3CB #80 Results and Discussion (Special format!)

[combo_dude]

I'd like to congratulate Scrappy Kid as the winner of 3CB Tournament #80!
A great turnout this time around, with a great mix of decks; Rakdos proved to be very powerful, along with some old favourites, but the closest replacement for Lotus-Scavenger-Misguided Rage took it home! Well done!

EDIT:

I'd like to congratulate combo_dude and BweeBwee as the winners of 3CB #80!

I'd like to deride myself for being an idiot and submitting Oblation instead of something can target lands, costing me 10 points!

Results:

      1   2   3   4   5   6   7   8   9   0   1   2   3   4   5   6   7 Total Position
1|   X   6   6   0   6   6   2   6   0   0   6   2   0   6   6   6   0   58   (1)
2|   0   X   6   6   0   6   6   4   6   0   2   6   0   0   2   6   6   56   (3)
3|   0   0   X   6   0   6   4   6   3   3   0   3   3   2   2   3   3   44   (10)
4|   6   0   0   X   6   0   2   6   6   0   6   2   0   0   6   6   0   46   (8)
5|   0   6   6   0   X   6   6   6   0   6   0   2   6   2   6   0   6   58   (1)
6|   0   0   0   6   0   X   6   1   4   3   0   3   3   6   6   3   3   44   (10)
7|   2   0   1   2   0   0   X   0   6   6   0   3   6   2   2   6   4   40   (13)
8|   0   1   0   0   0   4   6   X   4   3   3   3   3   6   6   3   3   45   (9)
9|   6   0   3   0   6   1   0   1   X   6   0   6   6   0   6   6   0   47   (7)
0|   6   6   3   6   0   3   0   3   0   X   6   6   2   6   2   6   1   56   (3)
1|   0   2   6   0   6   6   6   3   6   0   X   0   0   2   6   0   0   43   (12)
2|   2   0   3   2   2   3   3   3   0   0   6   X   0   2   2   0   0   28   (16)
3|   6   6   3   6   0   3   0   3   0   2   6   6   X   6   2   6   1   56   (3)
4|   0   6   2   6   2   0   2   0   6   0   2   2   0   X   6   0   2   36   (15)
5|   0   2   2   0   0   0   2   0   0   2   0   2   2   0   X   0   2   14   (17)
6|   0   0   3   0   6   3   0   3   0   0   6   6   0   6   6   X   0   39   (14)
7|   6   0   3   6   0   3   1   3   6   4   6   6   4   2   2   6   X   56   (3)

I had a go at reworking the results, based on all the above comments. Hopefully it's correct, there were a lot of changes...

...and therefore I'd like to hit myself for being useless at getting online and actually changing the f**king things myself - thanks Scrappy Kid!


Banned list:
Portal (in ALL its forms)
Unglued AND UNHINGED
[card]Form of the Dragon[/card]
[card]Mesmeric Fiend[/card]
[card]Nezumi Shortfang[/card]
[card]Blackmail[/card]
[card]Ghost Quarter[/card]
[card]Cabal Therapy[/card]
[card]Abandon Hope[/card]
[card]Nullstone Gargoyle[/card]
[card]Coercion[/card]
[card]Strip Mine[/card]
[card]Wasteland[/card]
[card]The Rack[/card]
[card]Balance[/card]
[card]Meddling Mage[/card]
[card]Pulse of the Dross[/card]
[card]Leonin Squire[/card]
[card]Show and Tell[/card]
[card]Misguided Rage[/card]
[card]Abandon Hope[/card]
[card]Glacial Chasm[/card]
All decks that can force mass-discard
All decks that can goldfish on turn 1

Decks:

1.   combo_dude    -    The Brick    -    Hickory Woodlot,   Tempting Wurm,   Tempting Wurm
2.   Kaesh    -    Ius suum cuique blah blah blah     -    Mishra's Workshop,   Steel Golem,   Culling Scales
3.   Cross    -    Fallen Empires was sweet    -    Scrubland,   Icatian Javelineers,   Duress
4.   Franz Ferdinand    -    The Mighty Pen    -    Sand Silos,   Darksteel Reactor,   Energy Field
5.   BweeBwee    -    (no name)    -    Hollow Trees,   Crush of Wurms,   Maze of Ith
6.   Godder    -    Down in the Swamp    -    Bayou,   Thallid,   Duress
7.   Parallax    -    Damned if you do...    -    Black Lotus,   Glowrider,   Rishadan Cutpurse
8.   ReAnimator*    -    Not Bodyrock    -    Tropical Island,   Thallid,   Daze
9.   Naphtali    -    Bridge-Tongs    -    Mishra's Workshop,   Scalding Tongs,   Ensnaring Bridge
10.   Scrappy Kid    -    NOT a Balrog, honest!    -    Black Lotus,   Rakdos, The Defiler,   Black Lotus
11.   wonkey_donkey    -    (no name)    -    Pendelhaven,   Thallid,   Elvish Scrapper
12.   combo_dude    -    (no name)    -    Lion's Eye Diamond,   Roar of the Wurm,   Dust Bowl
13.   Kaesh    -    *whack*    -    Black Lotus,   Rakdos, The Defiler,   Black Lotus
14.   Franz Ferdinand    -    No More Lotus!    -    Orzhov Basilica,   Mishra's Factory,   Vindicate
15.   BweeBwee    -    (no name)    -    Mercadian Bazaar,   (Basic Land)**,   Maze of Ith
16.   Godder    -    Look what I found!    -    Black Lotus,   Anurid Scavenger,   Orochi Eggwatcher
17.   Scrappy Kid    -    Endless offerings    -    Black Lotus,   Anurid Scavenger,   Oblation

*ReAnimator entered a second deck, but it used a banned card (Leonin Squire); since it could not consequently affect any results, I left it out of the tournament.
**BweeBwee submitted Form of the Dragon, which is banned. Since the Maze could still influence decks, I left this deck in the tournament.

Apologies to both of you - as it's still an unusual banned list, I should have let you know your decks were illegal - I didn't notice this until I got around to doing the results, by which stage it was a little too late. I'll be more organised in future!

Results:

      1   2   3   4   5   6   7   8   9   0   1   2   3   4   5   6   7 Total Position
1|   X   6   6   0   6   6   6   6   0   0   6   2   0   6   6   6   0   62   (2)
2|   0   X   6   6   0   6   2   4   6   0   2   6   0   0   2   6   6   52   (6)
3|   0   0   X   3   0   6   4   6   4   3   0   3   3   2   2   3   3   42   (12)
4|   6   0   3   X   6   0   2   6   6   0   6   2   0   0   6   6   0   49   (7)
5|   0   6   6   0   X   6   6   6   0   6   0   2   6   2   6   0   2   54   (5)
6|   0   0   0   6   0   X   6   1   3   3   0   3   3   6   6   3   3   43   (10)
7|   0   2   1   2   0   0   X   0   6   6   0   3   6   2   2   6   6   42   (12)
8|   0   1   0   0   0   4   6   X   4   3   3   3   3   6   6   3   3   45   (9)
9|   6   0   1   0   6   3   0   1   X   6   0   6   6   0   6   6   0   47   (8)
0|   6   6   3   6   0   3   0   3   0   X   6   6   2   6   2   6   1   56   (3)
1|   0   2   6   0   6   6   6   3   6   0   X   0   0   2   6   0   0   43   (10)
2|   2   0   3   2   2   3   3   3   0   0   6   X   0   2   2   0   0   28   (16)
3|   6   6   3   6   0   3   0   3   0   2   6   6   X   6   2   6   1   56   (3)
4|   0   6   2   6   2   0   2   0   6   0   2   2   0   X   6   0   0   34   (15)
5|   0   2   2   0   0   0   2   0   0   2   0   2   2   0   X   0   0   12   (17)
6|   0   0   3   0   6   3   0   3   0   0   6   6   0   6   6   X   0   39   (14)
7|   6   0   3   6   2   3   0   3   6   4   6   6   4   6   6   6   X   67   (1)
SEE ABOVE

Thanks for the great response to a deck request - this is the biggest tournament for some time, which is great news! The Rakdos deck is definitely dangerous - I've seen it before using Visara, but I think that the ability of the Defiler to hit permanents makes Visara largely redundant in a balls-to-the-wall deck like this. It also renders the Leveler deck largely redundant, as it takes a turn off the kill speed, but doesn't fold to artifact destruction, as well as having removal to race others. My second effort was a bit feeble, to be honest; it'd work a lot better in a non-Lotus format, not because of the deck's inability to hit Lotus, but just because there isn't the emphasis on having a first turn play! The winning deck is probably a safe one to leave around, though it'll need close watching as the ability to repeatedly remove any permanents always needs close attention. Thanks for the great turnout, let's have another one like it!

Any corrections/discussion, please post. Sorry for the delay in results, service as normal next week.

Thanks,
Adam

[Scrappy Kid]

I'm not sure I did win with the Oblation tech - I think you forgot it can't target lands in some matchups.

5.   BweeBwee    -    (no name)    -    Hollow Trees,   Crush of Wurms,   Maze of Ith

Maze of Ith holds me off while BweeBwee saves up 21 mana to cast and flashback Crush of Wurms in the same turn. I have no answer to six 6/6 tokens. Result: lose 6-0

14.   Franz Ferdinand    -    No More Lotus!    -    Orzhov Basilica,   Mishra's Factory,   Vindicate

I have no way of preventing my Anurid Scavenger from being Vindicated. Result: lose 6-0[/s]
Edit: saved by protection from Black - I totally forgot about that

15.   BweeBwee    -    (no name)    -    Mercadian Bazaar,   (Basic Land)**,   Maze of Ith

Maze of Ith again. Result 2-2.

7.   Parallax    -    Damned if you do...    -    Black Lotus,   Glowrider,   Rishadan Cutpurse

I can get a draw out of this matchup when I play as follows: play the Lotus and then pass the turn. If Parallax were to cast the Glowrider I just trump it with my Scavenger, so that's out, and if he plays the Cutpurse I respond by sac'ing the Lotus for mana and then cast Oblation on the Cutpurse. Result: lose 4-1.

I wasn't convinced the Oblation tech was worthwile (if the tournement had run for another day I probably would have changed the deck), so I'm pretty happy with the high finish, even if I didn't win. Would have been nice if the Rakdos decks had taken the win though.

[Illissius]

14.   Franz Ferdinand    -    No More Lotus!    -    Orzhov Basilica,   Mishra's Factory,   Vindicate

I have no way of preventing my Anurid Scavenger from being Vindicated. Result: lose 6-0

It has protection from black.

[combo_dude]

OK, I'll recalculate that and let people know tomorrow what results change. Sorry for forgetting that.

As an aside, the real reason that the 14 vs. 17 match is actually 6-0 to the Vindicate deck is that in order to keep Scavenger alive, you need to keep playing spells. If you can't cast Oblation on anything, you need to burn for 3 with the Lotus to keep Scavenger alive - with the Factory beating down, 17 dies long before 14.

Adam

[Kaesh]

2.   Kaesh    -    Ius suum cuique blah blah blah     -    Mishra's Workshop,   Steel Golem,   Culling Scales
vs
7.   Parallax    -    Damned if you do...    -    Black Lotus,   Glowrider,   Rishadan Cutpurse

Is 2-2, should be 6-0. He can only cast one of his guys, has no way to stop my golem, and it's just bigger.

[Naphtali]

9. Naphtali    -    Bridge-Tongs    -    Mishra's Workshop,   Scalding Tongs,   Ensnaring Bridge
vs
3. Cross    -    Fallen Empires was sweet    -    Scrubland,   Icatian Javelineers,   Duress

Current: 1-4
Suggested: 3-3

On the play, I drop the Tongs, (he duresses the Bridge) But the Tongs still race the Javelineers
On the draw, he takes the Bridge with the Duress and the Javelineers race the Tongs.


9. Naphtali    -    Bridge-Tongs    -    Mishra's Workshop,   Scalding Tongs,   Ensnaring Bridge
vs
6.   Godder    -    Down in the Swamp    -    Bayou,   Thallid,   Duress

Current: 3-3
Suggested: 1-4

On the play: I can't beat the Thallid with Tongs alone, so I drop the Bridge. Duress takes the Tongs and we draw.
On the draw: He duresses the Bridge and the Thallid + Saprolings beat me.

[Cross]

On my pairing with deck 4, shouldn't duress beat darksteel reactor every time as I just take the energy field and javelineers races reactor in both games?

[Scrappy Kid]

OK, I'll recalculate that and let people know tomorrow what results change. Sorry for forgetting that.

As an aside, the real reason that the 14 vs. 17 match is actually 6-0 to the Vindicate deck is that in order to keep Scavenger alive, you need to keep playing spells. If you can't cast Oblation on anything, you need to burn for 3 with the Lotus to keep Scavenger alive - with the Factory beating down, 17 dies long before 14.

Adam

Ah, in that case I can repeatedly cast Oblation on the Black Lotus (announce Oblation targetting the Black Lotus, then sac the Lotus for mana afterwards). So in that case we tie 2-2.

[Scrappy Kid]

I'm not sure I did win with the Oblation tech - I think you forgot it can't target lands in some matchups.

Of course this just means if I had been sensible and just submitted a Boomerang instead of Oblation I would have won

[Illissius]

How did 1. beat 7.?
Woodlot comes into play tapped, and dies to Cutpurse.

[Jacob Orlove]

If you can't cast Oblation on anything, you need to burn for 3 with the Lotus to keep Scavenger alive - with the Factory beating down, 17 dies long before 14.

Can't you announce Oblation targeting Lotus, and then sac Lotus to pay for the Oblation?

Edit: whoops, Scrappy already posted this. Here's the key rules (abridged):

409. Playing Spells and Activated Abilities

409.1. Playing a spell or activated ability follows the steps listed below, in order. If, at any point during the playing of a spell or ability, a player is unable to comply with any of the steps listed below, the spell was played illegally; the game returns to the moment before that spell or ability was played (see rule 422, "Handling Illegal Actions"). Announcements and payments can't be altered after they've been made.

409.1a The player announces that he or she is playing the spell or activated ability.

409.1c If the spell or ability requires any targets, the player first announces how many targets he or she will choose (if the spell or ability has a variable number of targets), then announces the targets themselves.

409.1f The player determines the total cost of the spell or ability.

409.1g If the total cost includes a mana payment, the player then has a chance to play mana abilities (see rule 411, "Playing Mana Abilities"). Mana abilities must be played before costs are paid.

409.1h The player pays the total cost in any order. Partial payments are not allowed.

409.1i Once the steps described in 409.1a-409.1h are completed, the spell or ability becomes played.

[Scrappy Kid]

How did 1. beat 7.?
Woodlot comes into play tapped, and dies to Cutpurse.

It's a draw then. There's no point the Wurm deck dropping the Woodlot, and as soon as the Lotus deck blows the Lotus to cast something, then the Wurm deck can drop the Woodlot and two 5/5s beat a 2/1 and a 1/1. So nobody does anything.

[Scrappy Kid]

I'd like to congratulate combo_dude and BweeBwee as the winners of 3CB #80!

I'd like to deride myself for being an idiot and submitting Oblation instead of something can target lands, costing me 10 points!

Results:

      1   2   3   4   5   6   7   8   9   0   1   2   3   4   5   6   7 Total Position
1|   X   6   6   0   6   6   2   6   0   0   6   2   0   6   6   6   0   58   (1)
2|   0   X   6   6   0   6   6   4   6   0   2   6   0   0   2   6   6   56   (3)
3|   0   0   X   6   0   6   4   6   3   3   0   3   3   2   2   3   3   44   (10)
4|   6   0   0   X   6   0   2   6   6   0   6   2   0   0   6   6   0   46   (8)
5|   0   6   6   0   X   6   6   6   0   6   0   2   6   2   6   0   6   58   (1)
6|   0   0   0   6   0   X   6   1   4   3   0   3   3   6   6   3   3   44   (10)
7|   2   0   1   2   0   0   X   0   6   6   0   3   6   2   2   6   4   40   (13)
8|   0   1   0   0   0   4   6   X   4   3   3   3   3   6   6   3   3   45   (9)
9|   6   0   3   0   6   1   0   1   X   6   0   6   6   0   6   6   0   47   (7)
0|   6   6   3   6   0   3   0   3   0   X   6   6   2   6   2   6   1   56   (3)
1|   0   2   6   0   6   6   6   3   6   0   X   0   0   2   6   0   0   43   (12)
2|   2   0   3   2   2   3   3   3   0   0   6   X   0   2   2   0   0   28   (16)
3|   6   6   3   6   0   3   0   3   0   2   6   6   X   6   2   6   1   56   (3)
4|   0   6   2   6   2   0   2   0   6   0   2   2   0   X   6   0   2   36   (15)
5|   0   2   2   0   0   0   2   0   0   2   0   2   2   0   X   0   2   14   (17)
6|   0   0   3   0   6   3   0   3   0   0   6   6   0   6   6   X   0   39   (14)
7|   6   0   3   6   0   3   1   3   6   4   6   6   4   2   2   6   X   56   (3)

I had a go at reworking the results, based on all the above comments. Hopefully it's correct, there were a lot of changes...