Baseball!

[Scott_Limoges]

Where are they now?  Have the playoffs been shaping up the way you thought?  Where did Arizona come from?  How about them Cubbies?!  Is there a division without a playoff race?

[Meddling Mike]

I admit I love looking back at these threads after the fact. People excited about the Tigers and making guesses that they'd soon be the best team in baseball, my speculation that the Yankees wouldn't get their act together, Scott's NL wild card predictions (now only one of those teams is realistically in contention and sit in the 4, 5 and 6 spots in the NL wild card). The AL playoffs should be really interesting, have the sox been allowing a slide in order to prep for the post season and rest key players or are they really just not the same team they were in the first half never to be seen again? Will the Yankees redeem themselves from their terrible first half with a World Series run? Does anybody outside of California/Ohio actually care about the Angels/Indians and want them to win it?

[MadManiac21]

Being able to bring Manny and Youk back after extended rest for injuries in addition to giving Schilling that much time off to properly be prepared for the playoff rotation is amazing.

I'm really looking forward to the playoff run the Sox should make.

[master_p]

I'm so angry at the brewers right now. They had what, like an 8 game lead in july? Once the cubs made thier run they had plenty of chances to take them down agian, and they punt it in the last 2 weeks of the season. The bullpin seriously just imploded these last few weeks. They were swinging the bats just phenominally (Prince Fielder anyone?) performing really well defensively with good starting pitching (almost all the time) and they can't hold like a 5 run lead against anyone. Makes me very, very angry. Anybody else see Ned Yost get thrown out of 3 of 4 games during that St. Louis home stand? That was sweet.

[Scott_Limoges]

Who's the next NL wild card - Padres or Rockies?

[Clown of Tresserhorn]

ROCKIES WIN IN 13!!!

WOOOOOOOOHOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Philly, here we come!

[Meddling Mike]

I was REALLY glad the Rockies won. I was SO tired of Padres fans making ridiculous claims on message boards like "The pads are better than the Sox because their pitching staff has a lower ERA" completely ignoring the fact that the NL's pitchers get a free out every 9 batters where AL pitchers get to pitch to people like David Ortiz instead. Congrats to the Rockies, you've officially passed Philly as the feel good story of this post season.

[defector]

Wow, what a season. The National League is a topsy turvy place, the idea that both Arizona and Colorado would go to the playoff and the Mets wouldn't is just crazy. The AL at least makes some sense. Are we going to see a run like last year? Is it time for the Cubs to prove that winning the worst division with the worst record is the key to a world series? These play offs are going to be wild. My prediction now, Cubs vs Sox in the Series. It will go six games, but the crystal ball gets cloudy as to who comes out on top:)
tom

[Meddling Mike]

It's not over yet, but looks like Rockies v. D-Backs for the NL championship, don't think anybody would have called that one...

Red Sox won the opener and the Yankees lost theirs! Yaaay! I personally have no problem with playing the Indians in the ALCS instead of the Yankees.

Beckett looked so dominant in game 1, it was really encouraging, I just hope DiceK and Schilling can follow suit!

I also cannot wait for the ALCS on Fox if only so i can stop hearing those damn Frank TV ads every 30 seconds and the terrible commentators on TBS. The ironic part, it actually seems like it might be an ok show, but it's just been so over advertised and shoved down my throat that I feel no inclination to watch it now.

[Meddling Mike]

Sorry to the Cubs and Phillies fans, maybe next year....

[Smmenen]

I'm going to call this world series:

Rockes versus the winner of the Indians/ Yankees. 

Pretty obvious though.

[Imsomniac101]

I don't really understand how it's called the World Series. Only two countries play baseball, US and Japan. Please enlighten me

[MadManiac21]

I'm going to call this world series:

Rockes versus the winner of the Indians/ Yankees. 

Pretty obvious though.

"Pretty Obvious"? I mean the Sox dismantled the Angels, absolutely destroy them. They held the tiebreaker against Cleveland, and get the ALCS homefield advantage.

Anyone and everyone who can't see the writing on the wall that they JUST have the best team is r etarded.

Whoever comes out of the A.L. will win it, and that's most likely to be the Sox. I feel that the Rockies run will stop against Arizona.

P.S. editing re tarded to stupid? Lame.

[Meddling Mike]

I'm going to call this world series:

Rockes versus the winner of the Indians/ Yankees. 

Pretty obvious though.

"Pretty Obvious"? I mean the Sox dismantled the Angels, absolutely destroy them. They held the tiebreaker against Cleveland, and get the ALCS homefield advantage.

Anyone and everyone who can't see the writing on the wall that they JUST have the best team is r etarded.

Whoever comes out of the A.L. will win it, and that's most likely to be the Sox. I feel that the Rockies run will stop against Arizona.

P.S. editing re tarded to stupid? Lame.

Mad has an excellent point. Winner of the Cleveland/Yankee series? For Serious? The Yankees might have a shot if they actually manage to come back from their current deficit and ride their momentum into the ALCS, but even then they'll be facing a fully rested Red Sox rotation and they'll be coming off an exhausting 5 game, throw everything including the kitchen sink, series against the Indians to get to the ALCS. If the series goes to 5 games the Indians best pitchers, Sabathia and Carmona, probably won't manage to make more than one start each, that's a huge advantage for the Red Sox. It also seems pretty clear to me that the Red Sox have slumped in the second half due to their exceptional lead at the all star break, the post season seems to have reinvigorated them as Beckett and Schilling both pitched better games in the ALDS than I have seen from them in quite some time during the regular season. The big bats of Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz seem to have woken up. Ortiz was 5 for 7 in the Angels series with 6 walks and 2 Home Runs, Manny's only 3 for 8, but hit two home runs, has 4 RBI's and 5 walks. Don't let the second half slump fool you, this team is ready to play.

For the NL, I gotta love the momentum the Rockies have going for them, but you gotta wonder when the magic is going to dry up for them and when they'll go back to being...well....the Rockies.

I don't really understand how it's called the World Series. Only two countries play baseball, US and Japan. Please enlighten me

Well, when the time the World Series was formed, America was the only country actively playing baseball, so it was safe to assume that the winner was the World Champions, I guess the creators weren't really thinking big picture at the time, but probably a good idea not to change the name of the fall classic, World series has a nice ring to it and the name recognition is nice. Nobody really consults NFL Europe before the Super Bowl winner is crowned the "World Champions" and the same could be said for the winner of the NBA Finals being declared the "World Champions". I guess deep down it really says alot about America's egocentric nature that all of the champions from their native leagues are called "world champions".

Some relevant info from Wikipedia:

The title of this championship may be confusing to some readers from countries where baseball is not a major sport (or even where it is), because the "World" Series is confined to the champions of two baseball leagues that currently operate only in the United States and Canada.

The explanation is that when the term "World's Championship Series" was first used in the 1880s, baseball at a highly-skilled level was almost exclusively confined to North America, especially the United States. Thus it was understood that the winner of the major league championship was the best baseball team in the world. The title of this event was soon shortened to "World's Series" and later to "World Series".

The United States continued to be the only professional baseball country until some decades into the 20th Century. The first Japanese professional baseball efforts began in 1920. The current Japanese leagues date from the late 1940s. Various Latin American leagues also formed around that time.

By the 1990s, baseball was played at a highly skilled level in many countries, resulting in a strong international flavor to the Series, as many of the best players from the Pacific Rim, Latin America, the Caribbean, and elsewhere now play on Major League rosters. The notable exception is Cuban nationals, due to the political situation between the USA and Cuba (despite that barrier, over the years a number of Cuba's finest ballplayers have defected to the United States to play in the American professional leagues). Players from the Japanese Leagues also have a more difficult time coming to the Major Leagues because they must first play 10 years in Japan before becoming free agents. Reaching the high-income Major Leagues tends to be the goal of many of the best players around the world.

Early in 2006, Major League Baseball conducted the inaugural World Baseball Classic, to establish a "true" world's championship in the way the term is normally used for other international sports. Teams of professional players from 16 nations participated, and Japan won the first World Baseball Classic championship. Olympic baseball was instituted as a medal sport in 1992, but in 2005 the International Olympic Committee voted to eliminate baseball, and it will be off the Olympic program in 2012.

The World Series itself retains a US-oriented atmosphere. The title of the event is often presented on television as merely a "brand name" in the same sense as the "Super Bowl", and thus the term "World Series Championship" is sometimes used. However, the origin of the term lives on, as with these words of Frank Thomas in the Chicago White Sox victory celebration in 2005: "We're world's champions, baby!" At the close of the 2006 Series, Commissioner Bud Selig pronounced the St. Louis Cardinals "champions of the world". Likewise, the cover of Sports Illustrated magazine for November 6, 2006, features Series MVP David Eckstein and is subtitled "World Champions".

A recent myth has arisen that the "World" in "World Series" came about because the New York World newspaper sponsored it. There is no evidence at all supporting that hypothesis.[3]The annual publication called the World Almanac was originally published by the New York World. Its ambiguous title and U.S.-centric content may have inspired the World Series myth, either facetiously or naively.

If you're looking for a more "world" inclusive championship you might want to try the World Baseball Classic or WBC. Information can be found here: http://ww2.worldbaseballclassic.com/2006/index.jsp it's worth noting that rather than just "US and Japan" 16 different countries participated in the first playing of the WBC in 2006 and South Korea, The Dominican Republic and Cuba all advanced further in the tournament than the United States. Japan/Red Sox Pitcher Daisuke Matsuzaka was the WBC MVP in their victory over Cuba in the finals.

[MadManiac21]

Yanks lost.

YIPEE!

[Meddling Mike]

ALCS/NLCS is set:

Red Sox v. Indians

Rockies v. D-Backs

Any Predictions? I'm going with Red Sox in 6 in the ALCS and Red Sox in 5 in the World Series. The NLCS is really a toss up, but I'll go with the Rockies in 7.

[Smmenen]

I predict an Indians v. Rockies World Series. 

The Red Sox are good, but they showed some serious weaknesses in the second half of the season.  I mean, almost losing your like 10 game lead on the Yankees is one of the most awesome failures in modern sports.   

A truth that has been forgotten somewhat this season is that AL central is the strongest division in baseball.   The Indians play scratch and claw baseball and I just can't foresee them losing to the Red Sox barring a streak of luck (aka midges).  They have the strongest 1-2 punch in terms of starting lineup.  The Indians remind me of the Tigers last year.   The BoSox won't stand in their way.   

The Rockies are too hot to tame.   If they maintain their win streak going into the World Series, I wouldn't bet $10 against them. 

[Meddling Mike]

I predict an Indians v. Rockies World Series. 

hopefully this prediction will come to about as much fruition as your first prediction in this thread:

The Tigers are poised to walk into the World Series once again this year.

The Red Sox are good, but they showed some serious weaknesses in the second half of the season.  I mean, almost losing your like 10 game lead on the Yankees is one of the most awesome failures in modern sports.

Have you been watching baseball this year? The Red Sox's lead against the Yankees dwindling is nothing compared to what happened to the Mets down the stretch. The Brewers are another great example of a collapse that dwarfs the sox second half slump. Letting a huge lead dwindle down isn't anything to be proud of, but I don't think it even makes the top 5 when it comes to MLB collapses this year, much less "one of the most awesome failures in modern sports."

The Red Sox did cool off in the second half (.609 in the first half to .573 in the second half) but the dwindling lead has more to do with the way the Yankees played in the second half. They played an astounding .671 in the second half to win the wild card. Just as a point of comparison, the Tigers went .474 in the second half and the Angels went .554. I still believe this drop off was more due to the complacency of such a large lead coupled with prioritizing the resting of key players and pitchers to prepare for the post season rather than any real "weaknesses"

A truth that has been forgotten somewhat this season is that AL central is the strongest division in baseball.

So what is this "truth" based on? The Wild card didn't come from the central this year. The average record of an AL Central team was actually .499, worse than the AL East at .504 and worse than the AL West  .514

Speaking of how good the AL Central is, have a look at this:

http://oldrichpeople.com/royals.html

Although in all fairness, this is just as applicable to the Tampa Bay Devils Rays or Pittsburgh Pirates...

[MadManiac21]

The Red Sox are good, but they showed some serious weaknesses in the second half of the season.  I mean, almost losing your like 10 game lead on the Yankees is one of the most awesome failures in modern sports.   
 

The Red Sox showed weakness? Their second half record was still amazing, the Yanks had a run of a lifetime. They didn't "almost lose" it; the Yankees "almost" won it. There is a very big difference.

A truth that has been forgotten somewhat this season is that AL central is the strongest division in baseball.   The Indians play scratch and claw baseball and I just can't foresee them losing to the Red Sox barring a streak of luck (aka midges).  They have the strongest 1-2 punch in terms of starting lineup.  The Indians remind me of the Tigers last year.   The BoSox won't stand in their way.   

Now I know you simply know nothing about sports. The AL East is clearly the strongest division - and has been - for about the past 5-10 years. It has - in recent history - the two best teams in the Sox and Yanks. For both teams to perennially push 100 win seasons (leaving one as a wild card with that many wins!) is unheard of.

Scratch and claw baseball? The Sox had an 80% steal success rate this year - far and away the best in the league. What's made them so dangerous (and is repeatedly preached by all the analysts) is that unlike past Sox teams this one does not just rely on their big hitting 3-4 slots.

I'm going to assume by "1-2" punch in starting lineup you mean rotation. You'd be wrong again; Beckett and Schilling (who WILL be the #2 starter in this series most likely) are just better in crunch time. Schilling has the best post-season stats in the game, and Beckett has an absurd scoreless inning streak going. Did you see Sabathia's performance? He was terrible, the Yanks just failed to capitalize on the opportunities he gave them. 6 walks in 4 innings? If he does that against the Sox they'll score 10 runs.

The Sox also have homefield advantage, which is huge (Green Monster) when comparing batting lineups.

Stop hating on the Sox just because you're jealous of NE when it comes to all the magic tournies we have.

[Smmenen]

OK, you big Sox fans, let's just put it this way.   When the Red Sox lose, I *will* rub it in.   And there will be no excuses.

[Meddling Mike]

OK, you big Sox fans, let's just put it this way.   When the Red Sox lose, I *will* rub it in.   And there will be no excuses.

Even if that does happen it'll sound pretty hollow from a self proclaimed Tigers fan, sort of hard to gloat when your own team doesn't make the playoffs. That said, I will gladly admit defeat and accept digs from those on record as Cleveland, D-Backs or Rockies should their respective teams beat my Red Sox.

Can't change horses midstream Steve...

[Smmenen]

I'm NOT an Indians fan.  Do not mistake my prediction that the Indians will win the ALCS for the assumption that I'm rooting for the Indians.

At a personal level, I could give two tugs of a dead dog's cock if the Indians win or not.   My assessment of the playoff race at this point comes from my very close observations this year.   I looked at the standings practically every day this entire season and read almost every baseball article I came accross on major websites.

Each team has weaknesses, but I think the Indians weaknesses are less relevant.    It was pretty easy to see that the Angels were the weakest of the four contenders in the AL playoffs, but I believe, honestly, that the Yankees or the Indians would have beaten the Red Sox.   I mean, look at what the Yankees did to the Red Sox in their final series.   

As I said, I predict a Rockies v. Indians World Series.  It's very hard for to predict who will win because the NL is such an engima to me.   It's basically my belief that the AL is the superior league with a much higher threshold cut off for quality versus INSANE momentum.   That's why I said that if the Rockies sweep the NLCS, I wouldn't bet on the Indians.   

If it matters, I almost always agree with the ESPN power rankings: http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/powerranking

And at the end of the season, they had the Indians ranked first.  The rankings pretty clearly predicted exactly what's occurred so far.  BoSox beat the angels, Rockies beat the Phillies, Diamondbacks creamed the Cubs, and now the Indians beat the Yankees.   Predicted down the line according to the end of season rankings.  I think that that will continue all the way til the end with the exception of maybe the Rockies beating the Indians at the end of the race.   

[Clown of Tresserhorn]

Man, what a wild ride the Rockies have been on!!! As a Coloradan, I gotta root for the Rockies, but the AL is just dominating. Francis and Jiminez have been pitching outstanding as of late, and our bullpen has done it's job. The combination of Herges/Fuentes/Corpas is about as good a set-up/closer as I've seen in awhile.

LET'S GO ROCKIES!!!

[Meddling Mike]

I'm NOT an Indians fan.  Do not mistake my prediction that the Indians will win the ALCS for the assumption that I'm rooting for the Indians.

Never said you were an Indians fan at any point, quite the opposite. Rather, I was more pointing out that traditional rights for gloating/rubbing it in over the vanquished is given to:
1. The fans of the victor. (This is directly proportional to the event won, victory does not necessarily have to be head to head, See Philadelphia Phillies > NY Mets for details)
2. The vanquished clubs hated rivals. (This is directly proportional to the aforementioned hatred, cannot be league contrived "rivalries" like Red Sox-Braves where no actual malice exists or a personally created rivalry i. e. a fan living in the territory of another large market team who has a distaste for the local fan base, the more rivals you consider your team to have, the more diluted each rivalry becomes) 
3. Fans of clubs that advanced further into the post season. (There is a cutoff here, at some point the disparity grows so large that gloating is replaced by pity, this is reserved for teams with virtually no chance due to payroll and has no fan base willing to show itself in public, see Tampa Bay Devil Rays for details, or a season ending injury to the star player on a one man team, see Greg Oden and Portland Trailblazers for details)

As a Tigers fan you may not be used to gloating as I realize the Tigers didn't have a winning season from 1994-2005, I believe you'll find these rules provide an excellent basis for determining when rubbing it in is or is not warranted/permissable.

[kirdape3]

Carmona's actually the scariest Indians pitcher.  That sinker if it stays down is literally impossible to do anything with; 95 and in the dirt?  Are you for reals? :/  Sabathia has some potential control issues but is also a big, strong power guy that can just get a 96+ fastball by anyone.  Ask Posada how much fun it was to get blown out.

While I think that the Red Sox actually don't have the pitching to hang with either of those two (Beckett's extraordinarily good but Dice-K's weaker than Carmona by a mile), they might be able to get there if they manage to beat one of them exactly once.  The Indians will want to run Westbrook or Byrd out there at least once and I wouldn't bet anything on their ability to defeat the Red Sox's lineup.

[Lou]

I see a Boston vs. Colorado World Series, with Boston winning another one.

I think the Rockies are too hot, and the Diamondbacks too horrible, for that one to go any other way. Arizona is a young team that has gotten a lot of good breaks and has gotten very lucky, but I don't see that luck holding up against a team that has been on an incredible tear. (obviously by these statements I'm a Cubs fan)

The Red Sox are fucking dominating right now. Beckett showed us in game one against the Angels why he is the best pitcher in baseball this year. And with Manny killing it, I don't think the Indians will be able to keep up. I think he will be the difference maker in the Indians series.

On a somewhat related note, Mark Cuban has again shown his interest in buying the Cubs, and I for one think this would be wonderful. From the playoffs this year, spending money is obviously not a necessity to go deep into the playoffs (deep being one round). But I do believe it is necessary to spend money to be a consistently good team. This is something the Cubs have not been since I, nor pretty much anyone else, have been alive.

[Bubbydan]

Wow....I just found this thread and you guys are so great on your predictions...

 Ok, So me being a Red Sox Fan I am going to have to go with the Sox in seven against the Indians, and the Rockies in Five To make the Series Sox v Rockies with the Sox coming out on top.

  When you compare the Sox pitching to the Indians I think the edge goes to the Sox. Beckett V Sabathia. I will take Beckett any day, let alone the fact that Sabathia is a lefty pitching in Fenway to start out the Series. Not Very promising. There are few lefties that pictch as well in Fenway park as they do elsewhere. The edge will go to the Sox there. Than you have Carmona and Schilling. You cant take away from Schilling history in the playoffs, but at this time I think Carmona is a better pitcher at this time....than again the last time he pitched at fenway park he was blowing saves. I will still give the edge to Carmona.

  Than the next two games will be owned by the Sox bats. They know how to hit these pitchers.
  And you cant discount the fact that the Red Sox also have much more Playoff Experience than these Indians. Thats Why I think Epstien chose a lot of these players. They just know how to win when its on the line. They might not know how to win when they have a 10 + game leads but almost all of there starters have shown themselves in playoffs in the past...the only one who hasn't is Daisuke, and he was picked up for his performanc ein the world baseball classic. Just watch.

Dan

[MadManiac21]

Does anyone remember that absurd projection that the stupid Sox fan made earlier in the thread?

Did you see Sabathia's performance? He was terrible, the Yanks just failed to capitalize on the opportunities he gave them. 6 walks in 4 innings? If he does that against the Sox they'll score 10 runs.

I obviously was way off Steve.

Also, tonight's lotto numbers are 4-17-32-8 if anyone wants to put my prediction skills to good use.

[Vegeta2711]

So how bout those Indians?

[MadManiac21]

Indians didn't "win" their first game. Francona handed them game 2 by bringing in Gagne.

As for for beating DiceK, the Indians pitcher did a great job of getting out of jams I'll give him that. To come away with bases loaded and men on 2nd and 3rd and twice without giving up any runs is why we lost. DiceK always gives up 4, that's to be expected.

I still feel that talent wise the Sox are far and away better. And after seeing our comeback against the yanks in 04 - a MUCH better team than these Indians - I'm not worried in the slightest.