[Free Article] So Many Insane Plays -- Meandeck Beats !

[Smmenen]

http://www.starcitygames.com/magic/vintage/17860_So_Many_Insane_Plays_Meandeck_Beats_The_Best_Deck_in_Vintage.html

Editors' blurb:

Monday, August 10th - For the last four years, Stephen has unwittingly predicted the deck that wins the Vintage Championship in his article the week before the event. With the tournament this Friday, does Stephen hold the key today? Is the deck he’s pitching really the Best Deck in Vintage? Read on the find out!

I cannot compete in the Vintage Champs this year because my sister is getting married this weekend.  But if I were to go, this is what I would play.    This deck is -- for this tournament -- one of the best decks in the format, I believe.  

Please do not ask for the decklist (there has to be a reason to subscribe to premium, after all).    I am very proud of this project, and I hope that it spawns more people to think about design in Vintage in this direction.  

[LotusHead]

Please do not ask for the decklist (there has to be a reason to subscribe to premium, after all).  

I am always confused by this.  "Decklists are not premium" is something I've heard from SCG every now and then.

I'm not asking for decklist, I blindly play my same old archetypes, but as a player, I like seeing lists, proven or not.

Congrats to your sister!

[Vegeta2711]

Add a couple of Doran and you really have made the old joke of a T2 deck with 4 Null Rod thrown in come true. 

[Marske]

Nice article and nice deck. It was a great read. Congratulations to your sister.

[BruiZar]

drawing in round 5 was a pretty dumb thing to do. otherwise a nice article. its cool to see how creature strategies are becoming more and more stronger. With the advent of creature decks, do you think Goblins can make a revival if the meta turns out to be more aggro-centric? (ie: aggro without utility)

[merfolkOTPT]

Goblins is already a good choice for the format.  It is fast enough to race Tez especially considering it runs dudes that blow up artifacts, and Workshops hate to see it.  Food chain or not I think Goblins is viable now.  The difference is that it may not be better than Dredge, afterall that deck wins on turn 3 with attacking dudes, why is Goblins better?

[Grand Inquisitor]

Goblins is already a good choice for the format.  It is fast enough to race Tez especially considering it runs dudes that blow up artifacts, and Workshops hate to see it.  Food chain or not I think Goblins is viable now.  The difference is that it may not be better than Dredge, afterall that deck wins on turn 3 with attacking dudes, why is Goblins better?

Perhaps because of games 2 and 3.

[pierce]

its worth noting that I cast ancestral and time walk in g1, and it was not enough.

I voted a call and ponder btw. At the time of my voting, so had everyone else.

[JACO]

This was a great article. This is a few cards off what I'd recommend for GBW, but overall it's pretty solid.

[Akuma]

Nice article. Although it does make sad to see how nerfed the Vintage format is. This deck would get crushed by all of my Legacy decks. So much for the power of Vintage...

[ELD]

I cannot compete in the Vintage Champs this year because my sister is getting married this weekend.

How inconsiderate of her.  Where's Brassman with the sister jokes?

[T00L]

I cannot compete in the Vintage Champs this year because my sister is getting married this weekend.

How inconsiderate of her.  Where's Brassman with the sister jokes?

Brassman is busy getting the bye.

[TheBrassMan]

I cannot compete in the Vintage Champs this year because my sister is getting married this weekend.

How inconsiderate of her.  Where's Brassman with the sister jokes?

my bad, I didn't realize I was allowed to post in this thread

[Tha Gunslinga]

Nice article. Although it does make sad to see how nerfed the Vintage format is. This deck would get crushed by all of my Legacy decks. So much for the power of Vintage...

That's because the deck is specifically built to beat VINTAGE decks.  Not Legacy decks.  So it's going to be fragile in ways that won't matter as much in Vintage, but might matter in Legacy.  Fortunately this is not a Legacy deck.

[Troy_Costisick]

Nice article. Although it does make sad to see how nerfed the Vintage format is. This deck would get crushed by all of my Legacy decks. So much for the power of Vintage...

It'd get creamed by a type 2 deck as well.  It'd probably get creamed from a M10 Limited sealed deck.  Just because a deck exists in one format doesn't mean it's well suited to any other.  That's common knowledge and apparent to anyone who looks at the facts.

-Troy

[AmbivalentDuck]

The difference is that it may not be better than Dredge, afterall that deck wins on turn 3 with attacking dudes, why is Goblins better?

Earwig Squad on turn 2, not rolling over to any cards with the name Leyline in them, and the ability to play Null Rod.

[Vegeta2711]

Goblins is already a good choice for the format.  It is fast enough to race Tez especially considering it runs dudes that blow up artifacts, and Workshops hate to see it.  Food chain or not I think Goblins is viable now.  The difference is that it may not be better than Dredge, afterall that deck wins on turn 3 with attacking dudes, why is Goblins better?

See the problem with the statement, "Goblins is already a good choice for the format." is that is isn't a good choice at all. Goblins is quite horrible and there's absolutely no excuse to play the deck over something like Ichorid if we're talking budget concerns, let alone playability.

[overseer1234]

Goblins is already a good choice for the format.  It is fast enough to race Tez especially considering it runs dudes that blow up artifacts, and Workshops hate to see it.  Food chain or not I think Goblins is viable now.  The difference is that it may not be better than Dredge, afterall that deck wins on turn 3 with attacking dudes, why is Goblins better?

I usually play red decks with wastelands, fanatics and preferably moon effects, and for some funny reason that I can't put my finger on, Ichorid really hate's to see my deck...

Goblins only misses out on the moon effects but gets one hell of a clock, engine and tutor's in return + still has the abillity to play null rod, chalice, pillar, leyline, needle, crypt,...

Ohw, and lets not forget the 5/3 tutorable beatstick with CIP Jesters Cap effect for only 3 mana...

Hell yeah Rb Goblins has enough stuf to compete.

[Mantis]

All Drain players have to is counter the Earwig Squad and you are left with an anemic clock of like 4 to 5 turns. Null Rod is a big asset Goblins has but that has more to do with the fact that Null Rod is a great card right now rather than Goblins being good.

But lets keep it a bit on topic.
In the end of the article you mention your winning streak against Shop Aggro. Could you explain how you beat the deck? I'm guessing Null Rod played a huge factor in this one but otherwise Triskelion, Solemn and Welder can all X for 1 you which seems terribly hard to deal with or did he still play with Juggernaut?

[Tempus]

In the end of the article you mention your winning streak against Shop Aggro. Could you explain how you beat the deck? I'm guessing Null Rod played a huge factor in this one but otherwise Triskelion, Solemn and Welder can all X for 1 you which seems terribly hard to deal with or did he still play with Juggernaut?

Goyf will be bigger than most of his creatures, there is Null Rod and Pridemage which both are great against the (new) Shop Aggro Lists with Trike and Sensei, etc. And if he can Waste a Shop, the mana developement is pretty even, except that his dudes are cheaper...

[Smmenen]

But lets keep it a bit on topic.
In the end of the article you mention your winning streak against Shop Aggro. Could you explain how you beat the deck? I'm guessing Null Rod played a huge factor in this one but otherwise Triskelion, Solemn and Welder can all X for 1 you which seems terribly hard to deal with or did he still play with Juggernaut?

Mark Trogdon is an expert Mono Red Workshop player with numerous top 8s to his name.  

Null Rod and Wasteland; Qasali Pridemage *4 is pretty ridic, both abilities (exalted and activated ability).  Dark Confidant generates me card advantage to stay ahead.    He played Juggernaut *4, but it was always awful since I could just block with two terrible creatures and kill it, or a Goyf and it would still survive.   Goyf is pretty insane against him.  

The only way I could see him possibly winning is if he had SOFI going.   And that would have to make it through my Pridemages and Null Rods.  

This deck is incredibly strong.   

[Akuma]

That's because the deck is specifically built to beat VINTAGE decks.  Not Legacy decks.  So it's going to be fragile in ways that won't matter as much in Vintage, but might matter in Legacy.  Fortunately this is not a Legacy deck.

It'd get creamed by a type 2 deck as well.  It'd probably get creamed from a M10 Limited sealed deck.  Just because a deck exists in one format doesn't mean it's well suited to any other.  That's common knowledge and apparent to anyone who looks at the facts.

Tha Gunslinga / Troy_Costisick - Yeah, I am well aware that the deck is built for VINTAGE. I am only expressing disdain for this type of deck. It is mostly comprised of bad cards by Vintage standards, with the hopes of landing that early Null Rod / on-the-play CotV. This format used to be about the best strategies competing against each other, now it is about almost entirely restricted list jigsaw puzzle decks vs. hate decks.

I honestly can't see how playing something like this would draw someone to play Vintage. It helps those who are broke I guess, but why play a "Beatz" deck here when you can have a better time doing it in another format, which will present you with more options and strategic gameplay. There is also the "I just crushed that guys $5k deck with this pile" wow factor, but that doesn't seem like enough of an incentive.

[JACO]

I honestly can't see how playing something like this would draw someone to play Vintage. It helps those who are broke I guess, but why play a "Beatz" deck here when you can have a better time doing it in another format, which will present you with more options and strategic gameplay. There is also the "I just crushed that guys $5k deck with this pile" wow factor, but that doesn't seem like enough of an incentive.

The incentive lies in the fact that in certain decks Null Rod is a very strong strategy. This is basically a pile of cards that lock out or restrict the opponent's options, like Stax, but without Workshops. It's a very strong and competitive deck in the hands of a competent pilot.

[AmbivalentDuck]

I am always confused by this.  "Decklists are not premium" is something I've heard from SCG every now and then.

http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=29590

The decklist is most certainly premium-only.

[Smmenen]

I honestly can't see how playing something like this would draw someone to play Vintage. It helps those who are broke I guess, but why play a "Beatz" deck here when you can have a better time doing it in another format, which will present you with more options and strategic gameplay. There is also the "I just crushed that guys $5k deck with this pile" wow factor, but that doesn't seem like enough of an incentive.

The incentive lies in the fact that in certain decks Null Rod is a very strong strategy. This is basically a pile of cards that lock out or restrict the opponent's options, like Stax, but without Workshops. It's a very strong and competitive deck in the hands of a competent pilot.

That's right.

The incentive to play this deck is not because 'oh look, I just crushed that guy with 'this pile,'' but that this deck is Sick.   It's matchups against the vast majority of the field are so lopsided you'd be silly not to consider it.   

Most people enjoy winning.   Test this against Tezzeret or Workshops.   Don't even try to play it well.  Play it sloppy if you want.  You have to work to not win.   

But at a deeper level, this deck is not a pile.  The cards in it are certainly better than the cards in most other decks in Vintage: Null Rod, Pridemage, Thoughtseize, Aven Mindcensor, Dark Confidant, even Gaddock Teeg...

These are great cards that win games.   

[Tha Gunslinga]

I honestly can't see how playing something like this would draw someone to play Vintage.

You must not enjoy winning power.  Because this deck wins power, and Fish decks have been winning lately.  Man, I'll tell you, you know one thing that draws me to vintage?  WINNING POWER BY CRUSHING SUCKAS.

That's my life in Vintage.

[AngryPheldagrif]

</thread>

[2nd_lawl]

You claim to have a postive matchup againt workshops?  I cant imagine this deck being favorable against stax on the draw.  Especially since your whole game plan is to create virtual card advantage by playing multiple threats a turn.

[AngryPheldagrif]

Also,

I cannot compete in the Vintage Champs this year because my sister is getting married this weekend.

  I want my rematch, bastard  

[Demonic Attorney]

Ben and Dan, enough with the image spamming, especially outside of Community.