Restaurant Menu Survey for my business plan

[Lunar]

Doug...lettuce wedge and classy do not belong in the same sentance...regardless of seeing something in a magazine...that dressing you mention can easily be applied to many other less hokey salads.

I am not a wine snob on any real major level I suppose...but I try to drink and know about good wines (I cant afford to be a real wine snob) But when it comes down to spending $30+ on a crappy bottle vs spending $30 on a bottle that was tasted and researched id obviously spend on the second, although id be willing to run to that winery and try the wines out as its not far from me. However, depending on where you are wine snobbery might actually be at an all time high, certainly there are more sommoliers floating around now and the average wine consumer is at a point where they demand  knowledgable staff and a decent wine list (this is overall and not aimed at this family joint) Its all a matter of where you are...and things might certainly be different out of wine country here in northern california and New York (with other large cities probably filling in as well...certainly Vegas needs to have a full range of wine and a handful of wine snobs making those lists) I base my wine snobbery more on enjoying quality wines that taste good...this unfortunatly generally falls within more expensive labels...certainly there are cheaper more bulk processed wines that taste good, but these are more of an exception than a rule. Still, a family restaurant should be running something below the $30 retail value on a bottle of cab, $10-12 a glass cab wont sell well with a $10 meatloaf. But yeah, wine snob has different levels like anything...but believe me if I could afford only drinking something like Phelps Insignia that is all that I would drink, it really is just that much better than everything else. I am just a guy that will spend $10 more a bottle for a 12 year old vintage port when up against a 10 year tawny port (unless I know for sure that the tawny happens to be really excellent)

I think there's a lot of growth to be had in checking out local microbrews and pairing them with foods. I could see rich carmel dark lager with the steak or a fun pilsner or weissbier with the salmon, for example. If it's a family establishment, you might have more people buying beer than wine because there's less snobbery and perceived embarassment in ordering the wrong wine. Running the markups, you possibly might make more money off beer too.

I agree with this as well..but I have a feeling he cant expand on the drink list at this "restaurant" due to classroom limitations. You will have more people buying beer at this sort of restaurant for sure though (from my experience) and the wines need to be more easily affordable.

Napa Valey is such a broad appelation with so many terroirs that is it damn near impossible to judge the wine with 100% accuracy without tasting it. The "Napa" on the label is just less impressive than say "Los Carneros" or "Rutherford."

They are getting tougher and tougher on these things as well.."Napa" wines should get better and better as a lot of the fringe is getting eliminated from being allowed to use the appelation names improperly. Rutherford used to be amazing for cab, and was even famed for the Rutherford "Dust" that the terroir imparted in its wines, the last few years have been rough though as some of the vitners there havnt done quite as nice a job with some exceptions as well..Stags Leap as well has had ups and downs, the most famous Napa wine ever came from here, but some pretty bad stuff has come out of the appelation as well.

True enough. Of course if I were aiming for Michelin stars I wouldn't be opening a restaurant like this.

Oh this I know...I was making the statment to people claiming that lettuce wedges are acceptable in fine dining establishments. These restaurants you go to because you know some time and care is being put into your food...lettuce wedge does not convey time and care, it represents cheap and quick, even though it might be filling and affordable and even with a decent dressing.

[jcb193]

Lunar-- as my winetasting professor once said, "60% of wine buyers are women but 90% of wine snobs are men" : ) I don't know that snobbery is such a good thing in the wine world any more...

I think Two Buck Chuck made this point well.

That said, I think the menu is on the right course for its demographic.  Fine dining and casual dining are about as different as fast food.  I agree that brews might be a better way to go, as people who will enjoy this menu will probably not be opting for the wine.  I'd throw in a White Zin or Grigot for the ladies and beer for the lads.  Just think of your local Ninety-Nice restaurant.  They do very well in the New England, not so much in the Mid-Atlantic. 

[CrashTest]

Cool thread.

      The CBC Chicken sounds great. I personally do not like Fish or Alcohol - so I'd be skipping those. For the drinks, it is nice to have something like Iced Tea, and of course Soda - healthy or not, it's very popular and goes well with any type of food.

      heh, the deserts are all nice - the Oreo one may be a bit too sweet - but the other 2 are especially nice.

[dandan]

Scallops wrapped in Bacon(Scallops wrapped in bacon are deep fried and served with a honey mustard dipping sauce over a bed of organic mesclun greens.)

Broiled Crab Stuffed Cod(Fresh breaded cod is stuffed with jumbo lump crab and broiled. Served with wild rice pilaf.)

Brownie Sundae(Warm Brownie with a scoop of vanilla ice cream, hot fudge, whipped cream and a maraschino cherry)

2005 Omaka Springs Sauvignon Blanc New Zealand

Sounds good to me.

[Matt]

My go:

-Scallops wrapped in Bacon
Scallops are good and everything is better wrapped in bacon.

-Broiled Crab Stuffed Cod
Just sounded plain better than the others. Stuffing food inside of other food is always delicious.

-tossup between Strawberry Cheesecake and Oreo Dirt Cake
If the ODC has enough oreos to escape its custardy origins, then it wins. Otherwise, Strawberry.

-Long Trail Ale
Microbrews are usually good times.


Important note: you definitely get points deducted for not offering walnuts on the Brownie thing.

Also: I would have liked to see a dessert wine or something mildly alcoholic in the dessert section. That would go very well with the "casual" atmosphere I'm envisioning (a place where you are encouraged to stay and idly chat with friends, take your time to enjoy your dining experience (as opposed to a simple meal), not rushed) but it might conflict with the "family friendly" (code for "small children") thing.

Also: please for the love of god do not put a bunch of crap up on the walls to make it look "kitschy" or "weird". It only makes you look like a "tool" and a "lame" copy of "TGI Fridays".

[Hi-Val]

Doug...lettuce wedge and classy do not belong in the same sentance...regardless of seeing something in a magazine...that dressing you mention can easily be applied to many other less hokey salads.

Like who are you to say that your idea of what classy cuisine is on the Left Coast applies to the Right Coast though? The whole thing is subjective. Because it doesn't have edamame and daikon slivers doesn't mean it isn't a fucking tasty salad. And as far as seeing it in a magazine counting for something, it was in Fine Cooking, not Better Homes and Gardens, and I think Fine Cooking beats the tar out of Food and Wine.

Just sayin'

[orgcandman]

I've also been cooking for quite some time so I've got a few notes and then my menu selection:

Scallops wrapped in Bacon(Scallops wrapped in bacon are deep fried and served with a honey mustard dipping sauce over a bed of organic mesclun greens.)

Any reason for deep frying? Usually searing up the scallops, and then broiling or baking them with the bacon wrapped does a good job of giving a thorough flavor saturation without causing you to lose some of the sweetness of the scallop to the fryalator.

Grilled CBC(Twin grilled chicken breasts are coated with bacon and melted cheddar. Served with broccoli and mashed potatoes)

My question is, will this have rosemary or sage flavoring added? Even as a small garnish, it can make this dish really pop. Also, would the mashed be better served as gratin, instead? It keeps that creamy feel to the meal, and is a c-c-c-combo with the broccoli and melted cheddar. I also might add some muenster, although thats a Finnish cheese, so if you're going for strictly NE, you can stick with cheddar.

Tri Tip Steak(Tri tip steak is grilled to your liking, sliced thin, and served with green beans and roasted fingerling potatoes.)

Sadly, I don't think this is true. Most restuarants are required to have the internal temperature reach a certain point, which usually causes most of the juice in a steak to steam out or exit the meat in some other fashion. If you truly can guarantee a good sear, while keeping the inside pink-red, more power to ya.

Sweet and Sour Salmon(A Homestead Specialty. Salmon is seared and served over a sweet citrus risotto, Citrus beurre blanc, and wilted kale.)

This sounds good. What are you searing the Salmon on, grill or pan?

Homestead Meatloaf(Glazed with ketchup and served with green beans and mashed potatoes)

Always a meatloaf...

As for things missing:
- Coleslaw, Boston Baked (not a big deal, but people expect it), LOBSTER!!!
- One thing you might want to add to beverages is Shipyard Ale, a micro-brew from Maine.

As for my choices:

Appetizer:
- The scallops in bacon are really tempting here, as is the clam chowder. Ultimately, I don't get scallops enough, and usually most places (although not you kyle) would make chowder with chicken stock, which is a HUUUUGE no-no (try chowder from a can...did it once...never again). So scallops in bacon, yes please.

- This is a tough choice also, between CBC, crab stuffed cod, and salmon. I'm a sucker for crab stuffed anything, so send that cod my way.

- Oreo dirt...mmmm...

- For brew, this is tough. half of the meal deserves a nice blanc, but the other half deserves a long trail. I'll stick with long trail though.

And other comments:

Example again would be the lettuce wedge thing...that would certainly NEVER fly at any restaurant out here, except possibly really crappy ones...just not something accepted in California. Maybe this works out there...I am certain that any restaurant with the wedge on the menu wouldnt be receiving very many points in the Zagat or any stars from Michelin, heh. However this is a "family style comfort restaurant" so perhaps this is acceptable out there.

Actually, Lettuce Wedge is starting to become a very popular steak-house meal. I was just in the Bahamas, and that was one of the common things I was seeing. I certainly wouldn't expect it as traditional New England food, but it's definately NOT a "low star" menu item, considering the restaurants I was going to were Jackets Required, and had price tags of about $21 on just the appetizers.

The whole "fine-dining" thing constantly shifts as to what people want to see on the menus. What might be considered fine dining today might be regarded tomorrow as plebian. I see this in restaurants all the time.

Cod == McDonalds

The thing about Cod is its one of the most abundant fish in the harbor. Cod and Haddock are traditionally beer-battered and deepfried, or broiled with breadcrumbs and citrus. They're probably NOT as well received in other parts of the country, but believe me, we don't screw around with our Cod or our Haddock. It's good.

I am just a guy that will spend $10 more a bottle for a 12 year old vintage port when up against a 10 year tawny port (unless I know for sure that the tawny happens to be really excellent)

QFT!!! I'm also the guy who will spend the $120+ for a 25-year Laphroaig Single Malt. Don't knock it folks.

[Almighty]

Hey. Thanks for the words, Aaron. (when are you and Kerri getting married, by the way? It should be coming up soon, if it hasn't already happened, if I remember correctly.)

Any reason for deep frying? Usually searing up the scallops, and then broiling or baking them with the bacon wrapped does a good job of giving a thorough flavor saturation without causing you to lose some of the sweetness of the scallop to the fryalator.

Honestly, I am allergic to scallops, so I can not give you an personal account of what happens. But I have discussed the issue with a few chefs in school as well as other students, and the reasoning that makes the most sense to me is that if the scallop is completely wrapped, as in both ways so no scallop is exposed, there is less of a chance it will overcook. Because the bacon will be fully cooked in this manner, it will render off into the scallop and give it the impression of extra juiciness. For a flow reason, Frying them will take about 4-5 minutes. When bacon is baked in a 450(which is what my ovens will be set to) degree oven, it takes about 10-13 minutes to cook. A scallop would be considerably overcooked in that time. If I was not aiming for a real crispy bacon, I might do it that way, but it doesn't quite fit what I envision.

My question is, will this have rosemary or sage flavoring added? Even as a small garnish, it can make this dish really pop. Also, would the mashed be better served as gratin, instead? It keeps that creamy feel to the meal, and is a c-c-c-combo with the broccoli and melted cheddar. I also might add some muenster, although thats a Finnish cheese, so if you're going for strictly NE, you can stick with cheddar.

You know, I haddn't really considered infusing herbs in there. That could definetly be a nice touch. I love fried sage, and right here could be an excellent place to utilize it as an edible garnish as well as diversify the aroma of it all. A broccoli gratin could work just as well as mashed potatoes, if not better. I was thinking cross utilization when I first put this menu together, and after seeing how far ahead the CBC is(I never expected it to sell THAT much more than anything else) It makes sense to give it its own specific starch. Good suggestion.

Sadly, I don't think this is true. Most restuarants are required to have the internal temperature reach a certain point, which usually causes most of the juice in a steak to steam out or exit the meat in some other fashion. If you truly can guarantee a good sear, while keeping the inside pink-red, more power to ya.

It isn't going to have beautiful hatchmarks on it like you might expect on tenderloin or a NY strip. It's a fairly tough piece of meat, but has really nice marbling. If I cook it to its proper temperature and let it rest for a couple minutes before I slice it, it will maintain that color and won't bleed out at all. Slicing it thin also serves to make it more palatable.

This sounds good. What are you searing the Salmon on, grill or pan?

Pan sear. I have to give my saute guy SOMETHING to do, right?

Always a meatloaf...

As for things missing:
- Coleslaw, Boston Baked (not a big deal, but people expect it), LOBSTER!!!
- One thing you might want to add to beverages is Shipyard Ale, a micro-brew from Maine.

If I were to make this a real place, I'd try to work lobster in there somehow. Most of the stuff you get in the winter is the crappy pasteurized cryovac lobster. Personally, I have no idea how some places can make money selling a 1 lb live steamed lobster. They usually sell it for less than $30 or only have a contribution margin of about $10 on it. Unless they justify it by having enough people order the menu workhorse(in this case, my CBC.)

Fish and Chips/Fisherman's platter is omitted from my sample menu that would certainly make my overall menu. I would utilize the hell out of coleslaw there. I could also have a sides section where people can order things like Baked Beans and coleslaw.

Shipyard ale, eh? I'll need to try that sometime. Does it go right up there with Smuttynose Ale from Portsmouth, NH, would you say? What part of Maine is it from?

As far as Lettuce Wedge goes:
The primary component of any salad in NE has been iceburg lettuce. It's usually not in wedge form, but I think it would fly in NE. It's caught on up here in VT, and I see no reason why it wouldn't work anywhere else in NE, as the eating habits here aren't all that different from back home in NH.


One more thing,

The thing about Cod is its one of the most abundant fish in the harbor. Cod and Haddock are traditionally beer-battered and deepfried, or broiled with breadcrumbs and citrus. They're probably NOT as well received in other parts of the country, but believe me, we don't screw around with our Cod or our Haddock. It's good.

Well said. I couldn't have put it better myself.

[orgcandman]

Hey. Thanks for the words, Aaron. (when are you and Kerri getting married, by the way? It should be coming up soon, if it hasn't already happened, if I remember correctly.)

No Problemo...I studied a few culinary arts in my college days (just enough to be a lady killer...women are suckers for good cooks, and I'm not even that good). Kerri and I got married on the 29th of September. We were just in the Bahamas for our honeymoon.

the reasoning that makes the most sense to me is that if the scallop is completely wrapped, as in both ways so no scallop is exposed, there is less of a chance it will overcook. Because the bacon will be fully cooked in this manner, it will render off into the scallop and give it the impression of extra juiciness. For a flow reason, Frying them will take about 4-5 minutes. When bacon is baked in a 450(which is what my ovens will be set to) degree oven, it takes about 10-13 minutes to cook. A scallop would be considerably overcooked in that time. If I was not aiming for a real crispy bacon, I might do it that way, but it doesn't quite fit what I envision.

Fair enough. I'm used to partially cooking my bacon beforehand (Actually, when I lived with my brother, who is a chef, we used to always have bacon cooking...its his universal spice). While it will never get as crisp as it would if you cooked it from start to finish, I think for scallops wrapped, you don't want to over crisp it. Deep fry should be fine as long as the scallops are covered enough. You just don't want them to be oily, it ruins the sweetness.

You know, I haddn't really considered infusing herbs in there. That could definetly be a nice touch. I love fried sage, and right here could be an excellent place to utilize it as an edible garnish as well as diversify the aroma of it all. A broccoli gratin could work just as well as mashed potatoes, if not better. I was thinking cross utilization when I first put this menu together, and after seeing how far ahead the CBC is(I never expected it to sell THAT much more than anything else) It makes sense to give it its own specific starch. Good suggestion.

Well, my brother and I made a similar dish. We pounded some breasts thin, then rolled them with ham, yellow cheddar, muenster, and rosemary. Then we baked it for about 15 minutes on one side at 450, so that the cheese would bubble out, took them out, deglazed the baking dish with some yellowtail (added zip), flipped them, and did the other side for about 10 minutes. In the meantime, we boiled some potatoes until they were soft enough to be mostly cooked, but could still be sliced, put them in a separate baking dish, and baked them for about 15 minutes, with garlic, pepper, and salt. Then, we took the potatoes, laid them across the plates, laid one chicken breast on top, added green beans and garnished lightly with some crushed rosemary flakes, and the cheese-wine sauce. Not only was it amazing, but simple and can impress the wimmenz

Pan sear. I have to give my saute guy SOMETHING to do, right?

True enough. one thing I've always like to do with salmon is to hot smoke it, since it gives it a great infusion of woodsy flavor.

If I were to make this a real place, I'd try to work lobster in there somehow. Most of the stuff you get in the winter is the crappy pasteurized cryovac lobster. Personally, I have no idea how some places can make money selling a 1 lb live steamed lobster. They usually sell it for less than $30 or only have a contribution margin of about $10 on it. Unless they justify it by having enough people order the menu workhorse(in this case, my CBC.)

Yeah, I hear that. Slightly offtopic, there's a particular lobster in the bahamas, I think it's a rock lobster but I'm not sure, that is smaller than the maine lobster, but tastes infinately more sweet. If you can get some of that to try, do it.

Fish and Chips/Fisherman's platter is omitted from my sample menu that would certainly make my overall menu. I would utilize the hell out of coleslaw there. I could also have a sides section where people can order things like Baked Beans and coleslaw.

Understood. I know its just a sample menu. Just some suggestions of things that could be considered.

Shipyard ale, eh? I'll need to try that sometime. Does it go right up there with Smuttynose Ale from Portsmouth, NH, would you say? What part of Maine is it from?

Not sure, I think Scarborough, but I don't remember. I haven't tried Smuttynose, as I've been preoccupied drinking Old Speckled Hen. While not a local brew, it is AMAZING.

The primary component of any salad in NE has been iceburg lettuce. It's usually not in wedge form, but I think it would fly in NE. It's caught on up here in VT, and I see no reason why it wouldn't work anywhere else in NE, as the eating habits here aren't all that different from back home in NH.

Yeah, it's been at Cobblestones in Lowell for as long as I can remember, but I've seen it in many other steak houses, as well as a few restuarants in the Bahamas (I opted for Conch salad instead).

The thing about Cod is its one of the most abundant fish in the harbor. Cod and Haddock are traditionally beer-battered and deepfried, or broiled with breadcrumbs and citrus. They're probably NOT as well received in other parts of the country, but believe me, we don't screw around with our Cod or our Haddock. It's good.

Well said. I couldn't have put it better myself.

Well, honestly, there's just no comparison between Cod and Haddock freshly caught (you can get on a deep sea fishing vessel for about $15 and catch all the haddock and cod you can) and cooked, and the crap that most places serve and call haddock or cod. In fact, sometimes you might be getting Scrod or Tilapia instead of real Cod and Haddock.

[nataz]

-Scallops wrapped in Bacon(Scallops wrapped in bacon are deep fried and served with a honey mustard dipping sauce over a bed of organic mesclun greens.)

I'm again in the group that is surprised that you are deep frying them. Still sounds good, just really heavy.

-Broiled Crab Stuffed Cod(Fresh breaded cod is stuffed with jumbo lump crab and broiled. Served with wild rice pilaf.)
Tri Tip Steak(Tri tip steak is grilled to your liking, sliced thin, and served with green beans and roasted fingerling potatoes.)

Why cod over haddock? Is this because of the fish sticks? Haddock is so much better stuffed.
 
-Strawberry Cheesecake(Cheesecake with macerated strawberry topping and strawberry coulis.)

Beverages:

SHIPYARD!
http://www.shipyard.com

by far and away my favorite beer from Newengland. I live in kennebunkport and regularly get mini-kegs and Jugs from the local brewery/bar. <3. 

Shipyard first began in 1992 at Federal Jack's Restaurant and Brew Pub in Kennebunk, which is one of Maine's original brew pubs and working breweries. Within two years, demand for Shipyard beer outpaced the small operation and, in April 1994, Forsley and Pugsley opened the Shipyard Brewing Company in the heart of the waterfront in Portland, Maine.

[Hi-Val]

QFT!!! I'm also the guy who will spend the $120+ for a 25-year Laphroaig Single Malt. Don't knock it folks.

I've been enjoying King Cobra, a single-malt fortified beverage sold in ample amounts for $1.29.

Then again, I knocked back a bottle of '93 Burgess Cab last night that ran $55, so what can I say.

[Almighty]

Yeah, I hear that. Slightly offtopic, there's a particular lobster in the bahamas, I think it's a rock lobster but I'm not sure, that is smaller than the maine lobster, but tastes infinately more sweet. If you can get some of that to try, do it.

I'm 99 percent sure you are talking about rock lobster. These did not have claws and intead had spines, correct? I agree with your assesment on them. I used them daily when I worked down in Key West. I also cut myself from the tail more times than I care to remember.



Apparantly I also have a beer to try. Hopefully the beer store carries it.

[Hi-Val]

Yeah, I hear that. Slightly offtopic, there's a particular lobster in the bahamas, I think it's a rock lobster but I'm not sure, that is smaller than the maine lobster, but tastes infinately more sweet. If you can get some of that to try, do it.

I'm 99 percent sure you are talking about rock lobster. These did not have claws and intead had spines, correct? I agree with your assesment on them. I used them daily when I worked down in Key West. I also cut myself from the tail more times than I care to remember.



Apparantly I also have a beer to try. Hopefully the beer store carries it.

Also, I hope you're not talking about picking up King Cobra, for it is a beer useful only to those wishing to get drunk while paying with dimes.

[nataz]

Could be slipper lobster also, although I suspect you are talking about Caribbean spiny lobster. It's funny you say that spiny lobster is more sweet, I always thought the Maine Lobster tail was sweeter. In other words on the scale of sweetness from more sweet to less you have Maine Tail, Spiny Tail, Maine Claw. Good snow Crab beats the pants out of all of them though.

A lot of the lobster you get at red lobster is spiny lobster if you want an easy comparison. They made a bussiness of sweeping though the caribbean durring the late 70's -> 80's creating co-ops to ship cheap lobster north, hence making it readily availible for use in chains. Maine lobster on the other hand has always had an issue with shipping, traditionaly getting you either live lobster packed in rockweed, or cooked frozen lobster claws/tails (eww). Of note, recently some random guy in maine figured out how to use a high pressure water system (sounds messy) to get raw whole Maine lobster out of the shell, and combined it with another random new way to keep it fresh for 30 days while shipping. Prices for fresh uncooked Maine lobster outside of the upper newengland area may be on the way down, you could probably take advantage of that.

P.S.
please, for gods sake, do something other then a boil/steam if you do lobster. Cream based pasta, stuffed shells, stuffed anything, whatever, just stop boiling it @! Ugh. I eat a lot of lobster up here, and steamed is teeeerrrrible compared to what you can really do with it. Lobster rav. is amazing.

P.P.S.
 
Shipyard Export is excellent, it's brewed like a CA beer. Delicious. Shipyard Pumkinhead, the current seasonal beer is only so/so unless you are a fan of heavily spiced beer. The prelude coming out in nov is a great ale. Good luck. 

[orgcandman]

please, for gods sake, do something other then a boil/steam if you do lobster. Cream based pasta, stuffed shells, stuffed anything, whatever, just stop boiling it @! Ugh. I eat a lot of lobster up here, and steamed is teeeerrrrible compared to what you can really do with it. Lobster rav. is amazing.

Bisque...need I say more?

How about lobster fra diavlo? Sweet, spicy...mmm

[justaguy]

I'll have the Sweet and Sour Salmon(A Homestead Specialty. Salmon is seared and served over a sweet citrus risotto, Citrus beurre blanc, and wilted kale.) with a glass of water.  And perhaps a cup of coffee for desert, if you have it. 

I just pray that your restaurant isn't like most other family establishments that blasts pop rock so loud I can't hear myself think, let alone talk.  That's the biggest downfall to dining out for the middle class anymore.  I hope you don't fall into that trend.

[Lunar]

Look, the point on the ol lettuce wedge (and doug I sent you a message about the issue which I think you handled rather rudely to me..) is that while it might be deemed acceptable in a few places, and I do mean a few places...it is certainly not something that any real chef would ever take pride in, and I am sorry if that so seems to ruffle a few feathers.

You mention steak houses...in the few I have been to (Mortons, Ruths Chris) you go for the steak...and only the steak...(although Mortons had a pretty good chocolate desert too, heh) you are going to pay a bizillion dollars for that steak and it is going to come with nothing...you want a side? oh well, $10 for a baked potato, a plain ol baked potato, they dont even do any sort of mashed potatoes or other sort of side dish that might be considered legitimate...but who are you really kidding, you arent there for the sides...in this mentality I could see a lettuce wedge existing, but I would still be turned off by the obvious lack of care put into the dish (although I would probably brush it off with a laugh as I was enjoying my steak)

I'm 99 percent sure you are talking about rock lobster. These did not have claws and intead had spines, correct? I agree with your assesment on them. I used them daily when I worked down in Key West. I also cut myself from the tail more times than I care to remember.

Arent these Spiny Lobster? We talked about them a bit in Butchery class, and ive seen them on Food Network a few times generally referred to as Spiny Lobster, maybe they are called both though as that is common.

Also, I hope you're not talking about picking up King Cobra, for it is a beer useful only to those wishing to get drunk while paying with dimes.

And doug...just so I dont seem too snobby or whatever about food and beverages...Ill see your King Cobra and raise you a Steel Reserve

[Hi-Val]

Well obv you don't take pride in a lettuce wedge as amazing cuisine, but if people want it then it makes sense to serve it.

And Steel Reserve in the cans is the only way I can manage it, it gets too warm in the 40s and that's just nast for me. Have you seen Four-0? It's in tall boys, it's a buck nine and it's 10% alcohol. That's nuts.

[Almighty]

Look, the point on the ol lettuce wedge (and doug I sent you a message about the issue which I think you handled rather rudely to me..) is that while it might be deemed acceptable in a few places, and I do mean a few places...it is certainly not something that any real chef would ever take pride in, and I am sorry if that so seems to ruffle a few feathers.

You don't like the Lettuce Wedge. I get it. Get over it. And you most certainly ruffled my feathers with that comment. You don't know the casual New England diner. I do.If there is one thing a good chef can do, it's make money. People like their iceberg lettuce, and I would be a fool to not serve it to them. If you opened up a restaurant like this here and didn't include iceberg lettuce somehow, you would be a fool, too. If you hate iceberg wedges that much, don't come to my restaurant. I do not appreciate you constantly mocking the food I grew up eating.

What do you know, anyway?

[orgcandman]

Look, the point on the ol lettuce wedge (and doug I sent you a message about the issue which I think you handled rather rudely to me..) is that while it might be deemed acceptable in a few places, and I do mean a few places...it is certainly not something that any real chef would ever take pride in, and I am sorry if that so seems to ruffle a few feathers.

Dude, it's a 100% presentation dish. It's not meant to be a traditional salad. THAT is the point. ANY PERSON WITH HALF A BRAIN CAN TOSS A SALAD, OR SERVE A WEDGE. It takes all of an additional minute or less to break the wedge down, and prepare it the traditional way. Part of the fun of the dish is that it is different.

You mention steak houses...in the few I have been to (Mortons, Ruths Chris) you go for the steak...and only the steak...(although Mortons had a pretty good chocolate desert too, heh) you are going to pay a bizillion dollars for that steak and it is going to come with nothing...you want a side? oh well, $10 for a baked potato, a plain ol baked potato, they dont even do any sort of mashed potatoes or other sort of side dish that might be considered legitimate...but who are you really kidding, you arent there for the sides...in this mentality I could see a lettuce wedge existing, but I would still be turned off by the obvious lack of care put into the dish (although I would probably brush it off with a laugh as I was enjoying my steak)

Actually, while you go to a steak house for steak, most places worth their salt give you these things called appetizers, soups and salads, main course (which isn't just a steak), and a dessert. Your steak houses must really suck if they can't deliver that. (That statement was meant to mock Lunar's insults hurled at NE, not incite flames)

I'm 99 percent sure you are talking about rock lobster. These did not have claws and intead had spines, correct? I agree with your assesment on them. I used them daily when I worked down in Key West. I also cut myself from the tail more times than I care to remember.

Arent these Spiny Lobster? We talked about them a bit in Butchery class, and ive seen them on Food Network a few times generally referred to as Spiny Lobster, maybe they are called both though as that is common.

Yeah, they might be Spiny or Rock, I can't recall. Either way, they are much more sweet than a Maine lobster.

Also, I hope you're not talking about picking up King Cobra, for it is a beer useful only to those wishing to get drunk while paying with dimes.

And doug...just so I dont seem too snobby or whatever about food and beverages...Ill see your King Cobra and raise you a Steel Reserve

Maister Braue. 'Nuff said.