[Single Card Discussion] Ghost Quarter

[Chill79]

From Dissension FAQ:

Ghost Quarter
Land
: Add to your mana pool.
, Sacrifice Ghost Quarter: Destroy target land. Its controller may search his or her library for a basic land card, put it into play, then shuffle his or her library.

So this is the next "wasteland/strip mine" variant that had to come becouse wasteland got axe from extended,but will it see play at T1??

[Burntgerbil]

Ghost Quarter
Land
: Add to your mana pool.
, Sacrifice Ghost Quarter: Destroy target land. Its controller may search his or her library for a basic land card, put it into play, then shuffle his or her library.

source : judge FAQ

This looks like, if it goes unrestricted, would shake things up a LOT. I am unsure if the "search for a basic" clause will keep it out of the restricted bin or not.

All I know at the time is they will probably be played in most formats for a long time, like ports were. Now we have all the other standard and extended players to compete with for foil chinese ones.

[Liam-K]

What's this supposed to be good at?  It can give someone colour problems once in a very long while, but really it's terrible.

[Burntgerbil]

I would at first thought, say that it would tighten up proliferation of bazaars and workshops at least. 

[Eddie]

I don't think it's terrible. You can destroy basics with it. How many basics do decks play anyway? 3? 4? You won't be able to keep searching for them. But it's probably only good with crucible.

[Law]

My thinking is yes it will see play in type 1. Against a few decks it is just as good as strip mine. Plus it could act as a fetch if need be.

In short yes, but it will take a little time before it finds a home.

[Juggernaut GO]

I would play that card over wasteland in stax.  Like what was said, most drain decks top out at 4 basics.  Wasteland has become increasingly useless, at least around here.  Against any 5c deck it acts the same as strip mine, so instead of having 4 dead wastelands in your deck vs drains, you have 4 more ways to kill basics. 

Of course crucible increases the effectiveness of the card, but at the same time running this over wasteland lowers the pressure on the stax player to find strip mine ASAP.

[Tin_Mox5831]

My question is whether the shuffle clause is only if they choose to search, or any time you Strip a land with it? Screwing over a Vampiric, Seal, or Mystical plus stripping a land would be uber-hot.

Later,
Dave

[Juggernaut GO]

it says they may search, so they can choose not to, but they will be short a land.

[Roxas]

Ghost Quarter
Land
: Add to your mana pool.
, Sacrifice Ghost Quarter: Destroy target land. Its controller may search his or her library for a basic land card, put it into play, then shuffle his or her library.

Note the bold.

Anyway, I think that this card is certainly worth testing, if nothing more.  However, there are two things that must be kept in mind.  First off, using this on a tapped land basically gives the Drain player another mana to use during your turn; this can be crucial considering the efficiency and potential impact of a Drain player's spells.  Also, using this doesn't actually reduce the quantity of mana available to the opponent until he/she is out of basic land; this does not cut the player off from key spells like Rack and Ruin or Tinker the same way that Wasteland and Strip Mine can. 

[zeus-online]

Against decks where it would be a strip mine, wouldnt wasteland be equally effective?
I assume that by "decks where it would be a strip mine"...you mean decks without basics?..

I think its faster/easier to fetch a strip mine with crop rotation, tutors etc. then it is to try to strip every basic lands in their deck (usually 4 or something, thats ALOT of turns) before you actually start lowering the amount of mana they have available...not to mention that you actually INCREASE their current mana by using this.

Say you choose to strip an untapped land, they tap it in response, find a new one untapped one....and suddenly they are up 1 mana...essentially a free lotus petal. And if you hit a tapped land, you've just "Twiddle'd" their land....

I might be underestimating the card, but i certainly dont think it would replace wasteland.

/Zeus

[petergrifindor]

         Hello members of The Mana-Drain Community. My name is David and I´m from Spain (please be understanding with the errors in my English). I love this site and I´ll love to share my opinions with all the good  vintage players that read this forums. Well after the introductions here I go:

         I think the principal problem with this card is the tempo disadvantage it produces. It can be very strong against decks without basic lands, but due the fetchlands the majority runs some basic ones to stabilize the mana base. Maybe Ghost Quarter could help decks like Stax to establish a lock with cards like Crucible Of Worlds but against decks like Gifts (5-6 islands) you cannot afford to lose a land drop without gaining some tempo advantage (if you are recourring it you lose more than one), because you´ll probably be death by turn four, just before they run out of basics.

          I think this card is a risky bet to be include in the meandeck. Maybe it can take some sideboards slots, but it will be a dead card against a lot of decks, so I don´t think this one is going to make a huge impact in Vintage.

Sorry for my English.

Long live NECRODECK!!!!!

[Liam-K]

This is like wasting a fetch for MINIMUM 2 turns, AND requires crucible out to not just suck.  It's seriously unplayable.  Can you afford to spend 2 turns letting them fetch out basics, then another 2 turns destroying those basics, and STILL have them at the same number of lands if they made 2 land drops in 4 turns?  4 turns is enough turns to lose the game in.

[Harlequin]

Unless your opponent can shuffled lands from yard into library, they will eventually run out of basic lands to find.  If the "Destroy target land" is correct then it could easily be used to exahused your opponent of basics.  Going Basic for Basic (obviously with crucible of worlds) for 4 or 5 turns.   Once they are out of basics ... you've got a stripmine.

Not bad with Dark Steel Citadel iether =P

[Harlequin]

Dark Steel Citadel makes this card interesting. 

Its a weak fetchland + a weak stripmine + a weak wasteland.  Do those x3 weak parts add up to a playable card?


Incidentally there is a mirror thread of this in the "improvement forum" ... a mod should merge them or lock one or something =/

[tooMuchCoffeeMan]

Can't you have this target itself and fetch a basic land from your own library?

[Gabethebabe]

Can't you have this target itself and fetch a basic land from your own library?

No you can´t. When the ability tries to resolve, the target has gone and the ability will be countered on resolution. The rest of the effect will not occur.

[49 Cents]

It's from the Judge FAQ, so I doubt that they'll change the wording..

[Gabethebabe]

You´re too quick, I just edited my post of before.

[Harlequin]

Yeah, when I read this card for the first time ... I thought you could double up your fetchlands.  But you clearly cannot.  If all targets (in this case there is only one target) are off the board when the ability attempts to resolve then the entire ability Fizzles. 

It can however be used to sacrifice itself, but you just don't get to search for a basic...
two things to remeber:
COST : EFFECT
and
#1 - Declare abiltiy - #2 - Declare TARGETS - #3 - Pay Costs.
So you annouce "I am going to use the 2nd ability on Ghost Quarter"
then you announce "I am chooseing to Target Ghost Quarter"
Then you pay the costs 'Tap' 'Sacrifice.'
Then the effect goes on the stack.

When the effect attempts to resolve it has no legal target and is "Countered Upon Resolution." Therefore the end result is "I Sac Ghost Quarter because I want to...but i get no land search"  Wasteland and stripmine may be used in the same way.


On the other side of the coin:  there is no "If the land is put into the graveyard in this way" or "If Successful" So you can totaly target Dark Steal Citadel, and still search for a land.  Because the "Indestructable" land can still be targeted.  Use the reasoning as to why Artifact Mutation can be functionally used on DSC.

[PipOC]

Just to remind you all, the new land comes into play untapped.  Wasteland is infinitely better because it can shut down drain mana.

[Jank Golem]

It is a decent card at the very least it destroys broken nonbasics (bazaar workshop) and forces the player to find a subpar land like mountain. It has some advantages over wasteland seeing as it has the ability to fetch out colored mana sources and shuffle your library, giving it synergy with brainstorm. It seems like there would be potential for Land Destruction.dec in vintage. In conjunction with choke or something else that shuts down basics I think it has potential.

[TimeWizzle]

If the only real argument against this card is that the new basic land will come into play untapped, then play root maze/orb of dreams with it.  This card looks really good to me.  I don't know that it can completely replace wastelands, but i think it definitely merits testing.  This also makes crucible + fastbond + strip only require one restricted card instead of 2.   

[pyr0ma5ta]

Seems terrible for Stax/prison.  The lands in Stax are all already extremely good, and the Red mana is tight.  There's no reason to cut anything to add this bad Strip Mine.  It might see play elsewhere, but I can't imagine where.  My first impression is that this card is just bad and will not see play in T1. 

[nataz]

this does not cut the player off from key spells like Rack and Ruin or Tinker the same way that Wasteland and Strip Mine can.

well, it kinda can. You can cut off non-blue colors simply because most decks dont run basic mountains or swamps.
Nail their underground, and they have to fetch an island. Ditto on volc, which would cut off the rack and ruin.

problem is of course, all the mass artifact bounce and tinker is blue. 

[Harlequin]

It could also be fairly decent with Shadow of Doubt ... oh wait this is vintage!   #

Just Play [card]Myr Landshaper[/card] + Mox Monkey

Its way more tech.

[M.Solymossy]

All i know, is this is HILARIOUS versus 5color stax and GrimLong.

[Moxlotus]

this does not cut the player off from key spells like Rack and Ruin or Tinker the same way that Wasteland and Strip Mine can.

well, it kinda can. You can cut off non-blue colors simply because most decks dont run basic mountains or swamps.
Nail their underground, and they have to fetch an island. Ditto on volc, which would cut off the rack and ruin.

problem is of course, all the mass artifact bounce and tinker is blue. 

But in that situation Wasteland is still better since they actually end up with less land on the table, in addition to being cut off.

[Pitlord]

If you are recurring this instead of wasteland in stax, you are probably not going to win. You need to take about 4 turns before this becomes really solid, and THEN it acts as a strip mine. If you aren't dead by then, especially considering that you have been giving your opponent free fetchlands and lotus petals.

Against decks like grimlong and 5c stax, wasteland is already a strip mine as it can hit their entire base.

I think that how slow it is to actually thin their deck out of basics is not worth losing the wasetlands, which are occasionly dead. If 5c stax decks were to incorporate fastbond more than they do, then this might be worth playing. But is it worth losing a slot to fastbond, which can often be just as dead as wasteland, just to support this card? I think fastbond is worth playing in 5c anyways, so testing will show how powerful this is with fastbond.

[cssamerican]

Let us look at the facts.
Wasteland can not remove a basic land from play, this can. The only downfall is they could generate an extra mana for some kind of instant, but that instant can't be Mana Drain because you won't hit their land and cast a spell in the same phase if your play properly. So it has the upside of hitting a basic with the downside of opening a small window for your opponent to cast a non-reactive instant that cost more than they had.

This will be almost just as good as Wasteland when it comes to cutting your opponent off from their secondary colors. However, it will not damage their ability to generate a certain amount of mana until much later in the game. That is unless they play with no basics.

With Fastbond this becomes a very dangerous card. You can wipe out their entire mana base, one land each phase as to prevent them from generating an obscene amount of mana for some crazy last ditch instant.

The card is definitely worth testing extensively. Even if it doesn't replace Wasteland it could be used in a Mono-Brown or one-color build of Stax in addition to wasteland.