Question about Phyrexian Negator

[DeMarki]

If I have a Negator in play which is dealt 3 damage, can I:

Sacrifice the Negator as the first permanent that has to be sacrificed and spare the other 2 sacrifices this way? or should I sacrifice 3 permanents regardless if I sacrifice the Negator or not?

[Khahan]

If I have a Negator in play which is dealt 3 damage, can I:

Sacrifice the Negator as the first permanent that has to be sacrificed and spare the other 2 sacrifices this way? or should I sacrifice 3 permanents regardless if I sacrifice the Negator or not?

When phyrexian negator is dealt damage, its ability triggers. A triggered ability exists independent from its source on the stack (meaning destruction of the source does not change it).

So if its dealt 3 damage, a trigger goes on the stack to sac 3 permanents. When it resolves, the game tells you to sac 3 permanents, regardless of the condition of the negator.


#  402.6 - Once activated or triggered, an ability exists independently of its source as an ability on the stack. Destruction or removal of the source after that time won't affect the ability. Note that some abilities cause a source to do something (for example, "Prodigal Sorcerer deals 1 damage to target creature or player") rather than the ability doing anything directly. In these cases, any activated or triggered ability that references information about the source will check that information when the ability resolves, or will use the source's last known information if it's no longer in play. [CompRules 2003/07/01]

[Gort32]

The Revised rulebook had an excellent explanation for this rule:  if a guy tosses a grenade at you it does no good to shoot the guy

[Guardian]

OK. Let's say the following happens.

Player A has Negator in play.
Player B plays Lightning Bolt on Negator.
Player A Stifles the trigger.

The question is, does I have to sacrifice two permanents or none?

[49 Cents]

Edit: Nevermind, I was wrong.

[Limbo]

Yes. It isn't only one trigger, because it triggers for each point of damage. So Bolting it creates 3 triggers.

Whenever Phyrexian Negator is dealt damage, sacrifice a permanent for each 1 damage dealt to it.

Lightning bolt deals 3 damage in one blow. This creates a trigger, as damage is dealt. The trigger looks to the amount of damage dealt. This is three. When the trigger resolves : 3 permanents to the yard...

[Guardian]

So Stifling the trigger from the Bolt will allow me to keep my 3 permanents.

This is like Bargain, where you say:
I pay 3 life, I draw three cards.
VS
I pay 1 life, draw one card. Repeat three times.

Am I right?

[Jacob Orlove]

You can Stifle the trigger from Bolt, but you can't draw more than one card with any Bargain activation. Saying "Draw three" is just shorthand for "activate Bargain 3 times".

[Guardian]

You can Stifle the trigger from Bolt, but you can't draw more than one card with any Bargain activation. Saying "Draw three" is just shorthand for "activate Bargain 3 times".

I mentioned the Bargain thing because I know, back when Rector Trix was good, that activating one draw at a time was a better thing to do because if you activate all draws at once, your opponent could respond to the whole "I pay 15 life" with a spell that deals 5 damage. But in that condition, would Stifle cancel the whole thing and you draw nothing.?

On the other hand, if you activated it one card (one life) at a time, your opponent would have to respond to each activation.

Maybe I was not clear, but that's what I meant.

[Matt]

Drawing one card at a time with Bargain is also better in case you draw LED.

And no, Stifling a Bargain activation will only ever stop one card. Because as Jacob said, "draw 15" is shorthand for "activate Bargain 15 times."

[cosineme]

you guys should talk about the interaction when negator is hit for 5. now that is fun...

i believe it is

big l bolt to negator for 5
negator's trigger for 5 on the stack
check state based effects, negator is dead

sac 5 permanents.

[ELD]

My personal farvorate is with welder/triskelion in play.  Remove counter to do a point to negator.  Put the sacrifice trigger on the stack.  Do a point to the triskelion.  Ping the Negator again.  Put the trigger on the stack.  Weld back in Triskelion.  Ping him 3 more times, letting each resolve but not letting the sacrifice resolve.  After the 5th negator dies as a statebased effect.  Then they can sac 5 permanants.