Fairly noob vintage player seeking aid!

[sarevok459]

Hey all, before I show you what I've created I should probably give you some idea of what I'm aiming to do.

I play in a casual environment among friends almost every weekend using the vintage rules(Banned/Restricted, etc).  Once in a while we go to local card shops and mingle with the crowds there as well.

However, as time has passed, my friend(s) have developed their decks more and more into very strong machines that I simply cannot contend with anymore.  Their decks don't contain any Power 9, but hold just about everything else (Drains, Library, FoW etc.).

Now, I realize that the reanimator decks probably aren't Tier 1, and could only hope to be with Power, but I'm still trying to make this thing work.  I really need suggestions on how I can improve this deck...even if you think it should be completely reworked...

I'm willing to put a bit of money into it, so long as it doesn't contain Power 9 (I am considering bazaars).

Here's what I have right now:

Creature base:

4 x Akroma, Angel of Wrath
4 x Angel of Despair
1x Razia, Boros Archangel

Spell base:

4 x cabal therapy
4 x dark ritual
1 x demonic tutor
4 x duress
1 x entomb
4 x exhume
4 x reanimate
4 x shallow grave
4 x swords to plowshares
1 x vampiric tutor

Land base:

4 x Bazaar of Baghdad
3 x caves of koilos
4 x godless shrine
4 x scrubland
5 x swamp

I realize that this deck idea is not original by any means, but I've attempted to add an angel theme to it.  However, if you feel this hinders the deck in its win % then please suggest anything.

Thanks in advance. 

[dopamine]

I would most definitely suggest the investment in Bazaars as: 1, they're a decent investment, 2, they'll make a reanimator strategy far more consistent and powerful, and 3, if you ever felt like playing competitive Vintage, you'd have really the most cost-prohibitive part of Ichorid already.

[sarevok459]

I would most definitely suggest the investment in Bazaars as: 1, they're a decent investment, 2, they'll make a reanimator strategy far more consistent and powerful, and 3, if you ever felt like playing competitive Vintage, you'd have really the most cost-prohibitive part of Ichorid already.

I've had an online friend of mine suggest Ichorid instead, mostly because he doesn't like Reanimator...

How much do you think a standard ichorid deck would run?

[dopamine]

Also, if you'd like to make your deck more consistent, I'd also recommend cutting painlands and adding in Fetchlands, as well as cutting white for blue - cards like careful study and so on will help get cards into your graveyard more quickly, and you probably won't even miss being able to hardcast your reanimators (although it'll leave you a bit more vulnerable). Adding blue will also give you the option of protecting your combo with FoW and Misdirection.

[sarevok459]

Also, if you'd like to make your deck more consistent, I'd also recommend cutting painlands and adding in Fetchlands, as well as cutting white for blue - cards like careful study and so on will help get cards into your graveyard more quickly, and you probably won't even miss being able to hardcast your reanimators (although it'll leave you a bit more vulnerable). Adding blue will also give you the option of protecting your combo with FoW and Misdirection.

Do you have a suggested setup of that?  (I assume it would be removal of the Duress/Therapies in exchange for those?

[dopamine]

Here is the deck that Chris Nighbor ran at the Vintage Championships 2008:

Chris Nighbor
2008 Vintage Championship Top 8
   View a sample hand of this deck

Main Deck

60 cards
4  Bazaar of Baghdad
4  City of Brass
3  Petrified Field
11 lands


1  Angel of Despair
1  Cephalid Sage
1  Flame-Kin Zealot
4  Golgari Grave-Troll
2  Golgari Thug
4  Ichorid
4  Narcomoeba
4  Stinkweed Imp
21 creatures    4  Bridge from Below
4  Cabal Therapy
4  Chalice of the Void
2  Darkblast
3  Dread Return
4  Leyline of the Void
4  Serum Powder
3  Unmask
28 other spells
   

Sideboard

4  Chain of Vapor
3  Contagion
3  Gemstone Mine
1  Pithing Needle
4  Wispmare
15 sideboard cards

As you can see, most of the cards in the deck are similar to extended Dredge, so your deck can do double duty - the only other cards I can see that cost any substantial amount at all are 1 Pithing Needle, 3 Gemstone Mine, 4 Leylines, 4 Chalice of the Void, and 4 Cabal Therapies (but you already have that covered). However, the deck is fairly susceptible to hate. If you want to build a competitive Vintage deck with minimal or no Power, however, your choices are basically this deck and Fish.

[sarevok459]

Here is the deck that Chris Nighbor ran at the Vintage Championships 2008:

Chris Nighbor
2008 Vintage Championship Top 8
   View a sample hand of this deck

Main Deck

60 cards
4  Bazaar of Baghdad
4  City of Brass
3  Petrified Field
11 lands


1  Angel of Despair
1  Cephalid Sage
1  Flame-Kin Zealot
4  Golgari Grave-Troll
2  Golgari Thug
4  Ichorid
4  Narcomoeba
4  Stinkweed Imp
21 creatures    4  Bridge from Below
4  Cabal Therapy
4  Chalice of the Void
2  Darkblast
3  Dread Return
4  Leyline of the Void
4  Serum Powder
3  Unmask
28 other spells
   

Sideboard

4  Chain of Vapor
3  Contagion
3  Gemstone Mine
1  Pithing Needle
4  Wispmare
15 sideboard cards

As you can see, most of the cards in the deck are similar to extended Dredge, so your deck can do double duty - the only other cards I can see that cost any substantial amount at all are 1 Pithing Needle, 3 Gemstone Mine, 4 Leylines, 4 Chalice of the Void, and 4 Cabal Therapies (but you already have that covered). However, the deck is fairly susceptible to hate. If you want to build a competitive Vintage deck with minimal or no Power, however, your choices are basically this deck and Fish.

Hey thanks a lot for your suggestions, I'll give this some practice over apprentice and see how it fairs! 

[Dante]

You also might consider browsing our Legacy forums, particularly the proven decks forum.  That will give you a baseline of strong decks that fit your profile (all cards except for power/restricted vintage cards).

[dopamine]

I'm fairly new to Vintage myself, so I'm a bit shakier on the addition of those sorts of things. (I'd also suggest Hellkite Overlord, by the way, it's the new 8/8 hasted flying trampling nonlegendary dragon )

Here's what I would do off the top of my head, keeping in mind that a casual meta like yours needs more answers to various things. Keep in mind that I did this in about 5 minutes, so it's not anywhere near perfect. Also, there might be some problems getting enough blue to support FoW.

Creatures: 6
3 x Akroma, Angel of Wrath
3 x Hellkite Overlord

Spell base: 33

4 x duress/thoughtseize (your choice)
4 x dark ritual
3 x careful study
4 x strategic planning (these are absurdly expensive right now, around $100 each unfortunately, but they're a synergistic draw spell that puts stuff in your graveyard)
1 x demonic tutor
1 x entomb
3 x exhume
4 x reanimate
1 x vampiric tutor
4 x serum powder
4 x Force of Will

Land base: 21

4 x Bazaar of Baghdad
4 x Polluted Delta
4 x Flooded Strand
4 x Underground Sea
3 x Watery Grave
1 x Swamp
1 x Island

Other cards to consider for casual fun:
Hymn to Tourach

[sarevok459]

I can't find a hellkite overlord listed anywhere.

[zeus-online]

You could go with dragon/ichorid ofcourse, but if you want to keep playing reanimate, i'd suggest adding Sundering titan(s)

Unmask could also be a usefull card.

...And i think you should look for some card draw, dark confidant is always an option, but you could also splash blue for cards like careful study.

Just my 2cents.

/Zeus

[sarevok459]

You could go with dragon/ichorid ofcourse, but if you want to keep playing reanimate, i'd suggest adding Sundering titan(s)

Unmask could also be a usefull card.

...And i think you should look for some card draw, dark confidant is always an option, but you could also splash blue for cards like careful study.

Just my 2cents.

/Zeus

How important do you think bazaars are in reanimate?

[sarevok459]

I'm fairly new to Vintage myself, so I'm a bit shakier on the addition of those sorts of things. (I'd also suggest Hellkite Overlord, by the way, it's the new 8/8 hasted flying trampling nonlegendary dragon )

Here's what I would do off the top of my head, keeping in mind that a casual meta like yours needs more answers to various things. Keep in mind that I did this in about 5 minutes, so it's not anywhere near perfect. Also, there might be some problems getting enough blue to support FoW.

Creatures: 6
3 x Akroma, Angel of Wrath
3 x Hellkite Overlord

Spell base: 33

4 x duress/thoughtseize (your choice)
4 x dark ritual
3 x careful study
4 x strategic planning (these are absurdly expensive right now, around $100 each unfortunately, but they're a synergistic draw spell that puts stuff in your graveyard)
1 x demonic tutor
1 x entomb
3 x exhume
4 x reanimate
1 x vampiric tutor
4 x serum powder
4 x Force of Will

Land base: 21

4 x Bazaar of Baghdad
4 x Polluted Delta
4 x Flooded Strand
4 x Underground Sea
3 x Watery Grave
1 x Swamp
1 x Island

Other cards to consider for casual fun:
Hymn to Tourach

After some research, and a lucky find on Ebay, I finally found the Hellkite Overlords you mentioned...pricy right now (assuming due to the rarity of them) but wow, amazing for reanimator.