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Anusien
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« on: October 05, 2005, 01:11:36 pm » |
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Rabblerouser - 3W
Creature - Human
Pack 3 - T: Destroy target non-Human creature.
0/1
I wanted a creature that portrays the darker side of white - and for a long time I was looking at a Gestapo/Fascism aspect. That seems more white but I like this effect better and it is much easier to simulate on a card. What I wanted to do is show how White's attempts at law and order end up in tyranny and fascism as often as peace and justice. In practice, I could see this ending up more chaotic (red), and I wouldn't mind someone else taking a crack at a Fascism card.
Current Wording:
Rabblerouser - 3W
Creature - Human
Pack 3 - T: Destroy target non-Human creature.
0/2
1) Bumped it from an 0/1 to an 0/2 at Dandan's insistence. Slightly tougher than a Goblin Welder, but not much of anything else, so I think the flavor is still consistent.
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« Last Edit: November 20, 2005, 04:53:33 pm by Jacob Orlove »
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Magic Level 3 Judge Southern USA Regional Coordinator The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule. |
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Norm4eva
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« Reply #1 on: October 05, 2005, 07:04:04 pm » |
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Adding a 'non-White' clause to the ability feels a little better. From a flavor standpoint it doesn't make much sense to be able to kill an Exalted Angel or similar 'holy avenger' style critter.
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dandan
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« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2005, 03:27:17 am » |
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Isn't this a bit like Hand of Justice? Given that, a touch more P/T seems in order, making it 1/2 hardly hurts, does it?
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MrZuccinniHead
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« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2005, 11:53:58 am » |
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I'm pretty sure eph stated that he wanted to give pack abilities to animals. I think humans are off-limits. I learned this when I gave some knights pack abilities.
The name is pretty sweet though.
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« Last Edit: October 07, 2005, 12:37:55 pm by MrZuccinniHead »
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Scopeless on mIRC I'd like to imprint My Cock on that. If she handles it right, it makes white mana. |
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Anusien
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« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2005, 04:01:16 pm » |
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I know pack should only be given to animals, but it applies here:
Firstly, mechanically it's a perfect fit for the flavor.
Secondly it matches what's going on. Normally people don't travel in packs but when mob mentality takes over, Pack or whatever it becomes is clearly the right way to describe flavorfully what is going. I understand Eph's rationale and I wouldn't use pack for an army, but for a mob scene, I would.
I really really really want to keep this creature weak physically to match its flavor, and I would rather drop it to 2W than make it a 1/2. I could see into making it an 0/2, but that's about where it ends up, I think.
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Magic Level 3 Judge Southern USA Regional Coordinator The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule. |
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Ephraim
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« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2005, 12:19:00 am » |
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Anusien is right. I endorse this card as a very good example of how sentient creatures can act like a pack of animals. The only thing I'm concerned about with this card is whether this particular white theme is actually explorable. I agree, this card is perfect for white, but the whole racism/supremacy thing may be too controversial to actually put on a card.
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Did you know that Red is the color or art and music and passion? Combine that with Green, the color of nature, spiritualism, and community and you get a hippie commune of drum circles, dreamcatchers, and recreational drug use. Let's see that win a Pro Tour.
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Liam-K
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« Reply #6 on: October 09, 2005, 01:52:06 am » |
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He needs a "job" creature type. Do they have Thug?
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Norm4eva
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« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2005, 08:18:24 am » |
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If he's truly a rabble rouser, his 'job' type is probably Rebel.
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Ephraim
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« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2005, 09:52:46 am » |
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I think that this creature needs to remain without a job classification. That's one of the distinctions of creatures with the pack mechanic -- they are identified by their species. The rule can be violated, but only if one of the two creature types given isn't particularly common (for example, I made Great Auk a "Penguin Beast.") Rebel is too common for this to get that creature type, especially given the way that rebels work and how easy it would be to get this creature-killing maniac out of your deck. I would concede "Rogue", since there are only 19 creatures with the rogue creature type and the only two white ones are from Unhinged, as are two of the remaining 17 -- so really only 15 rogues -- all of them non-white. Compare that to 31 rebels, 29 of which are white.
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Did you know that Red is the color or art and music and passion? Combine that with Green, the color of nature, spiritualism, and community and you get a hippie commune of drum circles, dreamcatchers, and recreational drug use. Let's see that win a Pro Tour.
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Matt
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« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2005, 11:19:21 am » |
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Don't forget Mistform Ultimus!
[/wanker]
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http://www.goodgamery.com/pmo/c025.GIF---------------------- SpenceForHire2k7: Its unessisary SpenceForHire2k7: only spelled right SpenceForHire2k7: <= world english teach evar ---------------------- noitcelfeRmaeT {Team Hindsight}
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Anusien
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« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2005, 08:01:46 pm » |
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Anusien is right. I endorse this card as a very good example of how sentient creatures can act like a pack of animals. The only thing I'm concerned about with this card is whether this particular white theme is actually explorable. I agree, this card is perfect for white, but the whole racism/supremacy thing may be too controversial to actually put on a card. However flavorful it is, I don't think a card like this would fly: Adolf Hitler - 3WB Creature - Human(?) Nazi Fascist Dictator All Secret Police have +1/+1 and Fear T: Invade target country 1/2 I can see the concern - is there some way we can tweak the flavor if necessary? I think it's a fun card. |
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Magic Level 3 Judge Southern USA Regional Coordinator The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule. |
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Jacob Orlove
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« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2005, 09:06:59 pm » |
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Honestly, I think this is bland enough to be acceptable.
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Anusien
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« Reply #12 on: October 10, 2005, 06:00:47 pm » |
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28 hour clock (rule of 5s and all)
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Magic Level 3 Judge Southern USA Regional Coordinator The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule. |
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dandan
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« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2005, 12:38:56 am » |
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I still think that it would be better with a more substantial body. A 0/1 is a Leper, a Camel or a Bird of Paradise. Try to incite a rabble with one of those! Would it hurt to make it a 1/2 for 4 mana? This would allow it to 'lay down the beats' and also give it a chance of surviving pinging (a good rabblerouser wouldn't put themselves directly in the line of fire).
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Anusien
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« Reply #14 on: October 11, 2005, 08:53:31 am » |
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I still think that it would be better with a more substantial body. A 0/1 is a Leper, a Camel or a Bird of Paradise. Try to incite a rabble with one of those! Would it hurt to make it a 1/2 for 4 mana? This would allow it to 'lay down the beats' and also give it a chance of surviving pinging (a good rabblerouser wouldn't put themselves directly in the line of fire). No, but the point is that he's physically weak and not intimidating without a mob behind him. By the way, an x/1 is also a Royal Assassin. I could see way to bumping it up to an 0/2, but I absolutely think he needs a 0 for power. |
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Magic Level 3 Judge Southern USA Regional Coordinator The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule. |
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dandan
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« Reply #15 on: October 12, 2005, 01:12:32 am » |
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Fair enough, just that this guy is rather at the bottom end of the power level curve.
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Anusien
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« Reply #16 on: October 12, 2005, 01:45:43 am » |
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Can we aggressively cost him then?
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Magic Level 3 Judge Southern USA Regional Coordinator The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule. |
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Ephraim
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« Reply #17 on: October 12, 2005, 06:45:19 am » |
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I don't think it really matters whether you aggressively cost him or not. As it is, he stands to come into play as your third or fourth human, meaning that he comes into play ready to use his ability as soon as he loses summoning sickness. The only benefit you gain from costing him more aggressively is that he won't have summoning sickness when you get your third human. Since his ability is quite impressive, once it becomes active, I don't think it's unreasonable to give an opponent a little bit more time to find removal.
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Did you know that Red is the color or art and music and passion? Combine that with Green, the color of nature, spiritualism, and community and you get a hippie commune of drum circles, dreamcatchers, and recreational drug use. Let's see that win a Pro Tour.
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dandan
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« Reply #18 on: October 13, 2005, 04:48:58 am » |
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As I've mentioned, I'd rather make him more durable than lower the CC. A 0/1 for 4 mana is very small. Even the original rabblerouser, Marton Stromgald was a 1/1.
An extra point of toughness would mean that this guy manages to survive a little bit more. 0/2 is a lot better than 0/1 although I take the point that this guy is weak for reasons of flavour.
Of course you could give him Affinity for humans and make him 2WW.
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Anusien
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« Reply #19 on: November 16, 2005, 12:36:51 pm » |
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24 hour clock. (Ooops, forgot I had cards out)
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Magic Level 3 Judge Southern USA Regional Coordinator The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule. |
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Jacob Orlove
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« Reply #20 on: November 16, 2005, 03:37:37 pm » |
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Current wording should be bold.
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Team Meandeck: O Lord,
Guard my tongue from evil and my lips from speaking guile.
To those who slander me, let me give no heed.
May my soul be humble and forgiving to all.
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Anusien
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« Reply #21 on: November 19, 2005, 04:52:45 pm » |
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It's supposed to be. The board doesn't like me recently.
Fixed. You were missing a tag.
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« Last Edit: November 20, 2005, 04:54:02 pm by Jacob Orlove »
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Magic Level 3 Judge Southern USA Regional Coordinator The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule. |
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Anusien
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« Reply #22 on: August 10, 2006, 09:35:30 am » |
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Adopting an orphan. Wizards printed a Rabblerouser, so this needs a new name.
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Magic Level 3 Judge Southern USA Regional Coordinator The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule. |
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Venven
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« Reply #23 on: August 21, 2006, 07:28:02 pm » |
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This is an awesome card, flavour-wise and mechanically. The two mesh real well, nice overall design.
The first thing that springs to mind is fascism/oppression, but I think an Autocrat would fit better for white. Dogmatist would work too, although it's slightly misleading because it doesn't necessarily mean religious dogma.
The Pack mechanic reminds me of Threshold -> Hidden Angel and friends, and it'd be nice to get some of that flavour-mechanic overlap.
adjective: Zealous, Timid, Diffident, Reluctant, Incitive
noun: Autocrat, Dogmatist, Absolutist, Despot, Oppressor
I'm partial to Reluctant Dogmatist but it's a bit wordy.
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