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Author Topic: [Free Article] So Many Insane Plays -- The Parfait Ambush!  (Read 37591 times)
Smmenen
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« on: October 05, 2008, 10:46:46 pm »

http://www.starcitygames.com/php/news/article/16515.html

Editor's Blurb:

Quote
Monday, October 6th - White, Magic’s perennial whipping boy… and Vintage is the format that wields the biggest whip. In metagames past, Vintage players were conditioned to skim the White sweetmeats in their rush to get to the Blue cards. Can Meandeck’s Parfait Ambush deck convince players that White is Right? Read on to find out!

No, this deck is not a joke.   Yes, it is the real deal.   You shouldn't take my word for it though.  You should try it for yourself.   I've put countless hours into this deck.   The printing of Ethersworn Canonist and unrestriction of Mox Diamond has given Parfait the tools to compete.   I won't spoil the rest of the decklist, but you can take a look for yourself Smile

To non-premium peeps, I apologize in advance, but I will not be posting the decklist, so no requests please.  I don't want to have to play against this deck in tournament anyway. Smile

EDIT (since Josh posted my list despite my explicit request not to...:

 10 Plains
  1 Strip Mine
  4 Wasteland

  4 Mox Diamond
  1 Mox Pearl
  1 Mox Emerald
  1 Mox Sapphire
  1 Mox Jet
  1 Black Lotus
  1 Sol Ring

  4 Ethersword Canonist
  4 Aven Mindcensor

  4 Land Tax
  4 Scroll Rack
  4 Aura of Silence
  3 Argivian Find
  3 Swords to Plowshares
  1 Balance
  1 Tormod's Crypt
  1 Zuran Orb
  1 Trinisphere
  2 Orim's Chant
  2 Abeyance
  1 Enlightened Tutor

Sideboard:
2 Pithing Needle
2 Rule of Law
2 Moat
2 Orim's Chant
2 Abeyance
1 Swords to Plowshares
3 Tormod's Crypt
1 Jester's Cap
1 Wheel of Sun and Moon


I'll be happy to answer any questions you may have, although please no basic questions about the deck that can be discovered from a modest amount of testing.   

This deck is super FUN to play, and very good.   

Enjoy!

Stephen Menendian
« Last Edit: January 22, 2009, 02:15:16 pm by Smmenen » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2008, 12:47:44 am »

Maindeck:
 
Artifacts
1 Black Lotus
4 Mox Diamond
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Sapphire
4 Scroll Rack
1 Sol Ring
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Trinisphere
1 Zuran Orb
 
Artifact Creatures
4 Ethersworn Canonist
 
Creatures
4 Aven Mindcensor
 
Enchantments
4 Aura Of Silence
4 Land Tax
 
Instants
2 Abeyance
3 Argivian Find
1 Enlightened Tutor
2 Orim's Chant
3 Swords To Plowshares
 
Sorceries
1 Balance
 
Basic Lands
10 Plains
 
Lands
1 Strip Mine
4 Wasteland
 
Sideboard:
1 Jester's Cap
2 Pithing Needle
3 Tormod's Crypt
2 Moat
2 Rule Of Law
1 Wheel Of Sun And Moon
2 Abeyance
2 Orim's Chant
1 Swords To Plowshares

Yes, it loses to Flame Jab - Lightning Bolt.dec, but I'm sure it'll please the ghost of Raph Caron.
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« Reply #2 on: October 06, 2008, 02:54:40 am »

i have the same complaint two weeks running.

Flagstones of Trokair.
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« Reply #3 on: October 06, 2008, 04:14:31 am »

Why no ruby?

And seriously...parfait? Dosn't it just flat out loose to blue based control decks like always?

Actually i'm pretty sceptical about just about every match-up.

Unfortunetly i don't have to time to comment any further as i have an appointment.... :/

/Zeus

Edit: While both of the canonist and the mindcensor disrupts combo, i can't imagine this deck doing all that well against combo...It seems to me like a stax-ish approach, with less cards to disrupt them with.
Against aggro/control your creatures are just worse, and i'm not entirely sure if 3 plows and 1 balance really does enough there.
I could see the many basics and land tax's as pretty good against shops though.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2008, 07:06:48 am by zeus-online » Logged

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« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2008, 05:26:30 am »

i have the same complaint two weeks running.

Flagstones of Trokair.

Flagstones + Land Tax != Combo.  There aren't even any good nonbasics other than Wastes, why bother with a Flagstones when it's a Tax deck?
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« Reply #5 on: October 06, 2008, 07:40:44 am »

Orim's chant and Abeyance can put a hiccup into combo's plan's too.
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Smmenen
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« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2008, 07:53:54 am »

Yes, it loses to Flame Jab - Lightning Bolt.dec, but I'm sure it'll please the ghost of Raph Caron.

If you have that in your metagame, just play a Mobilization in the mainboard or sb and a Crucible to recur lands for Zorb. 


Edit: While both of the canonist and the mindcensor disrupts combo, i can't imagine this deck doing all that well against combo..

Actually, this deck annihilates combo. you almost can't lose unless they win on turn one.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2008, 09:26:36 am by Smmenen » Logged

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« Reply #7 on: October 06, 2008, 09:53:19 am »

Why do you need to splash black to make crucible worthwhile? It seems like it's so good with all your cards, Mox diamond, wasteland and stripmine, zuran orb etc.

I might be totally missing something (It's known to happen Razz) but could you clarify this?

Thanks : )

If you were to play the ruby, would you drop a plains for it, or something else?
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Smmenen
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« Reply #8 on: October 06, 2008, 10:09:00 am »

If i were to splash a color, it would be black for DT, vamp, and I Seal.   I would play a Swamp or two, but I do not know what I would cut. 

Also: feel free to play a Crucible.   I had in the maindeck for a while, but decided to cut it in the end.  It's very good!  It gives you long term inevitability.  I just found it was win-more. 
« Last Edit: October 06, 2008, 10:27:26 am by Smmenen » Logged

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« Reply #9 on: October 06, 2008, 11:35:29 am »

I used to play Parfait prior to the unrestrictions and splashed black for DT, VP, Duress (awsome) and Confidant. The Canonist does indeed fill a nice slot, but I would still make room for another color in there.

Also, why is there so many Orim and Abeyance in the side, combo is already a favorable matchup, do you really need 4 Chant, 4 Abyance, 4 Canonist and 2 Rule of Law post Side?

I tried Argivian find for a bit and found them very underwhelming, with Canonist now a good target I can see why they are there, but what else is usually brought back?

Aura of Silence is another card I cut due to high casting cost, how fast does this usually comes down VS Stacks, are Spheres a problem to dropping them?

I would definitively cut a Mindsencor for a Crucible in this list just for the Wastelock and sometimes the life gain, even if the Wastelock hurts the Tax engine.

Quote
And seriously...parfait? Dosn't it just flat out loose to blue based control decks like always?

Beside being a pain to play since the match is going to be long, Parfait always has a way to resolve it's "Bombs" and Blue based control usually have a hard time dealing when the Tax Rack is on. Not an easy matchup but very far from unwinnable.


Quote
but I'm sure it'll please the ghost of Raph Caron.

He has been advised about this tread, don't worry, don't know if he has an account here though, but I'm sure he will discuss the deck on our French forum.


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« Reply #10 on: October 06, 2008, 11:37:55 am »

Is it just me does the list run 16 SB cards?

http://www.starcitygames.com/php/news/article/16515.html
Sideboard:
2 Pithing Needle
2 Rule of Law
2 Moat
2 Orim's Chant
2 Abeyance
1 Swords to Plowshares
3 Tormod's Crypt
1 Jester's Cap
1 Wheel of Sun and Moon
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Smmenen
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« Reply #11 on: October 06, 2008, 11:50:42 am »

Is it just me does the list run 16 SB cards?

http://www.starcitygames.com/php/news/article/16515.html
Sideboard:
2 Pithing Needle
2 Rule of Law
2 Moat
2 Orim's Chant
2 Abeyance
1 Swords to Plowshares
3 Tormod's Crypt
1 Jester's Cap
1 Wheel of Sun and Moon

Oops.  Yeah, cut one of your choice.  The SB is a sensitive metagame decision. I was merely making suggestions. 
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« Reply #12 on: October 06, 2008, 01:08:00 pm »

I like the list a lot. This is close to what a mono-w Parfait should be like. I goldfished a few hand, since I was suspicious about the mana base. I think the fifth Mox could be played over the fourth Mox Diamond, as the Diamond really needs Land Tax to be good. Lotus Petal could be a potential replacement card as well. Additional Plains are good too, if you can't afford Moxes.

Orim's Chant is the superior card, but I think Abeyance should be a 4-of in this list, considering the number of Moxes.

Crucible of Worlds is mandatory. The synergy with the rest of the deck is just too good.

Props to you, Steve. In your testing, what decks did you lose to?
« Last Edit: October 06, 2008, 01:11:40 pm by Raph Caron » Logged

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« Reply #13 on: October 06, 2008, 03:23:03 pm »

Did you test Runed Halo?  I know you said it was probably too cute, but I think there's a lot of power there.  Or at least True Believer which accomplishes much of the same.  Being able to avoid Tendrils, Mindslaver and Darksteel Colossus seem very powerful (doubles up as Swords to Plowshares there).

Edit: Since Smmenen responded, pulled my edits into their own post to preserve chronology.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2008, 05:40:57 pm by Anusien » Logged

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Smmenen
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« Reply #14 on: October 06, 2008, 05:39:14 pm »

Also, why is there so many Orim and Abeyance in the side, combo is already a favorable matchup, do you really need 4 Chant, 4 Abyance, 4 Canonist and 2 Rule of Law post Side?


Maybe not all of that.

Quote

I tried Argivian find for a bit and found them very underwhelming, with Canonist now a good target I can see why they are there, but what else is usually brought back?


Land Tax, Scroll Rack, Black Lotus, and Aura of Silence are the biggest beyond Canonist. Post-board, Jester's Cap, Rule of Law, Tormod's Crypt.   

Quote

Aura of Silence is another card I cut due to high casting cost, how fast does this usually comes down VS Stacks, are Spheres a problem to dropping them?


Huh? You cut the best card in the deck because, why exactly?   

I didn't discuss this as much as I intended in the article, but this deck often attacks things that are invisible.  By that I mean it interacts at a level that is not immediate or obvious.   For example, Aura of Silence is a direct assault on Yawgmoth's Will.     That may seem counterintuitive, at one level.   After all, what does Aura of Silence have to do with a 3 casting cost Sorcery that allows you to play cards from your graveyard?   Simple: Yawgmoth's Will is a strategic hinge in which all of the stuff preceding it is replayed, many of which are artifacts like Black Lotus or which draw artifacts like Black Lotus or Moxen.   If you have Aura of Silence out, it acts like a Trinisphere for Yawgmoth's Will. 1)  The moxen that make Will so powerful and efficient are costly to play and Will slower.  2) The artifacts that you have sacrificed like Black Lotus or that you have discarded to Thirst or what not cannot be replayed efficiently within a Will turn.  3) The artifacts you draw off draw spells in a Will turn cannot be efficiently played.

By cutting off Will as an efficient route to victory, you actually channel your opponent into strategic and tactical paths that are advantageous too you, but they will calculate as proper for them.  For instance, if Will is cut off, they might go for TInker --> DSC.  If they do, they will get crushed by Plows.   

Not to mention this list of cards:

Oath of Druids
Painter's Servant
Time Vault

What do those three cards have in common?   They are all destroyed by Aura of Silence.   

Finally, Aura of Silence interacts with the mana denial elements in critical ways.  Canonist makes artifacts the only cards that can be played more than once per turn.  Well, how does Aura of Silence interact with that?  It makes Canonist worse than Rule of Law for your opponent.   

But, to my broader point, this deck attacks things you can't see: Mindcensor, Canonist, and Aura of Silence are all examples of this. 

Test: do you undestand why Mindcensor and Wasteland are synergistic? 


Did you test Runed Halo?  I know you said it was probably too cute, but I think there's a lot of power there.  Or at least True Believer which accomplishes much of the same.  Being able to avoid Tendrils, Mindslaver and Darksteel Colossus seem very powerful (doubles up as Swords to Plowshares there).

Edit: oh wow, you don't have Goblin Charbelcher.  What happens if the opponent plays blockers and your 2/2s can't get in anymore?  Seems like STPs from Fish or Gempalm Incinerators, or worse yet Bombermen is a real problem for the deck.

The decklist I provided was primarily illustrative, in the sense that it can be tweaked or modified to suit almost any threat you might face.   Notice that I have Moats in the sideboard for creature matchups.   Also, I have never lost a match to Fish with this deck, so I am not sure how relevant that is.   

If you are in an environment with lots of Oath decks, I would consider adding maindeck Seal of Cleansings, ala old Parfait. 

If you are in a more aggro oriented field, you should play even more anti-aggro cards.   

Maindeck weaknesses are shored up by sideboard cards. 

As I said in the article, I tested Runed Halo: too narrow. 

I like the list a lot. This is close to what a mono-w Parfait should be like. I goldfished a few hand, since I was suspicious about the mana base. I think the fifth Mox could be played over the fourth Mox Diamond, as the Diamond really needs Land Tax to be good. Lotus Petal could be a potential replacement card as well. Additional Plains are good too, if you can't afford Moxes.

Orim's Chant is the superior card, but I think Abeyance should be a 4-of in this list, considering the number of Moxes.

Crucible of Worlds is mandatory. The synergy with the rest of the deck is just too good.

Props to you, Steve. In your testing, what decks did you lose to?

Precious little, although that deserves some caveats.    First of all, I am pretty sure that the quality of my opponents was usually mediocre.  Second, even when facing quality opponents, the unusualness of my deck instigated many misplays and miscues that would lead to victories. 

I had a ridiculously high match win percentage (probably well above 80%) in my hours and hours of MWS testing.   I distinctly recall losing a match to a Workshop deck due to some play mistakes on my part.   I also split 4 games against my teammate (Paul Mastriano's Tezzeret deck.  I think I also lost an Oath match where my opponent had turn one Oath in two of three games.   

I expected this deck to get destroyed by Control Slaver, but I never ran into it.     I did play against a very skilled Drain Tendrils pilot and beat him soundly 2 of 2 in a match.   Aven Mindcensor 4TW.   

« Last Edit: October 06, 2008, 08:54:54 pm by Smmenen » Logged

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« Reply #15 on: October 06, 2008, 05:41:05 pm »

Oh wow, you don't have Goblin Charbelcher.  What happens if the opponent plays blockers and your 2/2s can't get in anymore?  Seems like STPs from Fish or Gempalm Incinerators, or worse yet Bombermen is a real problem for the deck.

I have to say, I'm not really impressed with the 4 Chant + tiny guys plan against combo decks.  I was on that plan for a long time in Bomberman against Long decks.  If they saw it coming it was really easy for them to just wait until they could Duress it away or counter it, or just draw it out and win next turn.  What happened in the matchup was that I'd play a guy that would fetch a relevant artifact, and then I'd attack for a few turns.  My opponent would laugh and do all this cool stuff.  They'd laugh at my Chant and explode all over my face, because giving combo decks 11 turns to set up is suicidal.
In other words, if combo can beat 4 Trinket Mage to get 1 Tormod's Crypt, 3 Aven Mindcensor, a reasonable combo threat, 4 Force of Will, 4 Mana Drain and 4 Orim's Chant after board, I'm not excited about your chances.

Quote
[17:33] <jet|lpt> so he plays a 2/2, his opponent uses a VT, and a fetchland, then he uses 8 chants in a row
[17:33] <jet|lpt> and his opponent is at 1
[17:33] <jet|lpt> almost got there

Stephen, Vintage MWS players are notoriously bad, worse than in every other format.  So if that's your only form of "testing", please reconsider your results.

Edit: Why do you MWS under an assumed name (T1Guy) instead of Smmenen?
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« Reply #16 on: October 06, 2008, 05:47:50 pm »

i have the same complaint two weeks running.

Flagstones of Trokair.

Flagstones + Land Tax != Combo.  There aren't even any good nonbasics other than Wastes, why bother with a Flagstones when it's a Tax deck?

you play balance, zuran orb, maybe crucible. wasteland and smokestax see play. You tell me  Wink

Not four, but I think two are needed.
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Smmenen
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« Reply #17 on: October 06, 2008, 05:48:32 pm »



Stephen, Vintage MWS players are notoriously bad, worse than in every other format.  So if that's your only form of "testing", please reconsider your results.

I disagree with the precision of your characterization (too much exaggeration and blanket generalization to be true), but I grant that many were sub-par.  That's why I tested against teammates, including our current world champion, and two-fisted tested against myself.  that's also why I tested lots and lots of games so that I could play against a range of opponents.  Importantly, I don't consider many of my "bad" opponents to be significantly worse, if at all, than you might encounter in the first two rounds of a large Vintage tournament. 

Also, you misconceive the approach.  This isn't a fish deck.   The men in this deck are lock parts that can deal damage, not the other way around. 

EDIT: if it were up to me and I had infy time, I'd win every game with Scroll Rack.

Quote
Edit: Why do you MWS under an assumed name (T1Guy) instead of Smmenen?

I almost never play under 'Smmenen' because it almost invariably leads to a conversation about whether I am 'the real Smmenen.'   It also causes people to play differently.   I havent played under 'Smmenen', with very, very rare exceptions in several years.  I almost always play under a random name, like T1Guy, Dude, or something generic like that. 

i have the same complaint two weeks running.

Flagstones of Trokair.

Flagstones + Land Tax != Combo.  There aren't even any good nonbasics other than Wastes, why bother with a Flagstones when it's a Tax deck?

you play balance, zuran orb, maybe crucible. wasteland and smokestax see play. You tell me  Wink

Not four, but I think two are needed.

To what end though?   My view is that the tiny bit of card advantage is not worth the CIP tapped.  Also, the more you play the deck you will discover that you want lots of Plains to tax for.  The longer the game goes, and it will go long, you will find that you run out of PLains to Tax up, so you actually have to conserve plains by not Taxing every one out.   

That's why I cut Mistveil Plains, which I would play before Flagstone. 
« Last Edit: October 06, 2008, 06:08:16 pm by Smmenen » Logged

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« Reply #18 on: October 06, 2008, 06:09:17 pm »

Having been a parfait player back in the day, your list made me wonder why you cut the main win condition from older versions of the deck?  I'm speaking of course of Sacred Mesa.  While I think we can all agree that Mesa isn't a very good card, it's the card that sped up the win of the deck quite a bit. 

From what I can see, this deck gives your opponent a great deal of time to find an out, no matter what they're playing.  With only 3 plows, I can see this deck having issues with Tinker > DSC (although Chant + Plow should be able to handle that), but especially any kind of Fish deck that has a dozen creatures in it.
Also, have you tested Relic over Crypt?  I would think it'd good to remove a card at a time considering the slow nature of this deck.

Thanks for the decklist though, definately interesting to see Parfait rear its head again in Vintage!
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« Reply #19 on: October 06, 2008, 09:47:03 pm »

Quote from: smmenen
Huh? You cut the best card in the deck because, why exactly?

You have to know that the philosophy behind the decks we were playing until recently was different. For example, I was playing this last August :

K-Run's Evil Parfait August 2008

1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Jet
1 Sol Ring
1 Mox Diamond
1 Chrome Mox
1 Lotus Petal
6 Plains
2 Swamp
1 Serra’s Sanctum
1 Strip Mine
4 Scrubland

2 Seal of Cleansing
1 Oblivion Ring
2 Swords to Plowshares
1 Balance

3 Duress
2 Aven Mindcensor
3 Leyline of the Void

1 Crucible of Worlds
2 Zuran Orb
1 Fastbond

1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Enlightened Tutor
2 Argivian Find

4 Scroll Rack
4 Land Tax
4 Dark Confidant

1 Bitter Ordeal
2 Painter’s Servant
1 Grindstone

Sideboard :

2 Runed Halo
4 Abolish
4 Orim’s Chant
1 Aven Mindcensor
2 Swords to Plowshares
1 Leyline of the Void
1 Righteous Aura

Aura of Silence doesn't really belong to that kind of list. Your deck looks a lot more like the 2000 version, with all its redundancy.

What Wagner pointed out is that Aura of Silence is rather weak vs Workshop decks when played as a solution rather than a threat. I mean, it's great if you can play it on first turn, but if your opponent goes double Sphere on his first turn, Aura isn't that awesome. That's why we play Seal as the default anti-artifact card. If you're concerned about Stax and the like, I suggest running 4 Abolish in the sideboard. That should do it.

Waywreth:

If you face a lot of Fish decks, you could run Pyrite Spellbomb, Seal of Fire, Seal of Doom, Vengeful Dreams, etc.
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« Reply #20 on: October 07, 2008, 12:40:31 am »

HI,

First of all, Steve, thanks for that nice article. I really enjoyed reading it, especially cause this is about a deck that is not "obviously good".
For instance, reading about the "new painter/tezzeret" list or the "new blue control/tezzeret list" or ... doesn't generally excite me. Those will be "obvsiouly good decks", with all the usual suspects to feel the first 54-57 sots, the subtility being "how to betterly use the left slots". Not saying that this is not important - it is, that's what makes the difference between a good and a very good deck - but to me, it is not very exciting to discuss if one should add 2 or 3 tezzeret, 0 or 1 voltaic key, ...
This week, you wrote about a totally different deck, using a totally different approach, I like it.

When it comes to the possible splash, I have been testing for the last 2 weeks a parfait build with a splash of green. It was pretty good, giving me access especially to 2 key cards :
- life from the loan : insane in this decks, draw engine with scroll rack, recurring waste, searching for and answer (with argivian or regrowth in hand, ...)
- tarmogoyf : allows me not to care too much about other creature and to set up an efficient clock  (it is often 6/7 in this deck)
To do that, I used the following mana base
- 4 green/white fetch land
- 7 plains
- 1 forest
- 3 wasteland
- 1 strip
With the addition of chrome mox, I am generally ok getting the color i need.
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« Reply #21 on: October 07, 2008, 08:02:48 am »

Huh? You cut the best card in the deck because, why exactly?

snip

If you have Aura of Silence out, it acts like a Trinisphere for Yawgmoth's Will.

Not to mention this list of cards:

Oath of Druids
Painter's Servant
Time Vault

What do those three cards have in common?   They are all destroyed by Aura of Silence.   

snip

Finally, Aura of Silence interacts with the mana denial elements in critical ways.

Aura of Silence also helps against one of combo's typical solutions to many other anti-Will strategies (such as Leyline of the Void or Tormod's Crypt), that of Hurkyl's Recall/Rebuild into Tendrils.  I would imagine that, along with Mindcensor, this was a key factor in your good record against Drain Tendrils, for instance, which uses this plan a lot.
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« Reply #22 on: October 07, 2008, 08:44:22 am »

Is it really stupid to consider /u for tezzeret Kill + Walk/Tral and perhaps other goodness ?
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« Reply #23 on: October 07, 2008, 12:00:14 pm »

yeah . . .  flagstones doesn't come into play tapped. it's just a legendary land that procudes W, and when it dies you get a plains. It's absurd not to run at least one.


EDIT: ok the plains comes into play tapped.
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« Reply #24 on: October 07, 2008, 03:55:14 pm »

steve tested this against me and it was a lot better than I gave it credit for.  I thought I'd be crushing it, but I ended up going 50/50.  Aven mindcensor is sooo annoying. It's mox diamond (a card that I usually think is total garbage) that makes the deck viable.  A little bit of acceleration goes a long way here. 

Plus it's really embarassing to lose to white cards.
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« Reply #25 on: October 07, 2008, 04:05:21 pm »

yeah . . .  flagstones doesn't come into play tapped. it's just a legendary land that procudes W, and when it dies you get a plains. It's absurd not to run at least one.


EDIT: ok the plains comes into play tapped.


My mistake!  I somehow thought that Flagstones came into play tapped.   Try it, let us know how it works Smile
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« Reply #26 on: October 07, 2008, 04:41:55 pm »

steve tested this against me and it was a lot better than I gave it credit for.  I thought I'd be crushing it, but I ended up going 50/50.  Aven mindcensor is sooo annoying. It's mox diamond (a card that I usually think is total garbage) that makes the deck viable.  A little bit of acceleration goes a long way here.
Without Land Tax, Diamond isn't a mana source on its own.  It's sort of like imprinting Elvish Spirit Guide on Chrome Mox.

Why is Mox Diamond so much better here than it is out of Bomberman?  For reference, it's not very impressive there; you'll get a few cards but it's expensive and doesn't stop some of the bombs like Necropotence.  I imagine you're not getting very many turn 1 Aven Mindcensors; turn 2 is about right which is what Fish and BMan generally get out.
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« Reply #27 on: October 07, 2008, 08:23:20 pm »

steve tested this against me and it was a lot better than I gave it credit for.  I thought I'd be crushing it, but I ended up going 50/50.  Aven mindcensor is sooo annoying. It's mox diamond (a card that I usually think is total garbage) that makes the deck viable.  A little bit of acceleration goes a long way here.
Without Land Tax, Diamond isn't a mana source on its own.  It's sort of like imprinting Elvish Spirit Guide on Chrome Mox.

Why is Mox Diamond so much better here than it is out of Bomberman? 

If the question wasn't framed as a comparison to Bomberman (Huh????), I might attempt an answer.   
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« Reply #28 on: October 07, 2008, 11:38:09 pm »

If the list evolves away from the 4-sets of Avens and Canonists and towards more utility instants, Isochron Scepter would have a nice home here.    It's often the most brutal play in most Parfait decks I've faced over the past few years, with the Plowshares, Finds, Chants (esp), and Red Blasts (in "Razor" Parfait which splashes red). 
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« Reply #29 on: October 08, 2008, 02:30:31 am »

steve tested this against me and it was a lot better than I gave it credit for.  I thought I'd be crushing it, but I ended up going 50/50.  Aven mindcensor is sooo annoying. It's mox diamond (a card that I usually think is total garbage) that makes the deck viable.  A little bit of acceleration goes a long way here.
Without Land Tax, Diamond isn't a mana source on its own.  It's sort of like imprinting Elvish Spirit Guide on Chrome Mox.
Not always true: if you have two lands in hand, you can play both land and mox on turn one.
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