Lets discuss Bomberman today

[Aekhold]

I really like to see that somebody else tries to keep Bomberman alive, more, make it really competetive again.

At first, some matchup analysis from my own:
Control Slaver was a good matchup for Bomberman since I can think of these both decks fighting each other.
U/W Fish just dies when multiple Salvagers/Trinkets enter the Field. Fish is one of the best matchups for Bomberman so I dont think that this drastically changed with the time.
Could you maybe describe your matches vs. Goblins beside fast Coloss?
How do you come to the conclusion that you can pwn them, I really had problems vs. agressive lists with Bounce-Goblin.

Second, your list:
I totally agree to most of your choices, besides some single cards.
I found Tolaria West and Strip Mine and bad, Mine more than West. Maybe time is back for Tolaria West, I know its qualities.
I just don't think that a Strip Mine is worth to be played when you not play any other Mana Disruption. Sure you can kill a Academy/Workshop and eventually screw your opp, but another colorless land for a very situative effect which can grant your opp a little Time Walk....
Merchant Scroll>Mystical Tutor? Not pissed of when you get no Tinker if u want it? When you dont miss it, i agree to your choice.
Your TrinketBox seems pretty similar to my standard, although i dont play Pithing Needle main.

Third, your sb:
I play a TOTALLY different SB.
I think the Second Darksteel Colossus is absolutely nonsense if you not play Pyrite instead of AEther Spellbomb. You will mostly lose G1 vs. Painter, so Gaea's Blessing seems better for me, they will not get their Ancestral when you have your Censor down.
More EE in the side is pretty good, i play 1 additional in side with Moat, which is almost GG vs. Goblins/Fish/Ichorid/Staxx/WorkshopAggro.
// Sideboard
SB: 1  Engineered Explosives
SB: 3  Orim's Chant
SB: 4  Leyline of the Void (cause I play UWB)
SB: 1  Pithing Needle
SB: 1  Moat
SB: 1  Seal of Cleansing
SB: 3  Serenity
SB: 1  Darkblast

You can kill it yourself with EE when u go Combo, you just lose 1 Salvager.
How do use wrath in boarding?
In the last time, Flux got worse and worse, so i changed it to Serenity, which kills the entire board and you dont lose vs. critters they can hold on the table.
So, gimme some boarding plans vs. the decks u mentioned (played&contenders).

Hopefully a great discussion with you, Anusien
Greetz,
Aekhold

[trigunshin]

I'm curious on how to improve the combo match, ie the various Long-style decks.  Is chalice generally considered enough (set to 1 I assume)?  Is glowrider good enough as well? (Though it does shut down your own combo).  Also, why not extra Crypts vs Ichorid? I assume this is due to them running Chalice?  I realize its recurrable with Salvagers, but if you Mage the first crypt do you find you have time to set the recursion combo up?

[Anusien]

Control Slaver was a good matchup for Bomberman since I can think of these both decks fighting each other.

A good matchup against these decks (CS and then Gifts) is one of the things that makes Bomberman really good.  All your Trinkets are so good here.

U/W Fish just dies when multiple Salvagers/Trinkets enter the Field. Fish is one of the best matchups for Bomberman so I dont think that this drastically changed with the time.

My experience was that these matchups were really bad for you, but this was pre-Colossus.  Null Rod was a huge pain in the ass, and their men were often as big or bigger.  Daze was a problem for me getting Salvagers down.  The Angels and Wrath in the side help though.

Could you maybe describe your matches vs. Goblins beside fast Coloss?

Fast Colossus only entered into one game, and that's where I had Force of Will for Stingscourger as well as a Trinket Mage right before Warren Weirding.  The maindeck goes one of two ways.  Soetimes you blow them out early with the combo.  If your hand is good enough, you play a turn 2-3 Trinket Mage, untap and cast Salvagers and just win.  The only thing that can stop this plan is Earwig Squad.  In one game he Squaded me and took Spellbomb, Mindcensor, Colossus, leaving me all the good cards.  I managed to Trinket into Top and then find Explosives to beat him.  The other half of your games you win with beats.  Generally you need to Force of Will Goblin Lackey and use Trinket Mages just to trade.  The things you counter are Ringleader, Earwig Squad and sometimes Piledriver.  Aven Mindcensor is really good here; often you'll get it to come down and stop a fetchland or a Matron activation and then trade with a Goblin Piledriver.  Once you get a few guys on the board, you can just get over their heads with Mindcensors.  This becomes much easier with Exalted Angel. 
Remember that Mindcensor stops them from Earwig Squadding you.

How do you come to the conclusion that you can pwn them, I really had problems vs. agressive lists with Bounce-Goblin.

The lists I played were either Rb or Rg, they had no bounce in them.  I don't know what you mean.  But I went something like 4-0 in matches, 8-2 in games so I feel okay about the matchup.

I totally agree to most of your choices, besides some single cards.
I found Tolaria West and Strip Mine and bad, Mine more than West. Maybe time is back for Tolaria West, I know its qualities.
I just don't think that a Strip Mine is worth to be played when you not play any other Mana Disruption. Sure you can kill a Academy/Workshop and eventually screw your opp, but another colorless land for a very situative effect which can grant your opp a little Time Walk....

Strip Mine first.  Mainly, Strip Mine is there to deal with Library of Alexandria.  When I started playing, the people I barned like Dan Cunningham and JR Goldberg always ran the card, so I did as well.  It's rarely ever hurt me to have, and it's been kind of relevant a few times.  I've never tutored it up with Tolaria West, but I've considered it.  I've also gotten there with a random Strip Mining a few times when I decided to play a tempo deck.
I added Tolaria West after I won my first Mox at the Roanoke P9, but never got to play with it because of Gush.  I really really like it in the deck.  I'm running 16 lands now where most people run 14-15, so the last land is a Tolaria West which is practically a spell.  I've played it a few times, but most of the time it goes to find either Black Lotus or Library of Alexandria.  It's a mana neutral play and occasionally it turns islands into mana to play Aven Mindcensor (I think I once transmuted it for a Tundra to play Salvagers).  I definitely like having the card; it's basically the 5th Trinket Mage.

Merchant Scroll>Mystical Tutor? Not pissed of when you get no Tinker if u want it? When you dont miss it, i agree to your choice.

You're a control deck in a large number of matchups, so having to wait for the card is pretty poor.  I like going Land, Land Mox Scroll into Ancestral on turns 1 and 2.  For the longest time I did not even have Tinker in the deck; the question isn't "Wouldn't you rather have Tinker?" but "Wouldn't you rather have Time Walk?"  Still, I've never regretted not having Mystical, and I have had plenty of times where I was glad Merchant Scroll worked right away.  Merchant Scroll for Drain is far better than Mystical for Drain.

Your TrinketBox seems pretty similar to my standard, although i dont play Pithing Needle main.

Depends on the metagame.  Needle is good against CS, Stax, Goblins and Ichorid.  It's less good against combo and Fish.  It's cuttable if you have to, but I wouldn't like it.

I play a TOTALLY different SB.
I think the Second Darksteel Colossus is absolutely nonsense if you not play Pyrite instead of AEther Spellbomb. You will mostly lose G1 vs. Painter, so Gaea's Blessing seems better for me, they will not get their Ancestral when you have your Censor down.
More EE in the side is pretty good, i play 1 additional in side with Moat, which is almost GG vs. Goblins/Fish/Ichorid/Staxx/WorkshopAggro.

The replacement for Darksteel Colossus isn't Pyrite Spellbomb (since I don't play red), it's Academy Ruins.  My thought is that basically, having the second Colossus in the library will turn game losses into draws.  It's the most cuttable sideboard card, but right now I like it (my metagame isn't very heavy combo).  I'm not sure that you'll lose game 1 against Painter, and the second Colossus is probably better than Blessing (since they can crypt you and go off again).
Moat seems alright, but I can't imagine just playing 1 anti-aggro card with no way to tutor it up.  Fish can easily counter it and Goblins can Earwig Squad it.  I really liked the 2 Angel 2 Wrath in the sideboard.  Plus, if Pyrite Spellbomb were as good as you say, I'd be running Cursed Scroll (I considered it, but it doesn't kill Painters or Salvagers).

In sideboarded games versus aggro, it changes depending on my hand.  If I don't have any sideboarded cards, I just try to trade and keep my life total up as high as possible.  Then I'll either combo, wreck them with Colossus, or wreck them with my sideboarded cards.  It's just like UW versus beatdown in every T2 ever.

I don't know the right way to sideboard against Ichorid.  I know I've always run Honor the Fallen, but I keep dodging Ichorid in the pairings () except once when I played with Gush and just used Yixlid Jailor and Extirpate.  Honor seems like a good way to shut them down and gain some life.  It might turn out that one card is better than the others, but since you're so far ahead already I'm not terribly worried about it.  If you're in black and you already have Crypt and Needle, Yixlid Jailor is probably better than your other options.

Energy Flux x3 + Hurkyl's has been my board plan for a while against Stax with Ichorid, and it works out fine.  It's not hard to just sit back on basic lands against them and build up a hand.  It's really easy for them to see Serenity coming and it has the potential to wreck your side (a lot of the way you win that matchup is by getting some artifact mana down they can't disrupt).  I know JR thinks Energy Flux is an all or nothing (4 or 0) card, but that plan has worked fine for me.  In the match I won against Miller, I didn't even see any.

Sideboarding:
Goblins:
-2 Mana Leak, -1 Engineered Explosives, -1 Tormod's Crypt
+2 Exalted Angel, +2 Wrath of God

Fish:
- 1Tormod's Crypt, -1 Pithing Needle, -2 Mana Leak
+2 Exalted Angel, +2 Wrath of God
(optionally something like -1 Aven Mindcensor, +1 Engineered Explosives)

Stax:
-1 Tormod's Crypt, -3 Aven Mindcensor, -1 Pithing Needle (I think this was wrong, but I'm not sure what else to take out)
+3 Energy Flux, +1 Hurkyl's Recall, +1 Engineered Explosives

Combo:
-1 Pithing Needle
+1 Chalice of the Void

Ichorid:
-4 Mana Drain, -2 Mana Leak
+4 Honor the Fallen, +1 Wrath of God, +1 Engineered Explosives

CS:
-1 Echoing Truth
+1 Engineered Explosives

Painter:
-1 Tormod's Crypt, -1 Echoing Truth (I think)
+1 Engineered Explosives, +1 Darksteel Colossus

Hopefully that answers those questions.  I think I might go -1 Colossus -1 Chalice +2 anti-combo slots.  Unsure yet, I may test with someone and find out.

[Anusien]

This deck is much better than anyone is giving it credit for.  In the past few weeks, I split a Mox and two other IRCers both T8ed with the deck, both losing to (I believe) Long.

[LotusHead]

Team Vacaville tech for Bomberman is always including an Ancient Tomb to the mana base.  It has won so many games for just being 2 mana for 2 life.

I've seen it used by others but it should be auto-include. It helps with Explosives vs Chalice for 0 and 1 to boot.

[Aekhold]

Fish:
- 1Tormod's Crypt, -1 Pithing Needle, -2 Mana Leak
+2 Exalted Angel, +2 Wrath of God
(optionally something like -1 Aven Mindcensor, +1 Engineered Explosives)

I'd board in CotV, too. Set up to 2 kills so many cards in their deck, mostly in UW and UWB Fish and most of the time they have no way to remove it @ Echoing Truth&Seal of Cleansing.

@Ancient Tomb: I play Mana Crypt instead of it, because I don't want to much non-blue-producing landdrops.
Team Vacaville plays both, ai?
The only Colorless-Producing Land I will play in Bomberman is LoA, Strip Mine is just to random and I don't play cards for an very random situation @LoA Counter.

My maindeck is pretty similar to Anusien's, just with -1 Strip Mine +1 Polluted Delta and -1 Pithing Needle +1 Mana Crypt, I will form my SB to 3 Orim's Chant and 1 Chalice.

[Anusien]

Team Vacaville tech for Bomberman is always including an Ancient Tomb to the mana base.  It has won so many games for just being 2 mana for 2 life.

I've seen it used by others but it should be auto-include. It helps with Explosives vs Chalice for 0 and 1 to boot.

I think I've heard it before, and I'm very curious.  How many blue sources do you all have that don't CIPT (basically Tolaria West)?  I have wanted more ways to EE for 0 through a Chalice of the Void, since at the moment I have Strip Mine, Library and Drain mana.  I think it's stronger than Mana Crypt since it is difficult to race your own Mana Crypt versus aggro decks.

I'd board in CotV, too. Set up to 2 kills so many cards in their deck, mostly in UW and UWB Fish and most of the time they have no way to remove it @ Echoing Truth&Seal of Cleansing.

How do your matches against UW Fish go?  You're setting Chalice at 1 I imagine, to turn off Swords and Savannah Lions/Isamaru?  Does it come down fast enough to be relevant, generally?  Also, how often do you want to combo against Fish?  The matchup where I plan to bring in Chalice I don't need to combo, since I'll want to keep Drain up instead of being as aggressive.

My maindeck is pretty similar to Anusien's, just with -1 Strip Mine +1 Polluted Delta and -1 Pithing Needle +1 Mana Crypt, I will form my SB to 3 Orim's Chant and 1 Chalice.

Where are you getting the slots?  From the anti-aggro cards?

[Aekhold]

Where are you getting the slots?  From the anti-aggro cards?

I play a more general Ichorid Hate with 1 EE, 1 T-Crypt, 1 Needle in the side. See my actual list below.

I tried out Ancient Tomb in many versions, but basically I don't like the fact that u need an oncolor Mox to play Censor/Trinket Mage Turn 1, a Land + Mana Crypt actually happens more often and I'd never cut it. Basically, it's a decision if you want your cc3s (which Bomberman has enough from) Turn1 or Turn2 with 1 more mana which includes Life Loss.

I have LoA, Sol Ring, Mana Crypt and DrainMana and setting EE to 0 was never a problem for me.
Mana Crypt just affords such speed that you can race aggro and it's an additional artifact for Thirst if u need it.

At fish, i mostly play a trading-1vs1 creatures and get enough mana with Trinket Mages, Salvagers stall the game. I try to get their creature board empty and set the Chalice at 2 if I can manage it, so Null Rod, Jötun Grunt, Dark Confidant, Jitte..... are disabled. I basically Counter their dangerous threats, trade some creatures and then set Chalice 1 and Tinker or empty their board and set it to 2.

Actual list:

// Lands
    4  Flooded Strand
    1  Library of Alexandria
    3  Island
    1  Plains
    4  Tundra
    1  Tolaria West
    1  Tolarian Academy
    1  Polluted Delta

// Creatures
    3  Aven Mindcensor
    4  Trinket Mage
    3  Auriok Salvagers
    1  Darksteel Colossus

// Spells
    4  Force of Will
    1  Mana Crypt
    4  Mana Drain
    1  Black Lotus
    1  Sol Ring
    1  Mox Sapphire
    1  Mox Ruby
    2  Mana Leak
    1  Sensei's Divining Top
    1  AEther Spellbomb
    1  Engineered Explosives
    1  Echoing Truth
    1  Tormod's Crypt
    1  Time Walk
    1  Brainstorm
    4  Thirst for Knowledge
    1  Mox Pearl
    1  Ponder
    1  Merchant Scroll
    1  Ancestral Recall
    1  Tinker
    1  Mox Emerald
    1  Mox Jet

// Sideboard
SB: 1  Engineered Explosives
SB: 1  Tormod's Crypt
SB: 1  Pithing Needle
SB: 1  Chalice of the Void
SB: 2  Exalted Angel
SB: 2  Wrath of God
SB: 3  Energy Flux
SB: 1  Hurkyl's Recall
SB: 1  Gaea's Blessing
SB: 2  Orim's Chant

Just think about the third Chant, but I will decide this at the countryside. with 3 Chant, Chalice and maybe an additional T-Crypt for very Will-Based storms.
Hope will be enough for storm.

[Anusien]

I don't think the sideboarded Gaea's Blessing does what you want.  If they Grind you and it is in your library, you will shuffle your graveyard into your library and then they can Grind you again or just respond to the Blessing trigger with Crypt and you won't shuffle back.  Two DSC will draw the game instead.  Now you may want this for one of the Brain Freeze decks instead.  Can you talk more about this?

What are you boarding against Ichorid?  -4 Mana Drain -2 Mana Leak +1 Tormod's Crypt +1 Pithing Needle +1 Engineered Explosives +2 Wrath of God +1 Exalted Angel?  How good is that matchup?  I would love to not have to devote 4 spots just to the deck.

The real question is what are you cutting against Storm decks?  -1 Pithing Needle -2 Mana Leak -1 Echoing Truth +3 Orim's Chant +1 Chalice of the Void looks like how you'd board, but I'm not sure.

What about Fish?  -1 Tormod's Crypt -1 Pithing Needle -2 Mana Leak -1 Engineered Explosives for the 5 cards you're bringing in?  Or what do you cut to bring in the Chalice of the Void?

I had never considered just bringing in Chalice for 2.  How often can you deploy that around Daze?

[Mdizzle4life85]

i would love to read a primer on this deck, i live in a control slaver meta in new england and i feel that bomberman has a strong chance @ becoming tier 1 around here a primer would be awesome!

[Anusien]

i would love to read a primer on this deck, i live in a control slaver meta in new england and i feel that bomberman has a strong chance @ becoming tier 1 around here a primer would be awesome!

What information are you looking for out of a primer?  Aside from the obvious "How to build the deck and sideboard, how to metagame the deck" stuff, what do you want to know?

[Mdizzle4life85]

well to answer your question i was looking for an optimal list as well as an idea of how certain matchups go and how to play them

[Anusien]

well to answer your question i was looking for an optimal list as well as an idea of how certain matchups go and how to play them

Yeah, that stuff is all assumed (and mostly covered in the thread too, read backwards).

[personalbackfire]

Why Mindcensor still?
It has a solid game against combo if you can get it down before they get going, but it seems like it has gotten worse with the metagame switch. CS is packing thirst of knowledge and drawing into there threats with that and Fact. Decks are now running more land in general as well, as opposed to the gush decks, so if they go to fetch there is a better chance they will see a land.

Also why does no one run Meddling Mage?
Naming welder against CS seems like it would be pretty solid. Most grimlong decks that I have seen, have been based off GWS's list and only run tendrils, so naming tendrils, or even dark  ritual would be good. The card single handily shuts down painter decks if resolved as well as oath.

[frolll]

Edit: Is there interest in a primer of sorts, or do people feel like all the information they need is in this thread?

I, for one, would be really interested in such a primer.

That said, your list looks solid, but the 2 Mana Leak are weird... nop ?


EDIT : Oh well, I took too long to write this Thanks for the relevant info !

[Anusien]

Why Mindcensor still?
It has a solid game against combo if you can get it down before they get going, but it seems like it has gotten worse with the metagame switch. CS is packing thirst of knowledge and drawing into there threats with that and Fact. Decks are now running more land in general as well, as opposed to the gush decks, so if they go to fetch there is a better chance they will see a land.

Mindcensor isn't that great against combo compared to the control decks.  With all the tops running around there will be uncracked fetchlands, and they're increasingly going back to Tinker as a win condition.  It's not as good as the 4 Gifts 4 Merchant Scroll metagame, but it's still an incredible play to come out of the Black Lotus turn 2 you fetch with a Trinket Mage.

Also why does no one run Meddling Mage?
Naming welder against CS seems like it would be pretty solid. Most grimlong decks that I have seen, have been based off GWS's list and only run tendrils, so naming tendrils, or even dark  ritual would be good. The card single handily shuts down painter decks if resolved as well as oath.

First off, many of these decks are back to sideboarding Massacre, which limits the effectiveness of Mage somewhat, but I imagine you're talking about replacing Mindcensor with Mage, so that's not a delineator.  A few things:
Mindcensor flies and beats.  Meddling Mage can almost never get in there.
Mindcensor has Flash which is really significant.
Most of the decks you want Mage against run a lot of similar cards.  You can't name the card you most want to name against CS, namely Thirst for Knowledge or Tinker (you can, but it's sub-optimal).  It's good against Grim, but there are probably better cards.
Mainly though Mindcensor stops a whole bunch of cards (get it against a land or a Scroll and also shut down their Tinker) which has always been good for me.
I invite you to try Mage because it seems very promising, but my initial reaction is that Mindcensor is still better.

[personalbackfire]

I thank you for the quick response Anusien. The points you have layed out make sense. Although initially Mage looked good, the reasons you have stated are making me lean to testing Mindcensor. 

Edit: Is there interest in a primer of sorts, or do people feel like all the information they need is in this thread?

I, for one, would be really interested in such a primer.

I also would be interested in a primer.

[Aekhold]

I don't think the sideboarded Gaea's Blessing does what you want.

I just don't like the idea to have a Sideboard Card which is totally crap when I've lost G1. You got it by mentioning BrainFreeze, I'm a little traumatized because it kills us totally when we want to go off.
In combination with Mindcensor, 2 EEs and a other stuff like Needle and so on I dont think that they are abled to establish a situation with T-Crypt and the whole combo where we don't can interact. I've just lost a game where my opp ripped of Ancestral Recall from the top. Other games I drawed because I lost G1 and won G2 with the really surprising effect of Blessing, which is really huge.
Matches I won G1 I generally win 2:0, because

the really surprising effect of Blessing

.
This is one point I really like in Magic at all. You REALLY have to act. Really. You act like your really afraid of their combo or complain about how broken a 2-card combo for 6 mana is, so they not get a huge set up and try to get their combo out any costs although they create carddisadvantage.
(Complaining about your deck and your draw skills also helps.)

What are you boarding against Ichorid?

-4 Mana Drain
-2 Mana Leak
+1 Tormod's Crypt
+1 Engineered Explosives
+1 Pithing Needle
(+1 Chalice of the Void, if mana Ichorid to avoid Cabal Therapy and Chain of Vapor)
+2 Wrath of God
+X Orim's Chant (looks strange, but get time with Kicker and avoids Combokill and saves our handcards)

The real question is what are you cutting against Storm decks?

-2 Mana Leak
-1 Ponder (Sorcery, bad in Control-Role)
-1 Engineered Explosives (They mostly know that we have it and dont board EtW in because we can get it so easily. Vs their Mana I don't really like it, it just feeds Y-Will.)
+3 Orim's Chant
+1 Chalice of the Void
(+1 Tormod's Crypt for -1 Mindcensor for Will&Drawbased Variants)

What about Fish?

-2 Mana Leak
-1 Tormod's Crypt
-1 Mindcensor (just to bad for this MatchUp)
-1 TfK/Ponder (depens on how many draw they have.
+2 Wrath of God
+2 Exalted Angel
+1 Chalice of the Void

Also why does no one run Meddling Mage?

I tested it, and it was really horrible for me. In addition to the reasons Anusien gave it was really hard to cast when you play vs. Aggro/Control with Waste-Effects and Shopdecks. MM is no classic Control card, you have no Drain Mana Up or anything else, it can't be cast with the Mana from Lotus from Trinket Mage. I think the main reason for Mindcensor is that it has Flash, so it can be played instead of the unused Counter at the end of turn.

@Anusien: Msg me for personal Messenger Contact, maybe some experiences we can exchange over it for the Primer or something like that.

Good Night,
Aekhold

[Anusien]

In combination with Mindcensor, 2 EEs and a other stuff like Needle and so on I dont think that they are abled to establish a situation with T-Crypt and the whole combo where we don't can interact. I've just lost a game where my opp ripped of Ancestral Recall from the top. Other games I drawed because I lost G1 and won G2 with the really surprising effect of Blessing, which is really huge.
Matches I won G1 I generally win 2:0, because

the really surprising effect of Blessing

.
This is one point I really like in Magic at all. You REALLY have to act. Really. You act like your really afraid of their combo or complain about how broken a 2-card combo for 6 mana is, so they not get a huge set up and try to get their combo out any costs although they create carddisadvantage.
(Complaining about your deck and your draw skills also helps.)

*shrug* That sort of plan only works once in a tournament, and I'm not confident I can pull it off.  Plus, they're a Trinket Mage deck too, so it isn't like they can't tutor up Crypt and get it next turn.  If you need that effect I think Darksteel Colossus is better.  In the case where they have Extirpate/Crypt, you're going to lose that game on the next turn, where Colossus will give you another shot to at least tie.  I used to think Colossus was bad on the play too, but look at it this way: you're turning an 0-2 match into an 0-1-1 match with another game or two to go.  It was suggested to me to run Academy Ruins there, since it does the same thing but you can tap it for mana.  I'm uncertain that you even need this effect; I'd much rather have an extra EE or Pithing Needle.

I just don't like the idea to have a Sideboard Card which is totally crap when I've lost G1. You got it by mentioning BrainFreeze, I'm a little traumatized because it kills us totally when we want to go off.

I'd think you'd be able to see Brain Freeze coming, but at the moment, I'm not convinced this is an issue in the metagame.  I'd rather not devote a slot to countering it, since you have to take out a relevant card.

What are you boarding against Ichorid?

-4 Mana Drain
-2 Mana Leak
+1 Tormod's Crypt
+1 Engineered Explosives
+1 Pithing Needle
(+1 Chalice of the Void, if mana Ichorid to avoid Cabal Therapy and Chain of Vapor)
+2 Wrath of God
+X Orim's Chant (looks strange, but get time with Kicker and avoids Combokill and saves our handcards)

Interesting.  I guess you let them remove to Ichorids on upkeep and then Chant them.  I'm not sure that's better than Angel, but it's worth considering at the very least.

The real question is what are you cutting against Storm decks?

-2 Mana Leak
-1 Ponder (Sorcery, bad in Control-Role)
-1 Engineered Explosives (They mostly know that we have it and dont board EtW in because we can get it so easily. Vs their Mana I don't really like it, it just feeds Y-Will.)
+3 Orim's Chant
+1 Chalice of the Void
(+1 Tormod's Crypt for -1 Mindcensor for Will&Drawbased Variants)

I think it's wrong to not take out Pithing Needle.  It *seems* like a good card, but there are only three cards Needle helps against: Necro, Bargain, and Memory Jar.  The case where you can actually Needle any of those and have any effect is few and far between, and you're rarely going to get there blindly.  I think the EE is worth having; if nothing else it makes Academy slightly less useful.  (But then again, you keep the Needle sideboarded I believe).

What about Fish?

-2 Mana Leak
-1 Tormod's Crypt
-1 Mindcensor (just to bad for this MatchUp)
-1 TfK/Ponder (depens on how many draw they have.
+2 Wrath of God
+2 Exalted Angel
+1 Chalice of the Void

Again, if you have Needle maindeck I would take it out here.  I think I would probably sideboard out your Mana Crypt here as well; from my experience Fish games end up in a ground stall fairly often and Crypt has the potential to kill you since you can't race it.  I'm also interesting in people's thoughts on taking out Engineered Explosives instead of the draw spell.  I assume I'm operating under Null Rod since their draws are fairly unimpressive without it.  Consequently, I'd rather have the draw spell to dig into some gas instead of a useless EE.

@Anusien: Msg me for personal Messenger Contact, maybe some experiences we can exchange over it for the Primer or something like that.

My AIM is Anusien (it's in my profile).  Feel free to message me (anyone here!) and ask about Bomberman.

I'm also debating my 15th sideboard slot since I have Pithing Needle main (good in more matchups than not).  Any thoughts?

[Mdizzle4life85]

I have been testing anusiens list v.s. stax and it doesent seem like that good of a match, if you get to drain their first spell you just win, however if they squeek a sphere against you its usually bad news bears! any else have any input in the stax match?

[feyd]

bomberman can do very well in the shop matchup.  Your artifact acceleration can match their sphere effects.  If your bomberman list runs either bounce (echoing truth) or swords you can usually remove their one huge threat and control the game from there if you haven't already achieved a deathgrip on the gamestate.  I tested my bomberman list in my gambit and mono red WS aggro is what I tested against.  Their sphere effects can only do so much when you run 17 land and many more mana sources.  With that much mana up sphere of resistance and thorn of amethyst, especially thorn, mean much less to you than they do against long.  The problem with the workshop matchup is when they hit the ground running dropping a big threat followed by either tangle wire, sword of fire and ice, or another big threat.  The shop matchup can be won, although it requires a fight from bomberman to reach a stable ammount of mana/counterspells. 

[Anusien]

I have been testing anusiens list v.s. stax and it doesent seem like that good of a match, if you get to drain their first spell you just win, however if they squeek a sphere against you its usually bad news bears! any else have any input in the stax match?

Really?  I've had a lot of success in the matchup.  Basically, I prioritize my mulligans based on having abundant mana and counters if it's important.  The plan there is usually to get a bunch of mana sources in play as fast as possible and then keep their creatures off the table until you can win.  You can let a lot of Spheres resolve as long as you keep their men and Null Rods off the table.  You rarely combo off early against them so Thorn of Amethyst really is a joke.  You just respond by playing another land.  Basically you play mana sources and stay alive until you either drain into something ridiculous or get there with SB cards and just win.  I think that's the best way to explain it anyway.

[bronxie]

BOB-ERMAN won the Cary Cup today.  the deck is making good amount of top 8s now so i think adding black to the deck is a very legit thing.  adding leylines for ichorid? so good.  in addition to crypts and needles.

You need clean up your posts please. -Zherbus

[Anusien]

BOB-ERMAN won the Cary Cup today.  the deck is making good amount of top 8s now so i think adding black to the deck is a very legit thing.  adding leylines for ichorid? so good.  in addition to crypts and needles.

Why Leyline over something that is arguably better if it resolves?  Examples are Samurai of the Pale Curtain (yuck), Honor the Fallen or similar effects.  Modern Bomberman decks aren't boarding in a terrible number of cards anyway.  The more interesting cards out of that list are the Duresses to fight Long.

[Mdizzle4life85]

i have been testing this list for about 2 weeks now and i must say repeal is a must and pithing needle is huge, also a 1 of intution is the nutz because if you already have a salvager on the table and u intuition its game over.

[Anusien]

i have been testing this list for about 2 weeks now and i must say repeal is a must and pithing needle is huge, also a 1 of intution is the nutz because if you already have a salvager on the table and u intuition its game over.

Why is Repeal a must, and over what?  What cards do you expect to bounce?  I can see the utility of Repeal against MUD while you make land drops, but it seems not-hot compared to similar cards you are already running against Fish/Long/CS (TfK mainly).

What do you replace for the Intuition, and how is it better overall than Thirst for Knowledge?

[Mdizzle4life85]

first off the repeals are good against stax yes i admit however there are a couple other matchups where they can shine. the first being control slaver whether its bouncing their tormods crypt or time walking against goblin welder in this matchup bomber man needs to establish control by hitting land drops and sculpting the hand. also repeal is good agains goblins i mean repeal on their turn 1 lacky gives you a chance to have and answer for it later. intuition is only a one of so you can find one of those sketchy one ofs in your build and cut that, personally i never liked the mindscensor so i wanted more utility. thus 2x repeal and 1x intuition replaced mindscensor.

[Anusien]

first off the repeals are good against stax yes i admit however there are a couple other matchups where they can shine. the first being control slaver whether its bouncing their tormods crypt or time walking against goblin welder in this matchup bomber man needs to establish control by hitting land drops and sculpting the hand. also repeal is good agains goblins i mean repeal on their turn 1 lacky gives you a chance to have and answer for it later. intuition is only a one of so you can find one of those sketchy one ofs in your build and cut that, personally i never liked the mindscensor so i wanted more utility. thus 2x repeal and 1x intuition replaced mindscensor.

Aven Mindcensor blocks Piledriver, Repeal doesn't answer Piledriver.  And honestly in the matchup, the real threat is Earwig Squad, not Lackey.  Consequently I'd rather have blockers than bounce and sketchy draw spells.

Honestly, I don't see how Repeal is better than Mindcensor against CS.  One of the two answers Tinker, and it isn't Repeal.  Trinket Mages have always been a fine answer to Crypt (what a worthless card against you anyway!) and Welders.  Yes, Repeal ALSO answers those things, but are you just not getting there with Trinket enough?  Are you running 4 Thirst for Knowledge already?  The only time I'd want Intuition over Thirst for Knowledge is where you have Salvagers + Lotus but no other cards.  And even then, Thirst for Knowledge is usually enough to get you there.  More importantly, I'm worried about how much you lose out by not having the extra creatures, since I win half my matchups by just attacking with Ogres.

[Mdizzle4life85]

of course i am running four x tfk but the point of intuition is it allows you to be very aggressive if need be with you salvagers. also it is never bad to use as an instant speed merchant scroll for force of will if you need to get out of a tricky situation, repeal is just so good i mean mindscensor doesent necessarily shut off tinker control slaver usually runs enough robots/ threats to hit of the top 4 anyway ive seen it enough. repeal is gas against bob, welder, chalice, spheres, and much much more! i have a very good revamped list that i intend to share with you fellows after the eld mox ruby tourney this weekend i would rather other people didnt read all my tech before the tourney. but i am not arguing with you anusien just merely sharing thoughts because i feel the both of us are adding alot of possitive feedback to this thread and together can make an unbeatable bomberman list. i value your input and look forward to hearing from you!

[akabane]

I tried to build a non-standard UWr Bomberman list.
Before i get into explaining my choices, here the decklist:

4 Fetch
2 Island
3 Tundra
3 Volcanic
1 StripMine
1 Tolarian Academy

5 Mox
1 SolRing
1 MCrypt
1 Lotus

2 Salvagers
3 Trinket
3 Augury Adept

4 FoW
3 Drain
2 ReB

1 Mystical
1 Merchant
1 Fact or Fiction
3 Fire/Ice
1 Pyrite Spellbomb
1 Aether Spellbomb
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 E.E.
1 Sensei's DT
1 Tinker
1 DSC
3 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Chain of Vapor
1 Ancestral
1 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
1 TWalk

59+1 card i forgot which it is (i don't have the deck with me now)

The sideboard goes:
3 ChaliceotV
2 Pithing Needle
2 Rack'n Ruin
2 Hurkyl's Recall
3 Jotun Grunt
3 Honor the Fallen

MD:
Strip Mine, really useful vs LoA or other sources as Academy or WS, of course if seen early.
Augury Adept, I prefer those to MCensors because yes, they don't have flash, flying or deny a fetchland or a tutor, but they're golden vs aggro-control and sometimes if you flip the right card, vs combo.
FireIce, great removal and tempo gainer vs almost all decks (tapping lands vs combo to gain tempo) synergic with Augure
ReB, the only MU i regret this is Ichorid and Shop, but here they of course side out, but when facing a blue deck they're GOLD; i prefer them to misD cause misD serve the same purpose (win counterwars) but ReB at the cost of R don't put you in card disadvantage and it's a removal for Tyrant and for blue critters (also they do some random win vs ReB-Painter)

SB:
3 CotV vs combo, 1 is really not enough, i want to set it as soon as possible at 0 and 1, and protect them from their bouncers @ 2 and 3.
3 Honor the fallen vs Ichorid, Dragon (if any)
3 Jotun Grunt great vs Tarmogoyf based decks, they recycle resources, stops tarmo from growing and also good vs Shop (1W - 4/4!) (i usually side cotvs and those vs combo)
2 Pithing, all purpose stopper, from fetches to welders to triskelions to wastelands and so on.
2 Hurkyl and 2 RnR vs Shop.

This is a non standard list, i know, but i invite you to give it a test ride and lemme know 
I think it could perform well.
What do you think bout it?