[YMTCIV] Color choice

[Nefarias]

The choice of color will impact what kind of rules text our enchantment can have, so it’s important to choose carefully.

For that reason, this is one of a handful of votes where... we aren’t going to let you vote yet! We want you as a community to really discuss and talk about the options before we let you all mash the vote buttons.

When I read those lines at the end of the last YMTC article, I headed over to the YMTC thread over here looking to see if anyone had taken WotC's advice.  Instead it got ahead of itself and derailed and got locked. This may be playing with fire, but let's try this again. Keep in mind that, based on the last thread, this could be closely moderated.

So which color has the highest likelihood of producing a Vintage playable card? I think focusing on Leylines, as the last thread did, is a mistake. Every color has Vintage effects; make it free, uncounterable, and able to be played regardless of color commitment and you've got a Vintage card. In other words, any color could have a Vintage playable Leyline.

Here's a quick case for each color, off the top of my head. The "Fringe playable" section** isn't meant as a point of debate of the Vintage metagame, but rather to give an idea of the type of effect that we could see on an enchantment of that color that could reasonably affect a game of Vintage. And yes, I'm sure I've forgotten plenty of examples.

WHITE

Vintage Playable Enchantments: Stony Silence, Rest in Peace, Seal of Cleansing, Serenity, Leyline of Sanctity*
Fringe Playable/Vintage Effects: Suppression Field, Rule of Law, Moat, Opalescence, Sacred Ground, Ghostly Prison

Case: White has the most recent history of Vintage playable enchantments. For the most part, they are hosers, and are often aggressively costed. White is the color of "taxing": making things cost more. White is the "enchantment color," and gets many enchantment support cards. The abilities of many Vintage playable "hate-bears" could be put on white enchantments (Thalia, Ethersworn Canonist, Grand Abolisher, Gaddock Teeg, Aven Mindcensor, Leonin Arbiter)

BLUE

Vintage Playable: Standstill, Energy Flux, Mystic Remora
Fringe/Vintage Effects: Threads of Disloyalty, Leyline of Anticipation*, Control Magic, Dream Halls, Power Artifact, Chill, Teferi's Realm, Counterbalance, Arcane Laboratory, Propaganda

Case: By the simple virtue of being blue, a card becomes more playable in Vintage. "It pitches to Force." Blue has many powerful Vintage effects, such as card draw, library manipulation, turn taking, and artifact manipulation, to name a few. Besides arguably Yawgmoth's Bargain, it has arguably the best general-use enchantment to "cheat" into play in Omniscience. Getting Vintage players to make a blue card is an easy sell.

BLACK

Vintage Playable: Leyline of the Void*, Necropotence, Yawgmoth's Bargain, Bridge from Below
Fringe/Vintage effect: Bitterblossom, Dark Tutelage, Phyrexian Arena, Planar Void, The Abyss, Nether Void

Case:Black is the best at trading resources for others, particularly life. This can often lead to undercosted effects with drawbacks that are manageable in Vintage. At one point, some considered a black enchantment to be the most powerful card ever printed. It's the best at tutoring. Traditionally, it's the color most likely to get graveyard hate (Rest in Peace notwithstanding) if that's your MO. It's also one of two colors to not have a card already made by YMTC.

RED

Vintage Playable: Blood Moon
Fringe/Vintage Effect: Pyrostatic Pillar, Ancient Runes? Braid of Fire? Dragon's Breath?

Case:The other color to never have a card made by YMTC, and probably the toughest sell. Red enchantments often focus on amplifying damage and chaotic effects, which are rarely if ever Vintage playable. It does smash artifacts pretty good, which seemed to be a major focus of the previous thread.

GREEN

Vintage Playable: Oath of Druids, Fastbond
Fringe/Vintage Effect: Fecundity, Compost, Ground Seal, Sylvan Library, Hidden Gibbons, Enchantress's Presence? Multani's Presence? Hum of the Radix?

Case: Green has perhaps two of the three most played Vintage enchantments of all time. I didn't notice until I made the above list, but it gets a lot of triggered carding drawing. It can get fairly efficient mana ramp, but perhaps not efficient enough to be Vintage playable. Perhaps the most popular enchantment based deck of all time, Enchantress, is green. It hates artifacts more than any other color, an important quality based on the last thread.


I know my lists and reasoning are far from all-inclusive, but I hope this can get a discussion started in a positive and constructive way. Does anyone have any thoughts on which color is most likely to result in a Vintage playable card?

*Yes, I know what I said about Leylines. The effect is still interesting, even if it's the "Leyline-ness" that makes it playable.
** By Vintage Effect I mean the actual card text is something that could have a significant impact on a game of Vintage. Cards included in this category are (but are not limited to) those that have popped up randomly but very infrequently, something that makes a weird archetype possible, cards that used to be common in Vintage but have been outclassed, and cards that everyone talked about when it was spoiled but never amounted to everything. The criteria, and whether or not a certain card fits the criteria, is somewhat arbitrary and completely subjective. Not included are cards with obviously powerful effects that would never be costed for Vintage (e.g. Cast Through Time, Thought Reflection).

[Smmenen]

Fantastic post.  Much to think about.  Good job doing the hard empirical work for us. 

It seems that each color has much to offer, although red perhaps is the most limited. 

[tribet]

Don't forget Mystic Remora!

[DubDub]

White also has Aura of Silence, though that's similar to the mentioned Seal of Cleansing and Thalia.

I believe it would be easiest to make a vintage playable (non-leyline) enchantment in black, for one simple reason: another attempt at 'fixing' Necropotence could very easily be playable.  It's an effect that players from EDH/Standard/Modern/Legacy/Vintage would vote in droves for, I believe.  Imagine:

All Consuming Power Hunger 
Enchantment
Whenever you cast a spell, you lose life and draw cards equal to that spell's converted mana cost.

It's closer to 'fixed' because you're forced to continue to lose life, the only way to stop taking damage is to stop casting spells (with CMC > 0).

EDH loves that card, because the higher starting life total make life-for-card trades more favorable.  It may be kept in check in Standard/Modern by the aggressive decks.  And it's brokenness may be allowable in Legacy/Vintage without leading to dominance.

It could even be changed to work for any player, so that it becomes more high-risk high-reward.

[Wagner]

White also has Aura of Silence, though that's similar to the mentioned Seal of Cleansing and Thalia.

I believe it would be easiest to make a vintage playable (non-leyline) enchantment in black, for one simple reason: another attempt at 'fixing' Necropotence could very easily be playable.  It's an effect that players from EDH/Standard/Modern/Legacy/Vintage would vote in droves for, I believe.  Imagine:

All Consuming Power Hunger 
Enchantment
Whenever you cast a spell, you lose life and draw cards equal to that spell's converted mana cost.

It's closer to 'fixed' because you're forced to continue to lose life, the only way to stop taking damage is to stop casting spells (with CMC > 0).

EDH loves that card, because the higher starting life total make life-for-card trades more favorable.  It may be kept in check in Standard/Modern by the aggressive decks.  And it's brokenness may be allowable in Legacy/Vintage without leading to dominance.

It could even be changed to work for any player, so that it becomes more high-risk high-reward.

May I remind you that Tendrils of Agony gives you life back? That thing would be ridiculous!
I can see this:
Turn 1: Dark Ritual, All Consuming Power Hunger
Turn 2: Cabal Ritual, draw 2, cast Mox, cast Tendrils, draw 4.
So, draw 6 cards on turn 2 and stay at 20 life.

[PETER FLUGZEUG]

i voted white, mainly for two reasons:

1. I would like serra's sanctum to be a good card.

2. White has many interesting effects in enchantments, even if they're not playable at the moment. I am thinking of things like land tax/solitary confinement/island sanctuary/karmic justice/humility and many others.

[DubDub]

...

May I remind you that Tendrils of Agony gives you life back? That thing would be ridiculous!
I can see this:
Turn 1: Dark Ritual, All Consuming Power Hunger
Turn 2: Cabal Ritual, draw 2, cast Mox, cast Tendrils, draw 4.
So, draw 6 cards on turn 2 and stay at 20 life.

I am aware.  But it's also significantly harder to protect your threats with Force of Will, because, though you'll be drawing five cards, you'll be losing five life each time.

Let's say you go for that mini-Tendrils on turn two, and your opponent responds to the draw-4 trigger with Mindbreak Trap.  So you respond with Force.  Then in response to your draw 5 your opponent plays Force on your Force.  You haven't drawn cards yet, so their Force is good.  Then you draw five and lose five life before responding with another Force on their Mindbreak Trap.  They respond to your new draw-five trigger with Flusterstorm on the Tendrils.  The tendrils get countered... sure, you're up 16 cards in the end, but you're down 18! life (two from Cabal, four from Tendrils, six from each Force).

So maybe Force isn't so good in that deck?

Anyway, that wording is just meant to be illustrative of this point: it is VERY EASY to make a Vintage playable enchantment in black, if we explore approximating Necro again.  I think a Necro-lite4.0, or whatever we're at at this point, would get lots of votes too.

Leyline of Flux would be playable, and might even be 'better' for Vintage, but to be honest that card isn't coming out of this contest.  It's too narrow and too unexciting.  I can't think of a White, or Red, or Green enchantment that would get me (and what I perceive to be a large cohort of players) as excited as ACPH (or something similar) does.

[Wagner]

...

May I remind you that Tendrils of Agony gives you life back? That thing would be ridiculous!
I can see this:
Turn 1: Dark Ritual, All Consuming Power Hunger
Turn 2: Cabal Ritual, draw 2, cast Mox, cast Tendrils, draw 4.
So, draw 6 cards on turn 2 and stay at 20 life.

I am aware.  But it's also significantly harder to protect your threats with Force of Will, because, though you'll be drawing five cards, you'll be losing five life each time.

Let's say you go for that mini-Tendrils on turn two, and your opponent responds to the draw-4 trigger with Mindbreak Trap.  So you respond with Force.  Then in response to your draw 5 your opponent plays Force on your Force.  You haven't drawn cards yet, so their Force is good.  Then you draw five and lose five life before responding with another Force on their Mindbreak Trap.  They respond to your new draw-five trigger with Flusterstorm on the Tendrils.  The tendrils get countered... sure, you're up 16 cards in the end, but you're down 18! life (two from Cabal, four from Tendrils, six from each Force).

So maybe Force isn't so good in that deck?

I really don't think it is. In your example, if your opponent does Mindbreak Trap you, let him and draw 4 cards. You still have a full hand ready for next turn, 14 life and you can probably lead with a Duress that time around.

Anyway, it would be broken in other formats too as there are easy ways of sacrificing it to prevent killing yourself. Just add Perilous research or heck, Telim'Tor's Edict

While a new Necro would be interesting, I'm pretty sure we're stuck with something like Dark Tutelage and Underworld Connections, those are currently the standard.

[hvndr3d y34r h3x]

I just don't really want white. White just doesn't produce a high powered deck any time soon, which is a major draw to the format, it's the place for the most insane broken plays. Just look at rest in peace. It's an aggressively costed enchantment that has utility, basically gives you open sb slots, and has ready combo potential. It rarely sees play because the color isn't good enough yet. It seems like a bad idea to waste this ymtc on a white enchantment that might be playable years later when white gets more printings. I want something that I'm going to want to get a play set of ASAP.

When white does see play its either in bomberman, or doing prisons hate things like stony scilence. I just don't feel like the format needs another "I play this and my opponent sits there and stares at me untill I kill them" deck. Shops already does that pretty well.

What I'd really like is an enchantment that draws cards or increases card quality. Something like a better attunement maybe. I feel like viable draw engines are lacking in vintage right now (bob, jace at FOUR, standstill, and a random group of restricted spells). I'd like a consistent 4 of engine card in blue. Something to normalize the game.

[Wagner]

I just don't really want white. White just doesn't produce a high powered deck any time soon, which is a major draw to the format, it's the place for the most insane broken plays. Just look at rest in peace. It's an aggressively costed enchantment that has utility, basically gives you open sb slots, and has ready combo potential. It rarely sees play because the color isn't good enough yet. It seems like a bad idea to waste this ymtc on a white enchantment that might be playable years later when white gets more printings. I want something that I'm going to want to get a play set of ASAP.

When white does see play its either in bomberman, or doing prisons hate things like stony scilence. I just don't feel like the format needs another "I play this and my opponent sits there and stares at me untill I kill them" deck. Shops already does that pretty well.

What I'd really like is an enchantment that draws cards or increases card quality. Something like a better attunement maybe. I feel like viable draw engines are lacking in vintage right now (bob, jace at FOUR, standstill, and a random group of restricted spells). I'd like a consistent 4 of engine card in blue. Something to normalize the game.

Or... how about we give a card engine to a color that ISN'T blue and doesn't have Jace or Standstill already? I really don't see how giving blue new toys is going to help your first point of white seeing decent play anytime soon.

[hvndr3d y34r h3x]

What's the honest likely good the make a white engine? I'd be fine with any color as long as its non white and splashaeble.
You have to admit though if I want a way to draw cards that isn't triggered when an enchantment is played it is blue in the color pie. Black if I pay life, which is fine. Red is I was looking at looting, which I'd prefer not to do.

If you read my post I'm talking about how white is a waste of a vote because it'll be a while befor it's playable. I'm not down for using this ymtc for a card I can play when white is okish in 2020. I want something good right now. That is most likely blue, it's a reality of the format. Least likely vintage playable is white, also a cold reality. If you want a vintage playable pick not white. We're not designing our dream card here, or we're trying to accidentally have then print a card that's vintage playable.

[Smmenen]

Based upon what is said in the opening post, I'm inclined to vote blue.

Blue, it seems to me, gives the best chance of giving us a playable eternal enchantment that won't be over powered in other formats. 

[Greg]

A huge reason for why I continue to play Magic is due to a certain green enchantment, so I feel as though it'd be sacrilegious for my vote to go to anything other than green.

I also play Omnath, Locus of Mana as my general in EDH, so I would love to add another trick into that mix, as well.

Here's a random idea with oodles of green flavor!

Sanctuary of Gaea
Legendary Enchantment

All other green permanents you control have Hexproof.

If Sanctuary of Gaea is put into a graveyard from the battlefield, you may exile Sanctuary of Gaea. If you do, choose two: Gain 5 life; or draw a card; or return target green card with converted mana cost 4 or less from your graveyard to your hand; or search your library for a Forest card and put it onto the battlefield tapped, then shuffle your library.

[vaughnbros]

If we look back on previous enchantment printings they all fall into one of two categories.  They either a hose a linear strategy or they are pivotal piece in a particular archetype.

If we just look at some of the staples in the format:
Leyline of the Void: GY Hate.
Rest in Peace: GY Hate.
Stony Silence: Artifact Hate.
Bridge from Below:  Key card in dredge.
Standstill:  Key card in landstill.
Yawgmoth's Bargain/Necropotence:  Key card in ritual decks.
Blood Moon:  Key card in mono red.
Oath of Druids:  Key card in oath decks.
Fastbond:  Key card in gush decks.
Mystic Remora:  Storm hate.
Energy Flux: Artifact hate.
Serenity: Artifact/Enchantment hate.

I can't really see a hate card winning the vote on mechanics since people generally tend towards the flashier cards not the boring ones.  So basically our only hope is that the new enchantment becomes a pivotal piece in a new or existing archetype.

So in the end I don't think color is going to affect the play ability of the card.  The biggest and really only factor concerning the card's play ability will be its mana cost.

[A.-1.]

I'm voting for white. Land Tax was one of my favorite enchantments from back in the day. Sadly, nothing on that power level would likely get printed.

[hvndr3d y34r h3x]

I'd just like to point out that none of the non-hate functions of white enchanents is vintage playable. If your goal is to vote for something you randomly like because you like a completely non vintage playable card of that color, that's fine, your allowed to do that. Just understand that the thought process there isn't as likely to produce a vintage playable result as others.

If you want to vote for the weakest vintage color because you feel an obligation to even out the color pie one distant day int the future, that is also fine, you can do what you want with your vote. Just understand that this thought process isn't particularly likely yield a vintage playable card in the near future... Unless wotc decides to print a ton of vintage power lvl white cards out of nowhere rather imidiately, anyways. My confidence is low.

If you want a random casual card, that's fun and all, but don't use vintage as a reason to vote that way.
 

[Samoht]

I'd just like to point out that none of the non-hate functions of white enchanents is vintage playable. If your goal is to vote for something you randomly like because you like a completely non vintage playable card of that color, that's fine, your allowed to do that. Just understand that the thought process there isn't as likely to produce a vintage playable result as others.

If you want to vote for the weakest vintage color because you feel an obligation to even out the color pie one distant day int the future, that is also fine, you can do what you want with your vote. Just understand that this thought process isn't particularly likely yield a vintage playable card in the near future... Unless wotc decides to print a ton of vintage power lvl white cards out of nowhere rather imidiately, anyways. My confidence is low.

If you want a random casual card, that's fun and all, but don't use vintage as a reason to vote that way.
 

You just convinced me to vote White. Thanks.

[A.-1.]

I almost primarily play Shop decks. It makes no difference to me what enchantment color is chosen or if the card is Vintage playable.

My voting would be solely for casual reasons even though the only casual format I play is Type 4. My two favorite enchantments of all time are Cadaverous Bloom and Squandered Resources, but gold isn't an option for the vote. I'm also a big fan of Animate Dead/Dance of the Dead/Necromancy, but that's been done enough times already. So I want to vote for white with the slim hope that a Land Tax-style card gets chosen.

[vaughnbros]

So I want to vote for white with the slim hope that a Land Tax-style card gets chosen.

I think of land tax as much more of a green ability than a white one.  Regardless of color though I think that's very well a possible ability choice maybe something along the lines of oath for lands or land tax that gets a single land without the restriction of it having to be basic.

[hvndr3d y34r h3x]

I'd just like to point out that none of the non-hate functions of white enchanents is vintage playable. If your goal is to vote for something you randomly like because you like a completely non vintage playable card of that color, that's fine, your allowed to do that. Just understand that the thought process there isn't as likely to produce a vintage playable result as others.

If you want to vote for the weakest vintage color because you feel an obligation to even out the color pie one distant day int the future, that is also fine, you can do what you want with your vote. Just understand that this thought process isn't particularly likely yield a vintage playable card in the near future... Unless wotc decides to print a ton of vintage power lvl white cards out of nowhere rather imidiately, anyways. My confidence is low.

If you want a random casual card, that's fun and all, but don't use vintage as a reason to vote that way.
 

You just convinced me to vote White. Thanks.

I think you we're trying to make me mad there, good for you I Suppose. Have a nice time with your casual edh card I guess. Would have been nice to have a vintage card.

[TheWhiteDragon]

I'd actually be in favor of a "purple" mana card - or something that could be cast using any color of "colored mana".

PPP
Enchantment
Something really good.

That would make it a decent power level and playable in any color, yet could not be played off colorless sources (tomb, shop, waste, ring, crypt, etc.)

Since that won't happen though, I think anything "leyline" makes it universally playable.  There is however another mechanic that is out there that we have not mentioned - "trap"

Aura trap
2RR
Enchantment
If an opponent casts an artifact and aura trap is in your hand, you may put aura trap onto the battlefield.  Whenever a player casts an artifact, that player's opponent may destroy target artifact unless that player pays 2.

This could make any card as playable as a leyline (better even since it doesn't have to be in the opening hand)  It could have any number of effects - I just went with an artifact hoser.

[Samoht]

I'd just like to point out that none of the non-hate functions of white enchanents is vintage playable. If your goal is to vote for something you randomly like because you like a completely non vintage playable card of that color, that's fine, your allowed to do that. Just understand that the thought process there isn't as likely to produce a vintage playable result as others.

If you want to vote for the weakest vintage color because you feel an obligation to even out the color pie one distant day int the future, that is also fine, you can do what you want with your vote. Just understand that this thought process isn't particularly likely yield a vintage playable card in the near future... Unless wotc decides to print a ton of vintage power lvl white cards out of nowhere rather imidiately, anyways. My confidence is low.

If you want a random casual card, that's fun and all, but don't use vintage as a reason to vote that way.
 

You just convinced me to vote White. Thanks.

I think you we're trying to make me mad there, good for you I Suppose. Have a nice time with your casual edh card I guess. Would have been nice to have a vintage card.

If I was trying I would have succeeded with much greater potency. Your arguments are baseless and disregard evidence. To call White the weakest color of Vintage blatantly disregards Justin Kohler's dominance with UW Bomberman. Other pilots have piloted the deck to success, including myself. Rest in Peace is not inherently a hate card, as Helm of Obedience and Energy Field both interact favorably with it. I will concede that was it's intended purpose, but that doesn't mean it has to be the only use.

There are plenty of White Enchantments with Vintage relevance, I'd contend more so than Red(almost 1 and it's a hate card) or Blue(1 and almost 1 that's a hate card). Aura of Silence, Rest in Peace, and Serenity are big cards that have seen significant play in multiple archetypes. The White Leyline has significant applications against Long/Oath. Black and Green obviously have the most well known enchantments in the format.

As far as the format of card that we will see created being most relevant in, I think EDH has the highest potential as it has the lowest threshold for playability (in that mana cost is irrelevant) and it reaches the most amount of players. With that said, I find it very difficult to believe that they will specifically cater to the Vintage scene considering its small scale in comparison to say Standard or even Modern/Legacy. Their might be significant crossover in what the card does in those formats and what it can do for Vintage, but that will not be the driving force behind the card.

[hvndr3d y34r h3x]

I'd just like to point out that none of the non-hate functions of white enchanents is vintage playable. If your goal is to vote for something you randomly like because you like a completely non vintage playable card of that color, that's fine, your allowed to do that. Just understand that the thought process there isn't as likely to produce a vintage playable result as others.

If you want to vote for the weakest vintage color because you feel an obligation to even out the color pie one distant day int the future, that is also fine, you can do what you want with your vote. Just understand that this thought process isn't particularly likely yield a vintage playable card in the near future... Unless wotc decides to print a ton of vintage power lvl white cards out of nowhere rather imidiately, anyways. My confidence is low.

If you want a random casual card, that's fun and all, but don't use vintage as a reason to vote that way.
 

You just convinced me to vote White. Thanks.

I think you we're trying to make me mad there, good for you I Suppose. Have a nice time with your casual edh card I guess. Would have been nice to have a vintage card.

If I was trying I would have succeeded with much greater potency. Your arguments are baseless and disregard evidence. To call White the weakest color of Vintage blatantly disregards Justin Kohler's dominance with UW Bomberman. Other pilots have piloted the deck to success, including myself. Rest in Peace is not inherently a hate card, as Helm of Obedience and Energy Field both interact favorably with it. I will concede that was it's intended purpose, but that doesn't mean it has to be the only use.

There are plenty of White Enchantments with Vintage relevance, I'd contend more so than Red(almost 1 and it's a hate card) or Blue(1 and almost 1 that's a hate card). Aura of Silence, Rest in Peace, and Serenity are big cards that have seen significant play in multiple archetypes. The White Leyline has significant applications against Long/Oath. Black and Green obviously have the most well known enchantments in the format.

As far as the format of card that we will see created being most relevant in, I think EDH has the highest potential as it has the lowest threshold for playability (in that mana cost is irrelevant) and it reaches the most amount of players. With that said, I find it very difficult to believe that they will specifically cater to the Vintage scene considering its small scale in comparison to say Standard or even Modern/Legacy. Their might be significant crossover in what the card does in those formats and what it can do for Vintage, but that will not be the driving force behind the card.

One blue based deck, Which I already mention, what plays a bit of white doesn't mean it's not doesn't mean it's not the undisputed worst vintage color. I've mentioned everything you've said. Aside from that you've reaffirmed my point that the playable white cards hate/answer card for other decks, like oath and shop. Nothing that constitutes enough power to make a deck around. What is the likelihood the make a ymtc answer card? I suspect very low.

Bottom line white is the worst color in vintage. If you want a vintage playable white enchantment, it probably has to be insane. I feel too insane to see print. If you want to vote white to spite me, go for it. I can't stop you. Have a nice day I guess.

If to I want a casual white card fine, your allowed to vote for one. If you want a card likely to see vintage play vote blue, it ups the odds quite a bit.

[Samoht]

I'd just like to point out that none of the non-hate functions of white enchanents is vintage playable. If your goal is to vote for something you randomly like because you like a completely non vintage playable card of that color, that's fine, your allowed to do that. Just understand that the thought process there isn't as likely to produce a vintage playable result as others.

If you want to vote for the weakest vintage color because you feel an obligation to even out the color pie one distant day int the future, that is also fine, you can do what you want with your vote. Just understand that this thought process isn't particularly likely yield a vintage playable card in the near future... Unless wotc decides to print a ton of vintage power lvl white cards out of nowhere rather imidiately, anyways. My confidence is low.

If you want a random casual card, that's fun and all, but don't use vintage as a reason to vote that way.
 

You just convinced me to vote White. Thanks.

I think you we're trying to make me mad there, good for you I Suppose. Have a nice time with your casual edh card I guess. Would have been nice to have a vintage card.

If I was trying I would have succeeded with much greater potency. Your arguments are baseless and disregard evidence. To call White the weakest color of Vintage blatantly disregards Justin Kohler's dominance with UW Bomberman. Other pilots have piloted the deck to success, including myself. Rest in Peace is not inherently a hate card, as Helm of Obedience and Energy Field both interact favorably with it. I will concede that was it's intended purpose, but that doesn't mean it has to be the only use.

There are plenty of White Enchantments with Vintage relevance, I'd contend more so than Red(almost 1 and it's a hate card) or Blue(1 and almost 1 that's a hate card). Aura of Silence, Rest in Peace, and Serenity are big cards that have seen significant play in multiple archetypes. The White Leyline has significant applications against Long/Oath. Black and Green obviously have the most well known enchantments in the format.

As far as the format of card that we will see created being most relevant in, I think EDH has the highest potential as it has the lowest threshold for playability (in that mana cost is irrelevant) and it reaches the most amount of players. With that said, I find it very difficult to believe that they will specifically cater to the Vintage scene considering its small scale in comparison to say Standard or even Modern/Legacy. Their might be significant crossover in what the card does in those formats and what it can do for Vintage, but that will not be the driving force behind the card.

One blue based deck, Which I already mention, what plays a bit of white doesn't mean it's not doesn't mean it's not the undisputed worst vintage color. I've mentioned everything you've said. Aside from that you've reaffirmed my point that the playable white cards hate/answer card for other decks, like oath and shop. Nothing that constitutes enough power to make a deck around. What is the likelihood the make a ymtc answer card? I suspect very low.

Bottom line white is the worst color in vintage. If you want a vintage playable white enchantment, it probably has to be insane. I feel too insane to see print. If you want to vote white to spite me, go for it. I can't stop you. Have a nice day I guess.

If to I want a casual white card fine, your allowed to vote for one. If you want a card likely to see vintage play vote blue, it ups the odds quite a bit.

I'm not even sure that your last two sentences(maybe?) are even trying to say other than Blue is the best color in Magic(which is significantly more evident than White being the worst).

They could easily print a powerful white Enchantment. It's not like they've done it before, have they? Oh wait Enduring Renewal comes to mind. Oblivion Ring is pretty strong still. Solitary Confinement isn't blue right? What is that Moat card colored again? Is Humility a strong one? What does Worship do again? It's so hard for me to spew powerful White enchantments cards that were highly relevant in Standard or Extended at some point. Even others that still see significant Legacy play. If you want to look at the color with the most powerful enchantments across the history of magic and take off the Vintage blinders you see that White is the clear favorite for a powerhouse enchantment. 

[hvndr3d y34r h3x]

I was on my phone typos happen.

I white is definitely the worst color in vintage, ask anyone.
Your list of powerful white enchantments currently see zero vintage play, I don't knew what point your trying to make. All you've done is show me that your attempt to think of the best white enchantments in the history of the game are all currently awful in vintage.

If I was going to have to choose the most powerful enchantments in the format right now is say bargain, necro, and oath in no particular order. None of those are white, probably because white is the worst color.

[Stormanimagus]

I was on my phone typos happen.

I white is definitely the worst color in vintage, ask anyone.
Your list of powerful white enchantments currently see zero vintage play, I don't knew what point your trying to make. All you've done is show me that your attempt to think of the best white enchantments in the history of the game are all currently awful in vintage.

If I was going to have to choose the most powerful enchantments in the format right now is say bargain, necro, and oath in no particular order. None of those are white, probably because white is the worst color.

It is easy to imagine a white enchantment that could be powerful if you just step back and think about it for more than 2 seconds. Enchantments are a wide open card type ripe for abuse and if people could just start to think creatively about it they could get somewhere with YMTC. My "Freeze" mechanic, for example, could absolutely be a white mechanic. You are associating color alone with brokenness and this is a false binary based on your prejudices and not on card design principles. Tendrils of agony had a synergy when it was printed with Dark Ritual. There could easily be a white enchantment that has synergy with oh, say, serra's sanctum? Could fuel something broken when combined with Replenish/Opalessence and Leylines. It's something I tested with the card pool I had a year or two ago, and it actually had some pretty brutal openings. Was it Vintage playable? I'd have to say no. But COULD it be in the future? Hell yes. Leylines break many rules of magic and they are enchantments so I think a Leyline/utility enchantment deck could find its way into Vintage much in the way Dredge did. A deck that interacts with a different "zone" of the game than most decks (the "before we start the game" zone). Players need to think a bit more outside the box to make a great card here and I really don't think color will be that restrictive whatever is decided. I only like white cause I can see right off the bat that serra's sanctum gets a boost from that. I'm open to any color though. REALLY.

Let's start brainstorming cool new effects and mechanics and stop trying to pimp out our Necros/Bargains/hate cards etc. That's boring. Being creative is not.

-Storm

[Stormanimagus]

i voted white, mainly for two reasons:

1. I would like serra's sanctum to be a good card.

2. White has many interesting effects in enchantments, even if they're not playable at the moment. I am thinking of things like land tax/solitary confinement/island sanctuary/karmic justice/humility and many others.

Also don't forget the utility of cards like Leyline of Sanctity, Oblivion Ring and the tutor power of a card like Sterling Grove. GW Enchantments.dec with Opalessence could be pretty brutal if given the right "tipping poing" card. A deck that revolves around disruptive enchantments that could also be 4/4's is kinda a neat idea. Could even force players to consider more copies of Nature's Claim main or Trygons or even *gasp* Reverent Silence? Haha. Anyway, just my 2 cents here.

-Storm

[Smmenen]

The most played enchantment in Vintage is black.  For what it's worth. 

[Samoht]

The most played enchantment in Vintage is black.  For what it's worth. 

Oath of Druids is black?

[vaughnbros]

The most played enchantment in Vintage is black.  For what it's worth. 

Oath of Druids is black?

I think he was referring to Leyline of the Void.  I'd also imagine bridge from below is played more than oath as well.  That would put oath in 3rd.