RBW painter control

[vroman]

People still ask me what Im playing even though I dont drive to tournaments anymore. so heres what Ive been working on lately. Im excited about this list bc its the first nonblue deck Ive found that actually has consistent game vs Gat.

4 bloodmire
4 badland
2 p delta
1 scrubland
1 plateau
1 mtn
1 swamp
3 mox RBW
1 b lotus
1 petal
4 red spirit guide
4 Dconf
4 painter
4 plowshare
4 thoughtseize
4 faeire macabre
8 redblast
3 hideseek
1 dtutor
1 vtutor
1 dconsultation
1 grindstone
1 yawgwill
1 balance
side
4 mog fanatic
3 v heretic
3 slaughter pact
2 mag moon
2 extirpate

bazaar version:
-2 macabre
-2 spirit guide
-1 mtn
-3 hide/seek
+4 bazaar
+4 squee
side
-2 magmoon
-1 fanatic
-1 heretic
-1 pact
+3 hide/seek
+2 extirpate

Im highly satisfied w the performance so far. I will post detailed matchup results soon

[rkmancer]

Im highly satisfied w the performance so far. I will post detailed matchup results soon

I'm waiting 
Because in my opinion, controlling with only 1 Grindstone as winning condition will be a hard time. .
We can't depend on Bob / Servant / SSG / Macabre as a beater anyway. .

-EDIT-

Owh yeah additional question just come in my mind. .
Since Painter's deck is everywhere this day, what's your plan against mirror?
Especially 'gush' and 'workshop' based type. .

[Smmenen]

People still ask me what Im playing even though I dont drive to tournaments anymore. so heres what Ive been working on lately. Im excited about this list bc its the first nonblue deck Ive found that actually has consistent game vs Gat.

You didn't have to go that far to find a non blue deck that beats GAT.

Both Rich Shay and I found that MUD has roughly a 90-10 matchup over GAT.   

[Tobi]

I actually saw Serge Metz play a similar build at the big tournament in Annecy last weekend. He used Bazaars as draw engine, but I only saw a few of his cards and not the whole list. I will try to find out.

[Outlaw]

As Steve said, its quite easy to find a list that easily beats gat.  GAT isn't the most played deck anymore, it seems that Oath has risen to that, so why play to beat a less popular deck?  Having 1 grindstone and such few ways to find it would undoubtedly make this a less consistent deck than just playing a list that was more focused on what it wants.  a RBW painters deck would have to take advantage of some other form of draw that only fits in the shell.  I believe this would lose to the painter mirror in a heartbeat because of lack of draw whereas the Gush lists will just overwhelm you with card quality.

[demonic effect]

I realize that strip effects have dramatically decreased in the format.  However, having only two white duals, a mox, petal, and lotus to find white, do you ever have problems finding the right combination of mana?  5 mana sources to play 8 cards in the deck seems to be a little low considering that 2 of those sources can only be used once.  This tends not to be as big of a deal when those cards have tremendous effects like dt, yawgwill, etc... but for specified hate like stp or hide//seek that seem to have relatively small effects does it seem worth it?  What has your testing shown?  (I realize that STP and Hide//seek can be powerful hate cards in the format right now given the right situations, I am just wondering about how they have tested as part of the main rather than sb?  Like what effect have they had on the deck?)

[RJ]

4 bloodmire
4 badland
2 p delta
1 scrubland
1 plateau
1 mtn
1 swamp
3 mox RBW
1 b lotus
1 petal
4 red spirit guide
4 Dconf
4 painter
4 plowshare
4 thoughtseize
4 faeire macabre
8 redblast
3 hideseek
1 dtutor
1 vtutor
1 dconsultation
1 grindstone
1 yawgwill
1 balance

Personally, I think that the deck is a brilliant alternative to other Painter's lists.  It is very reminiscent of Cullen Cox's Hide/Seek control list shown here.
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=22106

The question of the white sources is a valid one but I don't think the mana is that bad.  The list above should have game against everybody and with solid play you shouldn't get blown out of too many games. 

It seems that the sheer number of efficient answers should allow you to control the board in a strange way in the mirror.  They will draw more cards (if you don't resolve Confidant), but you have answer density.  Consider if your opponent resolves painter, you have 16 ways to deal with it (17 if you count resolving your grindstone and winning which is not likely). 

I'm very interested to hear vroman's results.  I think that they will be surprising. 

[Lou]

I realize that strip effects have dramatically decreased in the format.  However, having only two white duals, a mox, petal, and lotus to find white, do you ever have problems finding the right combination of mana?  5 mana sources to play 8 cards in the deck seems to be a little low considering that 2 of those sources can only be used once.

You are missing his six fetchlands that also get those sources. That makes your perceived five an actual 11.

[Tobi]

Here is the list that Serge Metz piloted to a 5-3-0 at the 200 ppl tournament in Annecy:

Painter’s Bazaar 60

// Lands 21
1 Swamp
4 Badlands
1 Bayou
1 Taiga
1 Plateau
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Riftstone Portal
4 Bazaar of Baghdad
3 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine

// Creatures 13
4 Painter’s Servant
4 Dark Confidant
4 Squee, Goblin Nabob
1 Gorilla Shaman

// Artifacts Spells 8
1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Ruby
3 Grindstone

// Black Spells 9
4 Duress
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor

// Red Spells 8
3 Ancient Grudge
2 Pyroblast
2 Red Elemental Blast

// Green Spells 1
1 Crop Rotation


// Sideboard 15
SB: 3 Extirpate
SB: 2 Pyroblast
SB: 1 Red Elemental Blast
SB: 1 Gorilla Shaman
SB: 3 Shattering Spree
SB: 1 Mountain
SB: 3 Ray of Revelation
SB: 1 Darkblast

[Liiva]

That Painter Bazaar list looks pretty interesting.

The mox monkey/ancient grudges are there mainly to combat shop decks I guess? Hardly anyone plays shops in my meta but Oath was all over the place, so i might swap the grudges with rays of revelation or just additional red blasts. Also you kinda need a leyline in play or a red blast ready when you mill the oath player, else he'll use his krosan reclamation to get will back and mill you back with brain freeze.

I was wondering how you would play the mirror (vs blue-based painter that is), you obviously have some advantages without a painter in play. You could board out the painters since you're probably only helping them with one of your own in play and leave the grindstones in.

In goldfishing I sometimes had hands like this: squee, duress, badlands, mire, leyline, black lotus, ancient grudge. These kind of hands mean you're pretty much in top-deck mode from the start, hoping you'll draw a bazaar or confidant.. so should i mulligan or just pray for the best?

Maybe Serge Metz himself (is he on TMD?) can give some comments on the deck and how his day went in Annecy, what his wins/loses were against and if he made some changes to the deck.

/Liiva

[The Atog Lord]

Vroman, your decklists are always really awesome, but your formatting could use a bit of work.

So, to save everyone a bit of time, here are the lists (with a 15th sideboard card added):

    1 Balance
    4 Pyroblast
    3 Hide/Seek
    1 Demonic Tutor
    1 Vampiric Tutor
    1 Demonic Consultation
    1 Grindstone
    1 Yawgmoth's Will
    4 Red Elemental Blast
    4 Painter's Servant
    4 Faerie Macabre
    4 Bloodstained Mire
    1 Mox Jet
    4 Badlands
    2 Polluted Delta
    1 Scrubland
    1 Plateau
    1 Mountain
    1 Swamp
    4 Thoughtseize
    1 Mox Pearl
    1 Mox Ruby
    1 Black Lotus
    1 Lotus Petal
    4 Simian Spirit Guide
    4 Dark Confidant
    4 Swords to Plowshares

// Sideboard:
SB: 4 Mogg Fanatic
SB: 3 Viashino Heretic
SB: 3 Slaughter Pact
SB: 2 Extirpate
SB: 3 Magus of the Moon

Bazaar Build:

    4 Bloodstained Mire
    4 Badlands
    2 Polluted Delta
    1 Scrubland
    1 Plateau
    1 Swamp
    4 Painter's Servant
    2 Faerie Macabre
    2 Simian Spirit Guide
    4 Dark Confidant
    1 Balance
    4 Pyroblast
    1 Demonic Tutor
    1 Vampiric Tutor
    1 Demonic Consultation
    1 Grindstone
    1 Yawgmoth's Will
    4 Red Elemental Blast
    1 Mox Jet
    4 Thoughtseize
    1 Mox Pearl
    1 Mox Ruby
    1 Black Lotus
    1 Lotus Petal
    4 Swords to Plowshares
    4 Squee, Goblin Nabob
    4 Bazaar of Baghdad

// Sideboard:
SB: 3 Mogg Fanatic
SB: 2 Viashino Heretic
SB: 2 Slaughter Pact
SB: 4 Extirpate
SB: 1 Magus of the Moon
SB: 3 Hide/Seek