill out guys, please. Who you hate and how bad you think people are, are topics that should generally be left for IRC and other places where it doesn't get in the way of serious discussion.
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Remember: Winners go home and fuck the prom queen and the losers sit at home whining about it.  -Jazzykat
The Quad Entente - Yeah, we're all terrible               - Yeah, 3/4 members t16 at Waterbury V
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goober
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« Reply #15 on: August 22, 2004, 10:30:20 pm » |
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Siding out your draw engine shows a gigantic lack of understanding of Magic in general. The inflammatory posts you mention are justified in this case. He insulted what you did wrong, so you will know better next time. While this may be a learning forum, it isn't kindergarten. Read some of the classic articles of the game to learn the basics, then this place will make you better. Not understanding something like card draw is unacceptable.
If you side in all of your Wish targets, why do you not side out the Wishes? The only thing you could Wish for is the Scryings you take out. Definitly up the Scrying count to 3, they are amazing. I personally like 4, but the deck is tight as hell, so you can't always. I like to side out Wishes, and other weaker cards for those matchups. Draw stay in, always.
Balance is golden in the mirror, I am glad to see you put it back in. However, Scrying is also gold. I like to bring in the REBs and lose the Wishes.
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Team Grosse Manschaft
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wuaffiliate
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« Reply #16 on: August 22, 2004, 10:55:02 pm » |
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I didn't flame, i just told it like it is. You played a deck that was WAY above your skill level and got lucky because you played with a high density of broken t1 cards. Plain and Simple.
Why did you sideboard out your draw engine (Scrying AND Fact of Fiction)? Why did you sideboard in wish targets and keep wishes in? Why did you sideboard out balance in one of it's best matches? (you did SB it back in though) Why did you only run 2 scrying with 4 angels? Why did you run 3 Tundras with 4 angels? Why did you run 3 Underground Seas with only 2 scrying? Why did you run Crucible and only 3 wastelands?
Mind answering those questions for me?
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johnstown713
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« Reply #17 on: August 22, 2004, 11:03:52 pm » |
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this should be the actual deck. It is what mine currently is. Main Deck Sideboard 3 Exalted Angel 2 Gorilla Shaman
1 Ancestral Recall 1 Balance 1 Black Lotus 4 Brainstorm 1 Crucible of Worlds 2 Cunning Wish 1 Decree of Justice 1 Demonic Tutor 1 Fact or Fiction 4 Force of Will 4 Mana Drain 1 Mind Twist 1 Mox Jet 1 Mox Pearl 1 Mox Ruby 1 Mox Sapphire 1 Mystical Tutor 2 Skeletal Scrying 1 Sol Ring 2 Swords to Plowshares 1 Time Walk 1 Yawgmoth's Will 1 Fire/Ice
1 Island 2 City of Brass 4 Flooded Strand 1 Library of Alexandria 1 Strip Mine 4 Tundra 2 Underground Sea 2 Volcanic Island 3 Wasteland
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jCoKn
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« Reply #18 on: August 22, 2004, 11:13:12 pm » |
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Hopefully this will calm some of the fuss:
1) I had never before played the deck in a tournament scene before. We scrounged up what decks we could with the cards available to us at 2:30 AM the morning of the tournament. (Wu... I can't answer any of those questions for you. I played the deck as it was handed to me)
2) Obviously coming from an aggroish playstyle background (I've played lots of FCG and Fish) I'm not used to the god rules of sideboarding in 4cc. I've read tournament reports, granted, but really I made what choices came natural to me; reactive responses. Sure, if I had had several weeks or months of playtesting I would have known the draw engine is very important and then I wouldn't have boarded it out.
3) It wasn't my deck. I picked it up, studied the list and card choices as well as I could on 5 hours of sleep and played it to the finals. I will agree with all of you that this is generally a bad idea, as evideced by the poor SB choices and play errors, but as Johnstown713 said, I'll bet not many of you have picked up a deck for the first time and played it to victory.
4) As to the list, my playstyle obviously fit the 5 kill conditions maindecked and I always liked seeing them. In other words, they were never redundant. Though 2 scryings seems low in hindsight, that day they really weren't working for me, between either never seeing them, or seeing them in bad conditions. And Goober, I did side out my Wishes (or at least 1) when I boarded in most of my answers.
It's not like I'm disagreeing with all of you that I made mistakes, it's just that perhaps those mistakes proved to be in part beneficial, because after all I still won.
EDIT: The decklist I played was Ryan's posted above, minus 1 Tundra, 1 Fire/Ice and added 1 Angel and 1 Underground
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Remember: Winners go home and fuck the prom queen and the losers sit at home whining about it.  -Jazzykat
The Quad Entente - Yeah, we're all terrible               - Yeah, 3/4 members t16 at Waterbury V
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Klep
OMG I'M KLEP!
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« Reply #19 on: August 22, 2004, 11:18:09 pm » |
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Notice the constructive criticism approach as opposed to: If this is the case, you are playing the wrong deck. 4CC is control or aggro-control, depending on your hand and the matchup, nothing else. You do not get to decide that you will play it aggro-control all of the time. That will make you lose. And if you try to play it like an aggro deck, then you are beyond hope. I'm glad you were there watching me play every game, Klep. Maybe you could have told me then how bad of a player I am, and I would have simply pointed to my X-0 standing on the pairing list. How do you know I played it aggro every time? More games than most, I did play control, but they're not really the ones that stick out in my mind from the tourney. If you would read what I posted, you would notice I made that statement in response to your saying that you seek to go aggressive whenever possible. That's why that quote starts off with "If this is the case." If, as you have indicated here, that is not the case then that statement does not apply. I never said you were a bad player, I only said that you were bad with this deck. Klep says: That will make you lose
It sure did, huh? As I said, you lucked out this time. Perhaps you would care to respond to the rest of my post, or wu's excellent questions.
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So I suppose I should take The Fringe back out of my sig now...
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